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Why cant we all just get along?

Discussion in 'General Video Gaming Chat' started by Iain Shields, Dec 6, 2001.

  1. Iain Shields

    Iain Shields
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    Pretty much all I seem to be reading on this forum lately is alot of people argueing like children about which console is best, alot of people full of their own importance spouting endless technical drivel that means next to nothing if the developers themselves dont take advantage of it and alot of people too ignorant to realise that we are about to experience possibly the best time to be "playing computer games"...

    Everyone has their own tastes in games and in different features that every console offers, choose the one which suites you best, be proud of it, enjoy it and by all means talk about it but please do not let your passion for it lead you to putting down others who do not feel the same way that you do about it.

    I do not mean to cause offence to the many people who have talked intelligently and passionatly about their console nor to the others who have been doing what I have said above...

    Please just realise that this is a time to be celebrating not argueing... :)

    Thank-you for reading,
    Iain.
     
  2. alanrob

    alanrob
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    Very sound advice m8. :)

    I'm away back to GTA3 :D (Who needs sleep?)
     
  3. Duncan

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    Iain- I do not believe anyone has been put down, there have been merely differences of opinions, which is good as if we all agreed the forum would be very boring and I for one would not learn anything new as I would already know it.

    True endless technical jargon is irrelevent to the games- but when people quote these numbers without any idea about what they actually mean (the SuperComputer cut and paste from the NVidea site being a good example) I cant help but point this out, as Im sure others would If I was spouting crap (as Im sure I do!).

    As for a great time for games- I disagree, considering the amazingly powerful machines at developers disposals the games themselves are more disappointing than ever, never before has there been such a dearth of original games.

    Im not saying there arent many, but they just do not sell and are few and far between- whether this is because they are not promoted as much as bankers such as franchises, licenses and ongoing series' etc or whether the public just dont like them.

    I remember with the Speccy and C64 the problem there was with substandard film tie-ins and arcade conversions- this seems to have come back but with sequals, fps and rts clones ad infinitum and yearly updates of sports games. All of which the public or the casual gamer seems happy to chew up.

    This is the reason many of us on this forum love Nintendo- because however childish they may seem there games are always different and innovative. Id love a reason to buy Xbox, but it doesnt do anything different, nothing special- Ive got a PC and the few extra special games we may get on Xbox will be released on PC and the best so far-Halo- is more suited to PC anyway as no Joypad yet gives as satisfactory interface to any FPS as a keyboard and mouse. Even the games on Xbox LOOK like PC games- how a console and platform (PC) with so much supposed 3D power produces such average looking games, Edge actually commented on this in its initial GameCube review by noting that whether GameCube is the most powerful console or not GC games dynamic lighting give GC games a vibrant look that makes them look unique and unlike anything on any other platform. Compare Fifa 2002 on GC, PS2 and PC and the startling light FX and unique depth of field effect on GC make it look much more like a real football game than its competitiors. The depth of field effect being particurlarly neat- it has to be seen to be believed, the crowd effects in the other versions are unconvincing and cardboard like in comparison.

    Oops, Im getting techy again! Anyway what Im trying to say is that Id love an Xbox, but nothing has got me going yet- even Halo which Ive now spent about 15 hours on my mates XBox is good but not the revolutionary game Half Life or even Perfect Dark was. Ive owned every major console since I first got a Megadrive and SNES even the Sony ones (even though I think Sony ruined the games industry by making quantity count over quality) as I had to have ISSe and Xbox is the first console Ive yet to bother to import.

    Im sure this is because I have a PC and the undeniable fact that Xbox is a PC in a box without a Windows interface- I fear that because of this the games will not be of the ilk that console gamers demand- those quick fix fun arcade games that dont tie up the lounge TV for hours and hours. After all you wouldnt dare play PC games like Championship Manager, C&C on a TV- my wife would kill me if I couldnt disappear to my "office" to play these!!!

    Contrary to what Im sure people think- I do hope Xbox succeeds, as since the sad demise of the DC (why didnt they go head to head with Sony?! Sad especially in the light of PS2 not being quite as powerful as Sony claimed!) there is room for a 3rd console but Microsoft should not compete with Sony and Nintendo, they are not competitors- Sony now have a loyal fanbase to compare with Nintendos, I cant see many Windows NT fans buying a console because NT is a stable (well sometimes) platform!! LOL!

    But please lets not agree on these things, if we did Id worry as we wouldnt have that certain passion for these plastic boxes- especially as we are adults who dont want to let go of what are essentially toys.
     
  4. pointon

    pointon
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    Hope this isn't aimed at me...

    The last thing I've been doing (and I hope I haven't come across this way) is undulging in a bit of the old games-mag-mailbox syndrome of 'Mine's better than yours!'.

    Every system is going to have pro's and con's. Every system is going to have great games and dire games. Every system will be worth having. Three awesome next gen consoles all out at once (four if you count the Dreamcast, which ahem.... I still do). Can be nothing but good.

