Why I’m not upgrading (now)

Nick72x

Established Member
Joined
Nov 26, 2020
Messages
91
Reaction score
33
Points
21
Age
51
Location
Malaysia
I bought a Meta Quest 2 recently and it’s been amazing!

I played and loved Red Matter and Red Matter 2, and this was enough to convince me to buy a high end PC and play Half Life Alex, DCS VR and BoneLab.

I’m loving VR and can’t ever go back playing games on a monitor, but I’ve looked around and I don’t see a potential upgrade for the Quest 2, here’s why.

PICO 4: Looks to be slightly better than the Quest 2 in most of the important aspects, but overall not a significant improvement.

If I didn’t have a headset already I’d buy the PICO 4 for sure, but not to replace the Quest 2.

HP Reverb G2: Tempting for the big increase in resolution and sharpness. Really tempting for Sim racing and Flight sims (seated games), but reports suggest the G2 has the worst in class controller tracking, Windows Mixed Reality is dead, and while a tethered [tie (an animal) with rope or chain so as to restrict its movement] option may be acceptable for seated games, I’ll never have a tethered headset as my daily driver.

Valve Index / Varjo Areo / Pimax 8K: I could go into detail on each of these, but they all fail for me by only offering 6dof with base stations and being tethered headsets. I’ve talked about tethering above, and bare in mind I’m getting zero noticeable latency / frame drops with Quest 2 Air Link, and can’t personally see any drop in graphics fidelity (over Quest 2 tethered).

Yes base stations offer best in class tracking, but the massive inconveniences of base stations (setup time for play space relocation being the most important), is just not worth the minor improvements over good inside out tracking.

As for the near future, I’m not too hopeful:

Quest Pro: I can’t see it offering much for the following reasons.
1) Development focus is for AR and social apps, not gaming.
2) High cost will mean low user base and games will not be developed to take advantage of the potential of eye tracking and foveated rendering.

Sony PSVR2: Looks like this will be a beautifully balanced package in terms of technology / price, but for me the tethered headset kills it. I’d also be concerned that serious sims will never come out on a PlayStation format, so it will never be my daily driver. If it turns out you can use the PSVR2 for PCVR titles (which I doubt) I might reconsider, but even then it could only ever be my second headset due to the tether.

We will have to see what the Quest 3 and the Pimax Crystal finally deliver, but I’m not that hopeful about either.

What I want in a new headset (in order of importance)
1) untethered with inside out tacking.
2) minimum 2160x2160 1200 dpi resolution @ 90fps
3) eye tracking with foveated rendering
4) fully supported by AAA and Independent developers
5) PCVR capable

It’s not much to ask, but I see nothing in the pipeline that’s going to deliver this any time soon.

What are you looking for in your next headset?
 
Wireless but an effective tether to my gaming PC and that it sucks up no more of my personal data than is necessary.

So I'm looking forward to Pico 4 because...

1. It's untethered with inside out tracking
2. 2160x2160 res with an impressive FOV
3. Eye tracking and foveated rendering isn't worth the cost to most consumers right now
4. Fully supported via Steam VR and the Rift store
5. Virtual Desktop wireless tether to my gaming PC is looking good.

@Nick72x your situation is obvs unique to you. So you do you, don't upgrade now ;)
 
Last edited:
Wireless but an effective tether to my gaming PC and that it sucks up no more of my personal data than is necessary.

So I'm looking forward to Pico 4 because...

1. It's untethered with inside out tracking
2. 2160x2160 res with an impressive FOV
3. Eye tracking and foveated rendering isn't worth the cost to most consumers right now
4. Fully supported via Steam VR and the Rift store
5. Virtual Desktop wireless tether to my gaming PC is looking good.

@Nick72x your situation is obvs unique to you. So you do you, don't upgrade now ;)

Agreed, we all have different requirements and value different features.

I’ll explain why foveated rendering is so important to me.

I just bought an PC with:
Intel i7 12700K cpu
Gigabyte RTX 3080Ti OC 12GB GDDR6 gpu
32GB 5600mhz ram
1TB Samsung 980 Pro SSD

…. And it’s not powerful enough to run HLA in Ultra mode, or DCS VR without turning down a lot of the graphics options.

