Yamaha AS-801 vs Yamaha AS-2100

Discussion in 'Hi-Fi Stereo Systems & Separates' started by 1981rt, Jul 23, 2018.

Tags:
  1. 1981rt

    1981rt
    Novice Member

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2017
    Messages:
    37
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Location:
    Newcastle upon Tyne
    Ratings:
    +1
    Hi everyone, have spotted some good deals on the AS-2100 (£1600-ish) and wondered if an upgrade will bring me a better sounding system? My AS-801 is hooked up to a pair of KEF R300s, a Project turntable, a REL T7 sub and an Arcam Rblink bluetooth/Wireless DAC.

    I listen to records, have cd player hooked up but do most of my listening via bluetooth and wondered if the DAC in the Arcam is as good/close to being as good as the one in the AS-801? (I'm currently using the AS-801 built in DAC as I've hooked up from the Arcam (SPDIF output) into the coax on the Yamaha)

    I know the AS-2100 does not have a the tosslink/usb inputs - (or even a coax?) either just wondered if it's a much better sounding machine?

    Thanks
     
  2. Nat64

    Nat64
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2017
    Messages:
    316
    Products Owned:
    1
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    32
    Location:
    Kent
    Ratings:
    +94
    Hi ,
    I cannot say if the AS-2100 is better than the AS-801 because I have never heard an AS-801. However looking at the Yamaha web site you can see the differences in the specs and I would suggest it is better.
    Can I just say that listening via Bluetooth is quite poor quality. You can do much better than that. I certainly wouldn't compare one amp against another purely on the quality/performance delivered via Bluetooth.

    A-S801 - Specs - HiFi Components - Audio & Visual - Products - Yamaha - UK and Ireland

    A-S2100 - Specs - HiFi Components - Audio & Visual - Products - Yamaha - UK and Ireland

    I have the AS-2100 and find it superb. Paired with a set of Kef R500 and a Rel T3 sub ,so not too dissimilar to your set up.
    I am very happy. I did a lot of research and it is just my opinion but according to my ears and my wallet i couldn't find better for the money by a long way.
     
  3. BlueWizard

    BlueWizard
    Distinguished Member

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2007
    Messages:
    22,626
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Ratings:
    +4,309
    I'll echo what has been said already. While Bluetooth is fine for casual background listening, it's not the best. Though it depends on what version of Bluetooth you have. Newer version can transmit over longer distances and have better sound. But I think you would have to be at Version 4.0 or better.

    It makes more sense to add Network Streaming to your system. That way, depending on what you get, you can have Streaming Services like Spotify, Pandora, and perhaps even TIDAL, plus 20,000 Internet Radio Stations, and Streaming from local storage. And depending on the source of content, these can be at near CD quality, CD quality, or better than CD quality.

    Off the top of my head, the AS2100 is more than twice the cost of the AS801. The AS801 being the top of the Consumer line, and the AS2100 being the middle of the Audiophile line of products. That's a pretty big jump.

    I think as long as you are depending on Bluetooth as the primary source of sound, there is little need to upgrade the amp. Even switching to Network Streaming, most Streaming Services are a bit less than CD quality. Though in general they can sound pretty good.

    When you use Bluetooth are you streaming content stored from your Phone or Computer, or are you streaming from services like Spotify?

    If you want a cheap way to add Network Streaming as a test, then consider the Google ChromeCast-Audio which are about £30. This doesn't have software, but rather integrates into existing software. For example, when used with Spotify, the Spotify App will now have an options to "Cast" music, or send it to the Chromecast. I've been told if you have 2nd party software, you can expand the capabilities. But just as a simply low-cost way of trying out Network Streaming, it might be worth £30.

    GOOGLE Chromecast Audio

    Regular Streaming Device will run between £300 and £500, with Network Players running in the roughly £500 to £1500 range. Which you ultimately choose, if you choose this path, it entirely up to you.

    As an alternative, Yamaha makes Streaming Receivers which should come close to the AS801, but offer MANY more features -

    Yamaha RN803 Network Receiver, DAB/DAB+, 100w/ch, Room-EQ, Bass Management, Network Streaming, Bluetooth, etc... - £570 -


    Yamaha R-N803D Silver Stereo Hi-Fi Receiver w/ MusicCast - Streaming / Networking - AudioVisual Online - UK Home Cinema and Hifi Specialists

    MusicCast R-N803D - Overview - HiFi Components - Audio & Visual - Products - Yamaha - UK and Ireland

