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Would like to PJ - need advice

Discussion in 'Projectors, Screens & Video Processors' started by onefivenine, Nov 27, 2003.

  1. onefivenine

    onefivenine
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    I'd like to ask for some newbie PJ advice!

    I'd like to get into PJ, but am looking to move house in the next year so I don't want to spend a lot of money before I capitalize on this place.

    My room is 21'x11'. It will give a screen-throw (?) from the rear wall where I can site the PJ above a door - to screen of about 16' but the seating position is about 8' from the screen.

    I'd like to get a portable screen I can put up to use when the mood takes me - the TV sits in a bay-window so the PJ screen would have to sit in front of that.

    I don't have component outputs with my DV88/AVR100, so as far as I can see to keep the current setup woul mean using a dedicated S-Video connection to the PJ? Other options welcome of course!

    Can anyone help with advice or recommendations for PJ/screen/setup?

    Thanks in advance!
     
  2. buns

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    It sounds like you need a very long throw machine.....

    what do you mean by 'to screen of about 16''? Is that suggesting your screen if 16 foot wide?! :eek:

    ad
     
  3. gandley

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    wow the portable screen bit will end up been a real hassle if your PJ is in a fixed position as youll have to get the screen in the pretty much same place each time. for your throw and if u want to keep cost down id go with the domino 20 as u will as said need a long throw lens.

    Thats distance of screen to PJ of 16foot not screen size. lol i had to double look

    Oh and if the domino is too expensive then take a look at the optoma H56
     
  4. Gary Lightfoot

    Gary Lightfoot
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    Generaly speaking, the nearest you can sit to a DLP is around 1.6 times screen width for a HD2 chip model, and around 1.8 times for xga res. So, from 8ft, you will be looking at around a 5ft wide screen, and for xga, around a 4.7ft wide screen.

    Any closer, and you will start to see the pixel grid pattern, this will be worse with LCD pjs of the same res. I'll second the recommendation for the Domino 20, though even with it's long throw, I don't know if it can produce those size images from that distance. Try www.projectorsareus.co.uk for more info. Jeff can demo any Sim model for you.

    Is ceiling mounting it totaly out of the question?

    GAry
     
  5. onefivenine

    onefivenine
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    Gary, yes the ceiling's not really an option for mounting - would be too much to 'undo' when I sell the flat.

    I'm not sure that it's going to be viable after these few comments so far! I'm also concerned that a limited budget will really compromise image quality. Might be better off waiting to see what the funds are like after selling, and go a for a fixed screen and semi-decent DLP. One friend reckons even £2k's worth of PJ is going to be disappointing compared with a CRT picture, and that you need to spend about 7-8k.

    Cheers

    Dave
     
  6. gandley

    gandley
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    yes but u cant get a 6 foot wide CRT. hence the appeal of a PJ

    The best thing to do is demo an LCD PJ, Then a buget DLP such as the optoma H56 (wich delivers a great pic for the money) and a sim2 domino as well as domino 30.

    this way you will get a complete spread of whats on other at what price. Also take into consideration your room the PJ will be in. is quite bright, is there a high amount of ambient light etc.

    Even plasma is some way behind crt in some aspects and a 50ich screen will cost £6000 but be better at miday.

    at present i have a 42ins plasma for day and tv use and the PJ is used for dvd only with curtains pulled or evening to cut the light down.(screen pulls down in front of plasma) in good darkness a PJ is amazing and highly rewarding as the scale pushes the wow factor home.
     
  7. onefivenine

    onefivenine
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    Just as I'm talking my self out of it - there you go twisting my arm! ;) Yes that's exactly it.

    Back to my other question then. What are the opinions of S-Video feeds - that seems be my only option at present (or that I've figured out at least!)?
     
  8. FazerThou

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    no component out on your DV88?
     