Don’t get me wrong it works great, but it’s still a compromise.

I’d love for a future generation headset that doesn’t need a PC, but it’s going to be a long time before they can fit better specs than my current pc into a headset.

The obvious answer for me is foveated rendering.

Early claims for the PSVR2 suggest it’s getting a 4X graphics quality / frame rate improvement due to foveated rendering.

I don’t see a better / more cost effective way to increase VR capability.

[edit:] I should clarify when I say untethered I include Air Link / Virtue Desktop as untethered. You refer to this as Wirelessly Tehthered but it’s semantics, we are referring to the same thing. For now I’d be delighted with foveated rendering wireless PCVR.
 
Last edited:
I bought a Meta Quest 2 recently and it’s been amazing!

I played and loved Red Matter and Red Matter 2, and this was enough to convince me to buy a high end PC and play Half Life Alex, DCS VR and BoneLab.

I’m loving VR and can’t ever go back playing games on a monitor, but I’ve looked around and I don’t see a potential upgrade for the Quest 2, here’s why.

PICO 4: Looks to be slightly better than the Quest 2 in most of the important aspects, but overall not a significant improvement.

If I didn’t have a headset already I’d buy the PICO 4 for sure, but not to replace the Quest 2.

HP Reverb G2: Tempting for the big increase in resolution and sharpness. Really tempting for Sim racing and Flight sims (seated games), but reports suggest the G2 has the worst in class controller tracking, Windows Mixed Reality is dead, and while a tethered [tie (an animal) with rope or chain so as to restrict its movement] option may be acceptable for seated games, I’ll never have a tethered headset as my daily driver.

Valve Index / Varjo Areo / Pimax 8K: I could go into detail on each of these, but they all fail for me by only offering 6dof with base stations and being tethered headsets. I’ve talked about tethering above, and bare in mind I’m getting zero noticeable latency / frame drops with Quest 2 Air Link, and can’t personally see any drop in graphics fidelity (over Quest 2 tethered).

Yes base stations offer best in class tracking, but the massive inconveniences of base stations (setup time for play space relocation being the most important), is just not worth the minor improvements over good inside out tracking.

As for the near future, I’m not too hopeful:

Quest Pro: I can’t see it offering much for the following reasons.
1) Development focus is for AR and social apps, not gaming.
2) High cost will mean low user base and games will not be developed to take advantage of the potential of eye tracking and foveated rendering.

Sony PSVR2: Looks like this will be a beautifully balanced package in terms of technology / price, but for me the tethered headset kills it. I’d also be concerned that serious sims will never come out on a PlayStation format, so it will never be my daily driver. If it turns out you can use the PSVR2 for PCVR titles (which I doubt) I might reconsider, but even then it could only ever be my second headset due to the tether.

We will have to see what the Quest 3 and the Pimax Crystal finally deliver, but I’m not that hopeful about either.

What I want in a new headset (in order of importance)
1) untethered with inside out tacking.
2) minimum 2160x2160 1200 dpi resolution @ 90fps
3) eye tracking with foveated rendering
4) fully supported by AAA and Independent developers
5) PCVR capable

It’s not much to ask, but I see nothing in the pipeline that’s going to deliver this any time soon.

What are you looking for in your next headset?

Great news. Happy to see you're enjoying your purchase.

The G2 would offer a quantum leap in visuals and especially audio fidelity where the Q2 is D-tier.

The Index is far superior in regards to controller complexity, finger tracking, refresh rate, tracking quality, FOV (especially vertically). But it does have the achilles heel of having awful display panels like the Q2 (easier to stomach given the Quest's price tag.. not so much the Index's) and it requires base stations so isn't versatile.

The Aero is great but doesn't seem consumer friendly and for its price tag, the audio solution is non existent.

The Q2 Pro seems like a VR headset with all the right features and quality of life improvements for a non-gamer but apart from display resolution, nothing tangible for a gamer to qualify its bigger price tag. For social media and AR integration, it'll likely be phenomenal. For gaming, its meh.

The PSVR2 indeed does look like the only true gamer focussed next gen VR headset which has been announced/teased/revealed.