    Option for full Streaming Devices -

    Pioneer N30AE Network Audio Player - Superfi

    https://www.amazon.co.uk/SONOS-CONNECT-Wireless-Stereo-Adaptor/dp/B001G7PLTQ/

    Bluesound NODE 2 Hi-Res Wireless Music Streamer

    Marantz NA8005 Networked Audio Player - Superfi

    Cambridge Audio CXN Network Music Player/Streamer

    Cambridge Audio 851N Network Music Player/Streamer


    Probably one of the best deals in a Streaming Device is the -

    Yamaha WXC-50 Networking Pre-Amp - £250 -


    Yamaha MusicCast WXC50 Networked Pre Amplifier - Superfi

    WXC-50 - Overview - Wireless Streaming Amplifiers - Audio & Visual - Products - Yamaha - UK and Ireland

    This has a Switch so the output can be used as a Pre-Amp or switched to Fixed output and used as a Player. Optical In, Aux In, Network In (wired and wireless), Sub Out, Pre-Out, Optical Out, Coaxial Out.

    Just a few thoughts.

    Steve/bluewizard
     
    Last edited: Jul 23, 2018
  4. Ugg10

    Ugg10
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2009
    Messages:
    3,308
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    136
    Ratings:
    +1,649
    Worth noting that with Spotify the chromecast has a client installed on it which links directly to the net so the app on your phone/tablet/pc is only really like a remote control and can be shutdown one Spotify is up and running. There is no “streamed” data between the phone/tablet/pc and the chromecast audio device.

    Spotify needs the premium service to work (£10 per month) iirc and if you want to control it via windows you have to kick the app off and choose the playback site on an iOS/Android device but after that you can use the pc.

    Great piece of kit for £30, if you add more you can group and do whole house sync. Great YouTube video from the us doing this.
     
  5. Khazul

    Khazul
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2017
    Messages:
    1,862
    Products Owned:
    3
    Products Wanted:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    116
    Location:
    UK
    Ratings:
    +676
    Another very happy A-S2100 owner here. Kind of like @Nat64 I spent along time researching before ending up buying this, though it was always a front runner due to its functionality as well as reputation and sound.

    If you want to save money, the A-S1100 is basically the same for most purposes. the A-S2100 has a tiny bit better PSU, much better headphone amp and balanced input stages. I believe the phono stage is the same on both (and excellent). At 1650 I was reluctant, but I at 1500 and with difficulty of getting an A-S1100 at the time I went for the 2100.

    As others have said, it is kind of a shame to use it with bluettooth, but I also think its an amp that will get the best out of whatever source and speaker you connect to it. Even a crappy 128kbit mp3 still sound a lot better when the amp can exert excellent control of the speaker and deliver excellent detail. The phono stage also sounds excellent if that matters to you. it is very rare I agree with any marketing BS terms, but in this case 'natural' is a word that often comes to mind especially with the high end.

    As compared to the A-S801, I also have never heard that amp (I was only looking for amps with HT bypass capability for use with an AV system as well), so cant help there.

    I also like the look of it as well. But be warned - it is a big heavy beast nearly 470mm deep and 23Kg+ and can get quite warm, so needs decent ventilation.

    Not sure about @Nat64 and other who have the A-S1100/2100 but this thing really shines to me when you listen to it straight - ie tone controls bypassed - it just an extra level of clarity that can be very immersive even with my current relatively cheap speakers which I plan to significantly upgrade later this year or next.
     
    Last edited: Jul 23, 2018
  6. Nat64

    Nat64
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2017
    Messages:
    316
    Products Owned:
    1
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    32
    Location:
    Kent
    Ratings:
    +94
    I will second everything Khazul has said. I love my AS-2100.
    It really is good. If there is one negative/drawback for me it is that
    I just wish those VU meters were much bigger !
     
  7. 1981rt

    1981rt
    Novice Member

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2017
    Messages:
    37
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Location:
    Newcastle upon Tyne
    Ratings:
    +1
    When you use Bluetooth are you streaming content stored from your Phone or Computer, or are you streaming from services like Spotify?

    Usually these are albums already downloaded/stored on my phone on Spotify and I have Spotify at its highest resolution possible setting.

    Which is my best DAC option then - rBlink - Wireless DAC - Arcam or A-S801 - Overview - HiFi Components - Audio & Visual - Products - Yamaha - UK and Ireland

    Using the AS-801 one at the moment because I've hooked up the Arcam rblink to the digital part of the Amp via the SPDIF out on the Arcam
     
    Last edited: Jul 24, 2018
  8. Ugg10

    Ugg10
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2009
    Messages:
    3,308
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    136
    Ratings:
    +1,649
    If that is the case then, as previously suggested, get yourself a Chrome Cast Audio (CCA) for £30. Initially this can plug into the "cd" or other line level inputs on your amp or through a dac (separate or inside the amp) via an optical connections (toslink square plugs). The CCA is spotify compliant but works by connecting the CCA embedded app directly to the web via wireless through your internet router. The spotify CCA embedded app is controlled by your phone/tablet/pc (using the "other devices" menu) but no music data is transferred between the phone and the CCA only control data therefore removing the weak link in your system, the bluetooth connection from phone to amp.