  9. onefivenine

    onefivenine
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    yes! It has got component outputs. Good spot Fazer! I don't know what I was thinking - maybe the fact that it's non-progressive had me momentarily 'blinkered' :rolleyes:

    Do you think it would work well non-interlaced component with a LCD - say an AE100 or AE300?
     
  10. Philly112

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    Surely the Arcam 88 has component out? (maybe not).
    Anyway, your friend is talking rot! Have recently bought a Sharp ZX91E for £1700, and a DRH pull up screen. Too short a throw for your application, but no one would ever ever ever want to watch a movie on the biggest bestest CRT in the world after seeing one on this. Really! Same probably goes for any pj mentioned in this forum. So I've not got any advice for you except don't do what I did - read too many reviews, worry about crappy resolution, fret over visible panel structure etc!
    Buy one and charge your mate £5 to come over every Saturday night, as he will want to once he's seen it in action!
     
  11. onefivenine

    onefivenine
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    Well, he was taking about a Loud & Clear demo of a budget LCD PJ setup - no idea what kit was involved. He know his stuff though and I respect his opinion. He's been through Arcam and Denon players before settling on a Meridian, with a Chord RGB scart. Some people are perfectionists. Shame about the CD replay though!

    The thing is, if I'm sitting at more or less the same distance from the CRT as I would be from the PJ screen, then although it's bigger the quality will never be close. I think I need to demo some and decide if the quality compromise worth it.

    Anyone else using a DV88 or comparable with component leads and a budget PJ (and I mean well under £1k - this is going to be a temp solution if I go for it)?
     
  12. onefivenine

    onefivenine
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    OK then how about just in general, how do people with non-PAL-prog players get on with low-end LCD PJs?
     
  13. gandley

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    with an lcd its not wise to sit close to the screen, screen door will be a problem maybe not with newer lcds but with the price your looking out i wouldnt be happy. having said that an panasonic ae300 or Z1 would be ok if its a tempory measure.

    if u plan to update then i think your best just waiting save more cash get a better DLP PJ that has its own on board de-interlacers then u can feed it interlaced from your arcam 88 and have a great pic

    optoma h56 = £2200, i have this at present till the new marantz is released. its a cracker for the money.

    Domino20 £3750 the best in its price range and true 16:9 would be ideal for your application. this has a pic of a £6000 PJ and would be an ideal match for your DVD player.

    i realy would advise u to wait. i think u will be dissapointed with a cheap LCD
     
  14. Gary Lightfoot

    Gary Lightfoot
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    "OK then how about just in general, how do people with non-PAL-prog players get on with low-end LCD PJs?"

    Use a PC with a DVD rom drive, Radeon graphics card and a sound card with spdif out for full DD/DTS and extended formats. It's often refered to as a Home Cinema PC (HTPC).

    The advantage of the HTPC is that the output is progressive via the VGA, and that it also acts as a good scaler, something that low end pjs don't often do very well.

    If you don't mind building and messing around with tweaking a PC (and occasionaly pulling your hair out), it's by far the best picture you'll get.

    There's an HT1000 going for £2000 in the classifieds, so don't just sit there.... :)

    Gary.
     
  15. gandley

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    HT1000 for £2000 bargain, one hell of a machine for that price
    settle,settle, settle
     
  16. onefivenine

    onefivenine
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    Gandley, I think you're right and I should wait till I'm ready to get a decent setup.

    Gary, I've started looking at the HCPC forum but I'm not sure that's the right route for me. I've built a few PC's - ok I'm no MCSE - but it sounds too much like being at work! (I work in IT).
    Am I going to get the same sort of DTS/DD sound quality from a PC as I get from my Arcam?
     
  17. Gary Lightfoot

    Gary Lightfoot
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    I haven't been able to compare the sound I'm getting with an Arcam, but it is easily comparable with more middle of the road players I've tried.

    HTPC isn't everyones cup of tea, but not many people are aware of the quality they can deliver at a very cost effective price. That's why I like to mention it, just in case it's something that will suit.

    Gary.
     