What I want in a new headset (in order of importance)
1) untethered with inside out tacking.
2) minimum 2160x2160 1200 dpi resolution @ 90fps
3) eye tracking with foveated rendering
4) fully supported by AAA and Independent developers
5) PCVR capable

I'd like to add that to that:

1. High-end audio
2. OLED
3. much bigger FOV
4. next-gen VR capabilities - e.g. haptics, sound, etc.


Overall, I think aside from the PSVR2, VR is very very very very stale. Especially given the lack of software and games newly released. Our only hope is Sony to push the envelope given Valve will likely concentrate on the Steam Deck's success now as that platform will push far more software sales.
 
Love my quest but will be adding the new psvr to use with my PS5 looking forward to see how it compares.
 
I'm still happily using my Vive Pro with Index controllers. It's big and clunky and probably partly responsible for the neck issues I'm currently experiencing, but I just can't give up those lush OLED panels.

The Aero is probably the only current-gen headset I'd consider upgrading to, I just wish it came with integrated audio.
 
I'm still happily using my Vive Pro with Index controllers. It's big and clunky and probably partly responsible for the neck issues I'm currently experiencing, but I just can't give up those lush OLED panels.

The Aero is probably the only current-gen headset I'd consider upgrading to, I just wish it came with integrated audio.
g2?
 
I bought a G2 (original version) for my brother, tried it out on my system first to compare. And while yes, it's certainly clearer than the V Pro, the colours looked washed out and didn't have that wow factor I get when I put on the Pro. It wasn't for me.
 
I’m a few weeks further into the VR hobby and, as I’m learning all the time. I’d like to amend my next headset wish list.

PCVR has become my first priority for flight sims, racing sims, and larger titles with enhanced graphics - HLA of course, but also for the superior graphics offered by PCVR over the stand alone tiles (Red Matter 2, Myst, BoneLab, etc..)

1) Display Port connection - PCVR capable
2) untethered with inside out tacking.
3) minimum 2160x2160 resolution with 35+ pixels per degree, 90hz
3) onboard dynamic foveated rendering (requires eye tracking)
4) fully supported by AAA and Independent developers

And yes, until a new technology (WiFi 7?) improves data transfer rates, I do want both air link and display port.

If I had to buy a PCVR headset today I guess I’d buy the G2 v2, but it’s $750 USD in Malaysia and far from my ideal headset.

Fingers crossed for the Pimax Crystal or even the Shiftall MeganeX.
 
I just bought an PC with:
Intel i7 12700K cpu
Gigabyte RTX 3080Ti OC 12GB GDDR6 gpu
32GB 5600mhz ram
1TB Samsung 980 Pro SSD

…. And it’s not powerful enough to run HLA in Ultra mode, or DCS VR without turning down a lot of the graphics options.

Mind me asking how much this cost?
 
Mind me asking how much this cost?
RM12'400, Around GBP2300 (2600USD)

[edit]
And then dispite the thread title I bought the Reverb G2.

I played a bit of HLA back to back on the Quest 2 then G2, and really the Quest 2 doesn't get enough credit. Yes the G2 has a shaper picture but It's not that different - and the Quest 2 running wirelessly through air link is far more enjoyable than the G2 through cable.

I'll never use the G2 for room scale.

The G2 comes into its own with Microsoft Flight SIM for me. The cable is less annoying when seated and the display port takes a significant load of the PC GPU which translates to greatly improved performance.

For titles like HLA where performance is not the limiting factor, you're better off with the Quest 2.
 
Last edited:
RM12'400, Around GBP2300 (2600USD)

[edit]
And then dispite the thread title I bought the Reverb G2.

I played a bit of HLA back to back on the Quest 2 then G2, and really the Quest 2 doesn't get enough credit. Yes the G2 has a shaper picture but It's not that different - and the Quest 2 running wirelessly through air link is far more enjoyable than the G2 through cable.

I'll never use the G2 for room scale.

The G2 comes into its own with Microsoft Flight SIM for me. The cable is less annoying when seated and the display port takes a significant load of the PC GPU which translates to greatly improved performance.