    Hope this helps.
     
  9. 1981rt

    1981rt
    Novice Member

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2017
    Messages:
    37
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Location:
    Newcastle upon Tyne
    Ratings:
    +1
    Does this mean I can bomb out the Arcam?
     
  10. BlueWizard

    BlueWizard
    Distinguished Member

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2007
    Messages:
    22,626
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Ratings:
    +4,309
    The Yamaha is a 32 bit 384k DSD Capable ESS Sabre DAC -

    • USB DAC function supports 2.8MHz/5.6MHz DSD native resolution and PCM384kHz/32*bit reproduction
    • * Windows support. Mac support is 24-bit.
    • High efficiency ESS 32bit DAC (ES9010K2M)
    The Arcam is a 24 bit Burr-Brown DAC -

    • Burr Brown PCM5102 24bit DAC

    The Arcam Support Bluetooth APT-X which is an improvement, but the latest standard is APT-X-HD.

    I still think you are better off moving to Network Streaming. That would be the next best step (in my opinion), and not really that expensive when you consider the near £1700 cost of the AS2100. Then farther down the road you can consider whether you want to upgrade your amp.

    Steve/bluewizard
     
  11. 1981rt

    1981rt
    Novice Member

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2017
    Messages:
    37
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Location:
    Newcastle upon Tyne
    Ratings:
    +1
    Ok, I've got the Chromecast Audio. To make sure I'm using the DAC in the AS-801 and not the one in Chromecast can I use the Coaxial input on the digital section of the amp or will it be a better performance through the tosslink - also on the digital section of the amp? (do they both go into/utilise the onboard DAC in the same way)?
     
  12. Fred Smith

    Fred Smith
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2004
    Messages:
    2,369
    Products Owned:
    1
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    86
    Location:
    Reading
    Ratings:
    +435
    CCA only has optical output if you get a 3.5mm to optical adapter. No coaxial option.
     
  13. Ugg10

    Ugg10
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2009
    Messages:
    3,308
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    136
    Ratings:
    +1,649
    As fred says - CCA has one output port which is a 3.5mm headphone type socket. However this is a dual function port. Using a 3.5mm stereo to 2xRCA outut connected to the CD (or other line level inputs on the amp) will use the CCA dac and put analogue signal into the amp. Using a 3.5mmto toslink optical cable into the amp toslink optical digital input will use the Amp's dac.

    For the latter (digital out) you need something like this (only an example, you can go fancy and expensive but to get you going try the cheap cables first) -

    https://www.amazon.co.uk/FosPower-T...532531543&sr=8-4&keywords=3.5mm+toslink+cable

    and for the former (analogue out) -

    https://www.amazon.co.uk/Primewire-...531646&sr=1-7&keywords=3.5mm+to+rca+stereo+1m
     
  14. 1981rt

    1981rt
    Novice Member

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2017
    Messages:
    37
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Location:
    Newcastle upon Tyne
    Ratings:
    +1
    SO I can't use an optical SPDIF/optical output cable to the coax on the AS-801 (as pictured) ie the same one I'm currently using with my Arcam rBlink from its SPDIF (also as pictured)?
     

    Attached Files:

  15. Fred Smith

    Fred Smith
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2004
    Messages:
    2,369
    Products Owned:
    1
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    86
    Location:
    Reading
    Ratings:
    +435
    The Arcam rBlink has an coax output not optical. So no you can't feed coax into optical (or via versa) without an adapter to covert it. Which as your amp has both inputs would be a waste of time and money.

    You can feed optical into optical with the cable Ugg10 suggested or an standard optical cable and the adapter below (example) would also work:

    https://www.amazon.co.uk/kenable-Op...4&sr=1-8&keywords=3.5mm+toslink+cable+adapter
     
  16. 1981rt

    1981rt
    Novice Member

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2017
    Messages:
    37
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Location:
    Newcastle upon Tyne
    Ratings:
    +1
    Just using tosslink into the tv at the mo is all - but v rarely just for films etc
     
  17. Fred Smith

    Fred Smith
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2004
    Messages:
    2,369
    Products Owned:
    1
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    86
    Location:
    Reading
    Ratings:
    +435
    You could get an optical switch, CYP AUD41 works well. Or just use the CCA's DAC into the amps analogue inputs.
     