  18. onefivenine

    onefivenine
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    I'm definitely interested and will be keeping an eye out and reading up. What would be a ballpark price for a 'from scratch' home-built machine? I'm due a PC upgrade next year anyway so it would be worth my while taking the HCPC option as a serious consideration.
     
  19. Gary Lightfoot

    Gary Lightfoot
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    A basic DVD playing HTPC can be built for around £250 not including software. This would be something like a Radeon VE or 7000, SB 4.1 and a cheapy AMD motherboard (I used a ECS K&S5A for 2 years) with a 1.3 Duron (or less, but 950s are hard to find for instance). 128meg should be fine, as will any hard drive.

    For Hi Def playback such as T2 Extreme, something like a 2600+ CPU will be needed, along with 256meg or more of memory. The Radeon 9600 non pro is an improvemnt on the lesser models due to its better mpg deblocking in hardware mode.

    You may want a nicer case, and quiet components, so that's something else you can look into as well. :)

    HTH

    Gary.
     
  20. gandley

    gandley
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    gary i didnt think T2 high def could be played back in uk due to the microsoft nonsense
     
  21. Gary Lightfoot

    Gary Lightfoot
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    You have to set up a proxy server so that it looks as if you're applying for the license from the US. It's a bit fiddly but doable according to those who've done it. There's a step by step how-to over at avsforum, or I could dig out the link if you can't find it. I'm sure I have it somewhere.

    Gary.
     
  22. Peter Baker

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    If at all possible, I would try and go for a mid range DLP over the LCD. I had a Panasonic PTAE100, and, whilst it did give a great overall picture, I found the screendoor, and generally soft image began to annoy me.
    I changed to an Infocus 5700, and am absolutely delighted with the result. More 3D picture, blacker blacks, no screen door, and a punchy sharp picture quality. I'm sure the Sim, or the NEC would be broadly similar, with some improvements, and some drawbacks with each.
    By common consent the Infocus is the brightest, and therefore most suitable for those with ambient light problems. The NEC has the best blacks and contrast, plus a smoother picture, and the Sim has arguably the best picture of all when properly set up, but is dimmer.
    I would use any of these with a standard non-progressive feed from your Arcam, as I do from my Arcam FMJ DV27. The faroudja processing they all share is well up to the job.
    If, on the other hand, you go for the Panasonic, then I would urge you to output prog scan to it. IT makes an enormous difference, making the picture far more watchable. MY Arcam could output PAL prog scan by pressing a few code numbers on the remote. I would think that yours is the same.

    Whatever you do - just do it!!
    You will not be disappointed. Nothing compares to a 7ft screen.

    Regards
    Peter
     
  23. RTFM

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    Whatever you do - just do it!!
    You will not be disappointed. Nothing compares to a 7ft screen.

    Regards
    Peter [/B][/QUOTE]

    How about a 9ft screen ?:laugh:
     
  24. Peter Baker

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    Good point - though I fear we are descending into 'my *** is bigger than yours' territory!!
    BTW, do you (as acknowledged expert) agree with my broad brush comparison of the merits of the NEC Sim and Infocus?
     
  25. RTFM

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    Peter, being very familiar with all three projectors, yes they all have their strengths and weaknesses.
    It's up to the individual to weigh up each one's pros and cons as to which will suit his or her needs best.
     
  26. onefivenine

    onefivenine
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    I need the £350 upgrade to DV88P to get a PAL Prog board fitted - that's on the to do list...

    Do the AE100/Infocus/NEC PJs not accept progressive scan?

    Just wondering why you're not taking advantage of the PAL Prog output of your DV27. Care to swap internal boards...? ;)

    Cheers
    Dave
     
  27. Peter Baker

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    I've compared the picture using prog scan and interlaced into the infocus, and really see no discernible difference.Using interlaced, the faroudja in the PJ does the work, and seems well capable. Nevertheless, I think I'll hang on to my board for future developments. Thanks for the offer though...
    Best wishes
    Peter
     

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