For titles like HLA where performance is not the limiting factor, you're better off with the Quest 2.
Good to see ur enjoying VR with ur new setup.

I'm waiting for the right moment to buy a 13900k/4090 build and couple it with either a G2/Q2 like yourself or a Pimax 8KX ... or just go all-in with the Pimax Cystal if it ever releases.
 
Good to see ur enjoying VR with ur new setup.

I'm waiting for the right moment to buy a 13900k/4090 build and couple it with either a G2/Q2 like yourself or a Pimax 8KX ... or just go all-in with the Pimax Cystal if it ever releases.

I was playing Elite Dangerous on the G2 last night, and Fallout 4 on the Quest 2 this morning. I’m loving both headsets. I’m also really happy with the PC as I lean heavily towards PCVR titles.

I’m watching the Pimax Crystal but I might leave it several months after launch to buy it, dependent on good reviews. The combination of the G2 and Q2 mean I’m not in a desperate rush, and I can’t help but notice that Pimax made several significant upgrades to the 8K as it matured into the 8K DMAS.

I also want to be sure that the WiGig module is functional and available
 
I was playing Elite Dangerous on the G2 last night, and Fallout 4 on the Quest 2 this morning. I’m loving both headsets. I’m also really happy with the PC as I lean heavily towards PCVR titles.

I’m watching the Pimax Crystal but I might leave it several months after launch to buy it, dependent on good reviews. The combination of the G2 and Q2 mean I’m not in a desperate rush, and I can’t help but notice that Pimax made several significant upgrades to the 8K as it matured into the 8K DMAS.

I also want to be sure that the WiGig module is functional and available

How much did you get the G2 for?

My personal issue is for the price of a G2 + a Q2, I can buy a higher end VR headset with a bit more cash like the Pimax's which is why I'm a bit reluctant.

TBH I have little motivation to go back to VR gaming for a while until the game library and software is sorted out or the headset quality. I was not happy with the Valve Index and neither the Q2 or G2 are quantum leaps ahead of it.


The 8kX DMAS would be the only pimax model I'd get.
 
How much did you get the G2 for?

My personal issue is for the price of a G2 + a Q2, I can buy a higher end VR headset with a bit more cash like the Pimax's which is why I'm a bit reluctant.

TBH I have little motivation to go back to VR gaming for a while until the game library and software is sorted out or the headset quality. I was not happy with the Valve Index and neither the Q2 or G2 are quantum leaps ahead of it.


The 8kX DMAS would be the only pimax model I'd get.

I paid 650GBP / 750USD for the G2.

I’m not interested in the Pimax 8K.

My next headset Will have what the Pimax Crystal is promising:

140dg Field of View
35+ pixels per degree
Fast wireless PCVR without compression.
Resolution 2880 x 2880 per eye.

If the Crystal delivers on its promise I’ll buy it, otherwise I’ll wait to see if the Steam Deckard, HP G3, PICO 5, etc.. can tick off this list.
 
I paid 650GBP / 750USD for the G2.

I’m not interested in the Pimax 8K.

My next headset Will have what the Pimax Crystal is promising:

140dg Field of View
35+ pixels per degree
Fast wireless PCVR without compression.
Resolution 2880 x 2880 per eye.

If the Crystal delivers on its promise I’ll buy it, otherwise I’ll wait to see if the Steam Deckard, HP G3, PICO 5, etc.. can tick off this list.


Really? The 8KX KDMAS looks like a clear upgrade on the G2 and as next gen upgrade. Just sad about the software situation tho. I think the new GPUs can finally power it.

I found one second hand for £550. wish Id pulled thr trigger.
 
Last edited:
Really? The 8KX KDMAS looks like a clear upgrade on the G2 and as next gen upgrade. Just sad about the software situation tho. I think the new GPUs can finally power it.

I found one second hand for £550. wish Id pulled thr trigger.

I’m seeing the 8K DMAS available for $1200, I don’t have lighthouses, or Steam controllers, so there’s another $350-500.

So while the 8K DMAS can be considered an upgrade on the G2 I don’t think it’s worth $1550-1700 for a cable tethered pcvr headset, when the next generation of headsets appear close to dropping and are likely to have fast wireless connection options. Just look at the Crystal specs vs the 8K.