  18. 1981rt

    1981rt
    Novice Member

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2017
    Messages:
    37
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Location:
    Newcastle upon Tyne
    Ratings:
    +1
    Canny expensive that switch for what it is surely?! The CCA has quite an ordinary DAC in it compared to the AS-801?
     
  19. Fred Smith

    Fred Smith
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2004
    Messages:
    2,369
    Products Owned:
    1
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    86
    Location:
    Reading
    Ratings:
    +435
    If it does, hence why to use the switch, or get a cheaper one around £20 on Amazon.

    However I got mine brand new for just over £31 but the retailer no longer sells them.
     
  20. 1981rt

    1981rt
    Novice Member

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2017
    Messages:
    37
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Location:
    Newcastle upon Tyne
    Ratings:
    +1
    Have a Sony Bravia TV - will I be able to utilise the USB input on the amp for the TV? (Have one I'm using to connect up my laptop now and again but this CCA should mean I'm not really going to hook up directly via USB anymore much at all
     
  21. Fred Smith

    Fred Smith
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2004
    Messages:
    2,369
    Products Owned:
    1
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    86
    Location:
    Reading
    Ratings:
    +435
    According to the owners manual for my A-S501 the USB input is for a Yamaha BT adapter only (power) and audio is via the coax digital input, there is no selectable USB input.

    What does yours say?
     
  22. 1981rt

    1981rt
    Novice Member

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2017
    Messages:
    37
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Location:
    Newcastle upon Tyne
    Ratings:
    +1
    The A-S801 has USB input and the A-S501 does not? I've been hooking up my laptop directly via a USB cable for a while now
     
  23. Fred Smith

    Fred Smith
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2004
    Messages:
    2,369
    Products Owned:
    1
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    86
    Location:
    Reading
    Ratings:
    +435
    Correct it is an output only. I use it as a USB power outlet.

    In that case had better unplug the USB lead I have plugged it to my A-S501 then!

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Jul 25, 2018
  24. 1981rt

    1981rt
    Novice Member

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2017
    Messages:
    37
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Location:
    Newcastle upon Tyne
    Ratings:
    +1
    Forgive me, v much a novice and not taking the piss! - where does it go?
     
  25. Fred Smith

    Fred Smith
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2004
    Messages:
    2,369
    Products Owned:
    1
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    86
    Location:
    Reading
    Ratings:
    +435
    In the USB port marked "DC out" same on both amps. But on the A-S801 is an input / output and selectable.
     
  26. 1981rt

    1981rt
    Novice Member

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2017
    Messages:
    37
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Location:
    Newcastle upon Tyne
    Ratings:
    +1
    So it it's not considered digital ie seperated from the internal DAC on mine - and not part of any DAC on yours cos there isn't one? I bought my USB cable specifically so the DAC would be used when hooking up to a lap top etc
     
  27. tallguy101

    tallguy101
    Standard Member

    Joined:
    May 14, 2018
    Messages:
    24
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    3
    Location:
    Buckinghamshire
    Ratings:
    +9
    I bought the Yamaha 2100 today and am very happy with it.
     
  28. Khazul

    Khazul
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2017
    Messages:
    1,862
    Products Owned:
    3
    Products Wanted:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    116
    Location:
    UK
    Ratings:
    +676
    Congratz - welcome to the club - seems to be quite a few of us with A-S1100/2100 here now :smashin:
     
  29. Nat64

    Nat64
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2017
    Messages:
    316
    Products Owned:
    1
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    32
    Location:
    Kent
    Ratings:
    +94
    Welcome to the club. Let us know what you think of it /do a little review.
    Quite a few of us on here with the same kit. We can't all be wrong .....!
     
  30. BruceFlea

    BruceFlea
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2018
    Messages:
    406
    Products Owned:
    3
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    46
    Location:
    Leicester
    Ratings:
    +123
    I too have an 2100, paired with a 3050 for cinema duties.I’ve also never listened to an 801. It was the HT bypass facility that was the factor.
    Have been converting a room for cinema/music for sometime.The electronics went in yesterday,so it’s a relatively new pairing although I’ve had them separately for some while.
    Watched a couple of films yesterday and all sounds great via the XTZ cinema set up.
    Technics turntable and Sonus Faber Venere 2.5 will be going in today.
    The 2100’s built quality is second to none and setup with the 3050 was very simple aswell.
    There also lots of reviews online and the as1100 also looks to be a cracking piece of kit, although at the time of purchase almost impossible to get hold of! Like Khazul, I got a pretty good deal on the 2100 with a 6 year warranty thrown in.
     
    Last edited: Aug 4, 2018

Share This Page

Loading...