    I haven't seen anyone be put down at all. What I've read has been worthwhile commentary and opinion. Granted, some of this may at times be misinformed... but being more the philosophical sort than the technical, this really doesn't bother me.
     
  5. Iain Shields

    Iain Shields
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    When I said about not putting people down, this was more of a hope that it would not start to happen, not me saying that it has started to happen, sorry about not being clear on this...

    Also don't get me wrong about people talking about the specifications of a console, the information that has been expressed here has been very helpfull to me and I'm sure many others as the various companies tend to leave out alot of these details when quoteing their own statistics... It is things like the Nvedia quote mentioned above that annoys me, an inaccurate quote only posted to try and start a "games mag" type arguement, lets keep it adult people please.

    Finally, my thought on us entering what could be the best time for computer gaming I think is a valid one, I'm not saying it has happened but I'm sure nobody could deny that the opertunity is there for the taking...

    Thanks for the above replies, I have enjoyed hearing your views :)

    Iain.
     
  6. Duncan

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    Nah- the reply wasnt aimed at anyone, although I was getting a tad annoyed at being labelled a Nintendo Fanboy by certain unamed people!!!!!

    BTW if you have got a PC- try the demo of Return to Castle Wolfenstein, the game is outstanding!!!! Its the first demo of a FPS that has tempted me to buy the full game since Deus Ex- which I actually started replaying last night (as depending on your decisions the game plays differently and takes different plot turns). Replaying Deus Ex has further reinforced my feeling that Halo is vastly overated- as even though Id completed the game the AI kicked my ass within 2 mins of restarting, one bad sniper shot and the guards were on me like flies. In comparison the "superb" AI in Halo allows you to shoot and miss from distance with enemies walking around seemingly oblivious to my presence!!!! A trait that Soldier of Fortune unfortunately had but only when shooting from looooong range.

    BTW Pointon did you get your Dreamcast? Its such a shame Sega didnt try and challenge the "might" of the PS2 headon, as comparison of games that exist on both platforms tend to be more technically accomplished on the DC- this is said to be due to the PS2 having very little texture memory, so although it can manipulate polys dead quick it can 'paint' them with very little variety- one reason that many PS2 games with highly detailed graphics tend to have quite boring use of colour and textures. Metal Gear Solid II is a very technically demanding game but is very grey- the game subject and setting makes this excusable but games such as Soldier of Fortune, Perfect Dark and Goldeneye show you can have military type shooters with bright varied graphics.

    Finally (phew!!!) one reason I also slate Xbox is because of the failure of DC in the face of PS2s perceived technical superiority- yeah games are the main thing, but in this case the public was wowed by Sonys hype machine, many of my workmates own PS2's because they perceived it as the most powerful of the two- as even though good software has been few and far between on PS2 many bought it on the premise that once the developers mastered the machine the sky would be the limit. This even when many had seen some of the brilliant games already available of Dreamcast. Im sure there is a parallel with Xbox and Gamecube here somewhere.

    Its such a shame that many of them have only just realised how good Dreamcast is and have belatedly got one- maybe Sega shouldve dropped the price a year ago? Chu-Chu Rocket has even replaced ISS evolution and Mario Kart 64 as the favored post pub game- if you havent got it get it, its only a fiver from toys r us.
     
  7. annefromuk

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    Oh dear, looks like the Xbox = Super Computer thread upset a few people.

    Usually when I cut and paste info I add my own opinion (and also mention it has been quoted from somewhere), but for some reason I did not for that thread.

    Although I would not say the Nvidea quote was 'an inaccurate quote'.

    Also I have not once slated the other consoles, I have only mentioned what the Xbox can do, plus I have never called anyone a fanboy/girl

    Anne
     
  8. Duncan

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    Dont worry Anne- I wasnt referring to you!

    And yes the word I should have chosen instead of inaccurate was misleading, as the NVidea site did mislead you by choosing a well know maker of supercomputers but forgetting to mention that they were comparing it to a near 20 year old product.

    Although this does show the quantum leaps we have made in desktop computing power in the last decade- especially considering Intel chips are far from the quickest or cleverest of CPUs!

    God knows what we will have in another 5 years let alone another 20!:p
     
  9. alanrob

    alanrob
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    Sounds like everyone is getting on again :)
    So can we put this "my consoles better than yours" to bed now ?

    Duncan, as you know I have a PS2. I didn't get one for it's technical merits (or lack of), but for it's games. Some of which I think are the finest games I've played since the good old days on the C64/Spectrum.

    Anyway, back to GTA3 (or maybe THPS3 this time :) )
     
  10. Taz

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    Well said all... there is no reason for petty arguments to start over 'one' persons biased views. Do we see this on other posts... eg in the amps section... my Yamaha is better than your Dennon... even though i haven't got one yet!!.... No! we dont and never have done (untill recently anyway) As the 'man' says lets keep it friendly, as I for one dont want to get 'chucked out' for arguing with someone over something so stupid.

    Have a nice day!