That said if you can pick a used unit up for £550 and have lighthouse stations already, that’s a very different situation.
 
I’m seeing the 8K DMAS available for $1200, I don’t have lighthouses, or Steam controllers, so there’s another $350-500.

So while the 8K DMAS can be considered an upgrade on the G2 I don’t think it’s worth $1550-1700 for a cable tethered pcvr headset, when the next generation of headsets appear close to dropping and are likely to have fast wireless connection options. Just look at the Crystal specs vs the 8K.

That said if you can pick a used unit up for £550 and have lighthouse stations already, that’s a very different situation.


I think someone on ebay was selling the headset for £550, the light houses would have cost another £100, then either steam VR controllers for £200-300. Thats about the same as a Q2/G2 both. Really tough decision.


Yeah the Crystal looks great. I'm definitley interested to buy it. I'm just thinking more for the interim period. I wasn't that impressed by the Index. The Q2 will be inferior but wireless, the G2 should be better resolution wise but much worse FOV wise - tough spot for VR.

The Crystal looks awesome on paper - but god knows when Pimax will start shipping them.

I hope Valve drop a headset but given the Steam Deck success - I'm not sure. Valve didn't even release the other 2 promised VR games - god they annoy me so much.


TBH I just hope someone hacks the PSVR2 to be PC compataible. that would be enough for me for a few years gievn its higher resolution and most importantly OLED! and haptics in the headset. and HDR!
 
I think someone on ebay was selling the headset for £550, the light houses would have cost another £100, then either steam VR controllers for £200-300. Thats about the same as a Q2/G2 both. Really tough decision.


Yeah the Crystal looks great. I'm definitley interested to buy it. I'm just thinking more for the interim period. I wasn't that impressed by the Index. The Q2 will be inferior but wireless, the G2 should be better resolution wise but much worse FOV wise - tough spot for VR.

The Crystal looks awesome on paper - but god knows when Pimax will start shipping them.

I hope Valve drop a headset but given the Steam Deck success - I'm not sure. Valve didn't even release the other 2 promised VR games - god they annoy me so much.


TBH I just hope someone hacks the PSVR2 to be PC compataible. that would be enough for me for a few years gievn its higher resolution and most importantly OLED! and haptics in the headset. and HDR!

If your really into racing / flight sims and can’t wait for a next gen HMD to drop you’ve only got three choices: G2 , 8K or Varjo Areo. I went with the G2 mainly on price as I see it as a interim / hold over solution.

… but I’m having so much fun playing HLA, Resident Evil 7 (although it does scare the crap out of me) and Fallout 4 on the Q2 right now. The Q2 comes into its own when matched with a high end PC, I think it’s massively underrated. I’ll probably get Skyrim, which I’ve never played, next, and I’m hopeful Hubris will deliver on its promise.

If I could only have one headset for life and had to choose something on the market today - for me it would be the Q2. I’d take it over the Aero because wireless PCVR is that much of a game changer for me.
 
Since getting my Q2 I have never touched my G2.
The convenience of wireless and the easy of use and set up is just far better than starting up Windows, starting up Steam, starting up WindowsVR, starting up OpenVR before even launching a game, then messing around with settings to get things looking right and then only having a cord to ruin the experience too is just nowhere near as fun.

With the Q2 I fire it up and launch a game and that’s it. It works first time every time.

I will upgrade when something better comes along but it will be standalone and wireless that’s for certain.
Whether Meta or not has yet to be decided, but will see what is available as they are released.
 
Last edited:
If your really into racing / flight sims and can’t wait for a next gen HMD to drop you’ve only got three choices: G2 , 8K or Varjo Areo. I went with the G2 mainly on price as I see it as a interim / hold over solution.

… but I’m having so much fun playing HLA, Resident Evil 7 (although it does scare the crap out of me) and Fallout 4 on the Q2 right now. The Q2 comes into its own when matched with a high end PC, I think it’s massively underrated. I’ll probably get Skyrim, which I’ve never played, next, and I’m hopeful Hubris will deliver on its promise.

