XE1 - LFE again - not sure if it is right or not

Discussion in 'Blu-ray & DVD Players & Recorders' started by JonStatt, Sep 11, 2007.

  1. JonStatt

    JonStatt
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    Okay..help me out please for I am totally confused now!

    I have an XE1 with V2.0. I have a Lexicon MC-12. I am using the 5.1 analogue outputs on the XE1. Bass management is performed by the MC-12 after analogue input so I do not need bass management from the XE1.

    I have at the moment set-up my XE1, with 0m speaker distances for everything, all speakers set to large.

    The SPDIF output is set to bitstream at the moment (I know this is contrary to recommendations).

    When I use the inbuilt calibration test tone, the LFE channel is -10dB which from reading the net is normal. But here is the interesting bit. I am using the HD DVD of Digital VIdeo Essentials, and the test tone is CORRECT. It is not 10dB too low for the LFE channel.

    So now I am totally confused if I need to change anything or not. I saw a post saying digital video essentials LFE channel was 10dB too high, but that cannot be correct either, because if I measure using the SPDIF output with dolby digital instead of the analogue outputs, the LFE channel is still correct.

    Any thoughts?
     
  2. mlankton

    mlankton
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    All I know is that I did not have proper bass management until I switched bitstream to pcm, then it worked fine.
     
  3. MadScientist

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    If you are unsure about the validity of the DVD Essentials test tones then perhaps you should find another source. A lot of DVDs have test tones buried in the setup menu.

    Personally, while I make sure the main channels are accurately calibrated, I throw out the rule book when it comes to the LFE channel and adjust it to my taste. Mine's running about 7 dB hot. Are you happy with the bass output? If not change it.

    MS
     
  4. Jeff

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    I seem to remember DVE LFE is 10db too low. I agree with Madscientist though, set it to taste. It's unlikely that you have a flat response anyway, so you would only be able to get it correct for a given frequency.
     
  5. JonStatt

    JonStatt
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    Thanks for the responses.

    In the case of my system, the MC-12 has room equalisation including sub response, so untypically, it should be correct (if you like a flat response).

    I am going to search for other test discs and compare with those and I will report back.
     
  6. JonStatt

    JonStatt
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    More experiments.

    With DVE both DVD and HD versions, if I flick my surround processor from analogue to digital, the LFE output tests results in a very similar level on an SPL meter (and yes I made sure the main speakers output is the same on both too). Interestingly, if anything the LFE output from the analogue ouputs is higher!

    Avia gave the same results.

    So in conclusion, I have not added any +10dB anywhere and it just works except for the built-in test tone on the XE1 which is 10dB too low!

    I still find the whole experience strange!
     
  7. MJeeves

    MJeeves
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    Sorry, why is this contrary to recommendations? If you have ALL speakers et to "LARGE" and the subwoofer set to "YES"... surely you don't need to change this setting from "BITSTREAM" to "PCM".

    I have mine set to "BITSTREAM" by the way. All speakers set to "LARGE" and the subwoofer set to "YES". Is this O.K.?

    Confused :confused:
     
  8. JonStatt

    JonStatt
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    I don't want to confuse anyone else!

    I think you are right that the bitstream/PCM only applies if you are doing BM in the player itself which you and I are not.

    In your set-up, did you find you needed to raise the LFE 10dB or have you found it correct as is? From all of my tests, it seems correct except the built-in test tone is 10dB too low.
     
  9. MJeeves

    MJeeves
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    Hard to say. I'm quite happy with the sound but picture has always been more important to me.
     
  10. city fan

    city fan
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    This is question that keeps popping up.

    The most authoritative answer seems to be here- these guys have done loads of testing and seem to have come up with an answer.

    http://www.avforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=528477&highlight=xe1+lfe+problem

    You need to look at post #16 for the settings.

    I've got mine as this and am fairly happy with my LFE. I listen through the analouge outs to benefit from DD+ and TrueHD, but still feel there could be something more to the LFE via them.
     
  11. JonStatt

    JonStatt
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    Thank you for that link. Most of the discussion is centred around bass management though which I don't need. I just want to make sure all of my levels are correct.

    My theory is this. The LFE output from a DVE disc should be the same whether it is through the analogue outs, or the coax output assuming that the volumes are set so that the main speakers are the same level with both.

    Fortunately on my processor, it is easy to ensure that the analogue inputs are exactly the same as the coax ones. So for these tests, I ensured with an SPL meter, that the front, centre etc are the same when I flick between analogue and coax.

    When running my tests, it really doesn't matter what the actual level is that the LFE reads on the SPL meter. It just matters it reads the same whether its analogue or coax. If it is the same then there is no issue.

    With the DVE HD DVD, I get exactly the same LFE output via analogue or coax. No difference at all. That is recorded with Dolby TrueHD

    With the DVE SD DVD, I actually have the opposite of most people, and my LFE analogue output is about 5dB higher than the coax version!

    With the DVE SD DVD played on a Lexicon RT-10 DVD player with analogue outputs, the LFE analogue output and coax match!

    So what does this tell me? It tells me that I am fine when playing Dolby TrueHD material, but possibly suspect with other sources on the XE1. Possibly with everyone complaining the bass is too low, Toshiba have introduced a new bug and the analogue LFE is 5dB too high with Dolby Digital DVDs!

    And if the above is happening, why is the test tone on the XE1 still 10dB too low for the LFE channel!

    I get the feeling this is still very messed up.
     
  12. city fan

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    I see where you're coming from, I think!

    When playing dolby digital DVD's can't say I notice that myself.

    I also think the test tones on the player are out as well.

    I'm no expert, don't even have an SPL meter, though I know I should, think we need some experts on this one because as you say it could be messed up. Come in TrevorS or others!

    Note-there is a bitstream audio firmware update due, probably after our next update.
     

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