    Taz.:cool:
     
  11. chicken balti

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    As an outsider looking in can I just say that my 1.4gHz Athlon, GeForce 3, Sonic Fury, 512Mb, 30Gb ATA100, DVD, CDRW, Force Feedback, Flatscreen LCD, PC is most definitely more expensive than any of your consoles;) ;) ;)
     
  12. pointon

    pointon
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    Not so... My first Megadrive once caught fire and burned down my house. That was one expensive console.
     
  13. Duncan

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    Why does everyone seem against arguing? Just had to say- an arguement is simply a difference a views, its not like anyones had a blazing row over this.

    Please keep arguing!!! This place would be very boring without differences of opinion!!!

    As for PS2, - I had one until I sold it about 3 months ago, mainly because of substandard software- true there are a couple of gems but as with the much criticised N64 these are few and far between.

    Funnily enough the lack of good software criticism of N64 was levelled mostly by PSX users and supporters- whilst the N64 owners were smug in the knowledge that Legend of Zelda, Perfect Dark, GoldenEye, Mario64, F Zero, Mario Kart 64, Diddy Kong Racing et al are some of the finest games ever made on any format.

    I dont think anything on PS2 has hit those heights yet- GTA3 is certainly good, as is GT3 (although the pop up is unforgivable) and Metal Gear Solid is guaranteed gold, plus PES is the finest football game known to man.

    The problem Sony have though is that they marketed PS2 as an all powerful console which was a huuuge mistake- PSone winning over N64 showed that the most powerful console doesnt always win. Well when we got the expansion pack it showed that, hmm whose idea was it to have stunning 3D performance but then provide a tiny amount of RAM for textures?!?

    Actually that makes 2 mistakes Nintendo made with N64 that Sony ignored and made with PS2. Talk about markets being cyclical- as we now look to have Nintendos (well in USA and now JAP with the launch of Super Smash Bros) cheep and cheerful console looking to take over from PSone. No wonder Sony have already announced PS3.

    Plus the worst thing Sony did: Make PSone games run on PS2.

    Why? Well you see all those games reviews that say that a PS2 title looks just like a PSone one? Well it doesnt take a genius to work out that some titles in development for PSone have been very quickly ported to PS2- which has resulted in an incredible amount of awful software for PS2.

    This is a huuuge problem for Sony- as unlike a discerning gamer who will simply just choose the good and great games- the casual gamers who made the Psone the best selling console that it was will be deterred as the console will gain a reputation for not living up to Sonys hype- as many people were disillusioned by Nintendo after N64.

    Personally I dont give a **** if a console is powerful or not- Ive bought my fair share of turkeys, even a Saturn- but it really winds me up when press and ads from Sony and Microsoft hype up the power of their consoles.

    In comparison at the GameCube launch a Journalist asked Miyamoto what was so special about Gamecube in the face of competition from Xbox and PS2. His reply:

    "Its nothing special, just a little purple cube that plays the best games in the world"

    I doubt anyone who has played any Nintendo classic will disagree about that!
     
  14. pointon

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    Techincal details mean squat to me. I base my judgements on game quality. That's why my fave console of the moment is my new Dreamcast (wonderful!). That's also why I only bought a PS2 a few weeks ago when I realised that GTA3 and Pro Evo were about to be released.

    Gamecube is an immediate must have as was the N64. Always catered for by games from the off. Looks like I'll be waiting a long time for a reason to spend money on an XBox (and it won't be that much money Mr Gates!).

    You might be able to tell, I don't have a favourite. I prefer to have a few decent games on every console, rather than give one my patronage and settle for a few great games and a load of merely adequate titles. So I'm not really one to argue with, as I'm more likely just to agree with everyone. I still want everyone to give the XBox a chance, and I still think Nintendo need to revamp their image to suit their awesome gameplay.

    As for arguing, there's not much point to a forum without it. But it's got to be constructive, inpersonal and relevant.
     
  15. Obuggrit

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    I haven't noticed any harsh fanboyism on these boards. There's a touch of "epenis"ery, but it's far less apparent than on other boards I've been on.

    XCubestation sucks though
     
  16. MrBlofeldt

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    Well all I've got to say is, the PS2 is a poop games console, but makes for a great cheese grater ! :laugh:
     
  17. BlueOrange25

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    Too right. I only wish i had the money and time to play all the games I want to out there. I'm still hoping for a universal platform that will let you play all the games on the market. :smashin: I think we're very lucky to be a part of the gaming community at the moment. So many games...like I said, the only problem is/should be finding the money and the time.
     
  18. MrBlofeldt

    MrBlofeldt
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    The thing I'm hoping for is when someone figures out how to allow cross-platform online gaming, imagine that ! being able to play whatever incarnation of Pro Evo on your XBOX# against someone with a Nintendo ?Cube

    fab ! :thumbsup:
     
  19. Iain Shields

    Iain Shields
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    Quite right, if you look at the date this was first posted, it was then that I felt the gaming section was heading the way of most other gaming forums and felt like having a ( little over dramatic :D ) rant about it... Fortunately the mods were allready on the job cutting out the garbage and laying down a few guidelines which made my rant redundant in the first place... Well done mods :smashin:

    Regards,
    Iain.
     

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