If I could only have one headset for life and had to choose something on the market today - for me it would be the Q2. I’d take it over the Aero because wireless PCVR is that much of a game changer for me.
Since getting my Q2 I have never touched my G2.
The convenience of wireless and the easy of use and set up is just far better than starting up Windows, starting up Steam, starting up WindowsVR, starting up OpenVR before even launching a game, then messing around with settings to get things looking right and then only having a cord to ruin the experience too is just nowhere near as fun.

With the Q2 I fire it up and launch a game and that’s it. It works first time every time.

I will upgrade when something better comes along but it will be standalone and wireless that’s for certain.
Whether Meta or not has yet to be decided, but will see what is available as they are released.

Makes me think I should get a Q2. How does the wireless work?

My current gaming room has too much stuff in it. Triple OLED moniors 55 etc... just feels like a disaster waiting to happen in terms of hitting something so being able to play wirelessly in the big bedroom next door which only has a fireplace seems like a no brainer. Any thoughts? what do u need to get the wireless up and running well?

i have a bit of a big house so my wifi upstairs isnt super strong. just using a bt homehub .. any thing i need to buy?
 
Since getting my Q2 I have never touched my G2.
The convenience of wireless and the easy of use and set up is just far better than starting up Windows, starting up Steam, starting up WindowsVR, starting up OpenVR before even launching a game, then messing around with settings to get things looking right and then only having a cord to ruin the experience too is just nowhere near as fun.

With the Q2 I fire it up and launch a game and that’s it. It works first time every time.

I will upgrade when something better comes along but it will be standalone and wireless that’s for certain.
Whether Meta or not has yet to be decided, but will see what is available as they are released.

The Q2 is great for room scale, but can’t quite c cope with the overly demanding nature of flight sims such as DCS and MSFS, so I got the G2 to cover those titles and Elite Dangerous. This is where the G2 shines and the cable is not a problem.

For everything else I use the Q2 Air linked to PCVR.

Makes me think I should get a Q2. How does the wireless work?

My current gaming room has too much stuff in it. Triple OLED moniors 55 etc... just feels like a disaster waiting to happen in terms of hitting something so being able to play wirelessly in the big bedroom next door which only has a fireplace seems like a no brainer. Any thoughts? what do u need to get the wireless up and running well?

Air Link works great as long as you have plenty of overhead on your PC rig, plus WiFI 6.

My set up is PC in the upstairs office, physically cabled (blue RJ45) to a Deco M4 mesh, which is WiFI 6 connected to the master Deco M4 (approx 25ft directly down) in the living room. The master Deco M4 is cabled to my fibre modem.
 
Wireless PCVR was a breeze to set up for me.
It worked amazingly well in my lounge where my Ubiquiti dream machine is, and looked great.
The issue was I hit the ceiling light once playing Golf so decided to go into my kitchen where all the lights are in the ceiling.
The reception is not quite as good there but not tried PCVR in there yet.
 
The Q2 is great for room scale, but can’t quite c cope with the overly demanding nature of flight sims such as DCS and MSFS, so I got the G2 to cover those titles and Elite Dangerous. This is where the G2 shines and the cable is not a problem.

For everything else I use the Q2 Air linked to PCVR.



Air Link works great as long as you have plenty of overhead on your PC rig, plus WiFI 6.

My set up is PC in the upstairs office, physically cabled (blue RJ45) to a Deco M4 mesh, which is WiFI 6 connected to the master Deco M4 (approx 25ft directly down) in the living room. The master Deco M4 is cabled to my fibre modem.
Argh ... I cba switching out my current home hub 2. I have all my automated curtains for my cinema room and harmony remote all programed with the alexas. :(

I might still buy one just to test it out but i think given the Index didn't leave me satisified, I'm probably sadly going to have to wait for the next generation of headsets.

I think I got burnt out by VR and since seeing 4K/3D gaming passive OLEd.. I find it harder to go back (altho i still appreciate VR has much much better immersion). hopefully game library will improve too by then.
 

The latest video from AVForums

Is 4K Blu-ray Worth It?
Subscribe to our YouTube channel
Back
Top Bottom