Why aren't t.v's set up correctly?

Discussion in 'General TV Discussions Forum' started by silent lucidity, Aug 10, 2003.

  1. silent lucidity

    silent lucidity
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    After using these forums for the last 8 months or so one thing has become very clear to me.It would seem that manufacturers don't set their t.v's up correctly before they leave the factory.Surely this is a dis-service to the customer?Why on earth should people have to go into the service menu to correct things?It's bad enough that they always come with things like contrast set too high,but when they don't even set the geometry correctly it's a very poor show.It's a strange paradox these days when we have so much innovative technology coupled to very low quality control.Just something to chew on :mad:
     
  2. owenw

    owenw
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    I was angry too when I first read about the geometry and that they overscan the image as a matter of course. The reasons, as always, are cost-related.

    What they do is set one TV up with a reasonable image in the factory, add some tolerance values for the variance between sets, and then use the same settings on each set as it comes off the assembly line. Hence the dubious term "factory settings."

    If they were to setup each TV individually the cost would become prohibitive. Imagine the number of engineers needed and how long it would take to adjust each set! An army of engineers for this task would be a costly investment for any TV manufacturer. This cost would naturally be passed on to the consumer.

    How many of us would buy 32" or 36" TV's if they cost £8000 or more?

    I feel that AV dealers should be made aware of the adjustments necessary and set up TV's before selling them. My dealer couldn't even tell me how to get into the service menu! And they never sent a service engineer out as promised despite several calls! :mad: I certainly won't be buying from them again. :thumbsdow

    Dealers would be doing themselves a favour, instead of sending an engineer out to an irate customer, their reputations would improve, generate more sales, get repeat custom, keep customers happy, etc., etc.

    Just my 2 cents,

    OwenW
     
  3. Gordon @ Convergent AV

    Gordon @ Convergent AV
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    Well, the earths magnetic field is different throughout the world and this will affect geometric setting of TV's so it's unlikely it's ever going to be dead on out of the factory.

    Colour temperatures are wrong to make the things look more impressive in showrooms. Colour decoders are wrong to try and mask the fact the temperature is at a billion degrees and everyone would look blue if they didn't push red on the decoder....

    Contrast is cranked up for same reasons. Make the thing look brighter and more standout from the crowd.

    If you think we have it bad though go to an RS shop in USA. Last time I was there they had there TV's at MAX colour and contrast and the folk on teh screen looked like they were standing in some nuclear blast zone...scary.....

    G
     
  4. silent lucidity

    silent lucidity
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    I can fully appreciate the factors for geometry Gordon.But as for deliberately setting contrast etc too high for the showroom,that's unforgivable.Why not send out "showroom specified" sets and set the ones going into stock properly? :suicide:
     
  5. LV426

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    When you buy a car, part of the process involves the dealer performing a PDI, which includes setting various things up properly.

    Same if you buy a bike.

    NOT the same if you buy a TV.......

    IMO, this is one of the things you should get, for your money, when you buy from a bricks and mortar retailer. The 'never knowingly over-sold' empires of DSG and Comet (et al) should EARN their huge margins in exactly this way.
     
  6. silent lucidity

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    That's the kind of thing it needs,although I shudder to think what would happen in the hands of the likes of C****'s and D****'s :rotfl:
     
  7. lynx

    lynx
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    How about including a video setup disc and instructions to use it. Or is that too simple ?
     
  8. jayjay

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    Now that's a great idea. Unfortunately it wouldn't stop the dealers going hell for leather and trying to "out-contrast" themselves on the showroom floor.

    I'm looking for a new TV now and all of the dealers (bar one) have been completely shocking. I'm surprised they manage to sell a TV's at all - they all look so awful. TV reception in most cases is completely hopeless and if you ask them to set a DVD player up, they'll sneer and then use composite connections! Ummm gee that doesn't look that great...

    I was at one dealer last week and the guy couldn't get a picture from the DVD that was plugged in. He was getting really embarrassed and I kinda felt for him and said "don't worry mate just go get an svideo cable and we'll plug it in through the front jacks" - "what's an svideo cable". Right I'm off. Thanks :p

    Jay
     
  9. owenw

    owenw
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    I like your idea lynx, although I'd rather the disc was included for the end-user to use too! :) Probably asking too much since a lot of service menu controls can damage the components in your TV, best not to let your average Kevin Public (Joe's brother) near this.

    What exactly IS this "S... Video" cable you speak of jayjay? :devil: :laugh:

    I know what you mean, the "Can I help you, sir?" sales guy turns all nasty when you ask them anything about the TV specs or for a demo with a DVD player. "Sorry sir, we can't disconnect the TV's"

    And another thing ::[engaging rant mode level 2]::
    why are the latest TV's coming out with all the "cool" features we wanted 10 years ago. I have a TV with PIP, PAP nexTView EPG, FastText with blah blah page memory, Smartlink to VCR, VideoPlus, PDS etc etc.
    I only watch TV through a Sky Digibox so PIP/PAP and VideoPlus are pointless (as is set top box control from the VCR), the VCR is about to be junked for a DVD-R, SKY has it's own digital text service (of sorts), nexTView isn't support here anyway. Why don't they spend the money on improving PQ instead of adding out dated features?

    ::[ends rant due to overheating]::

    Think I'll lie down in a darkened room for a while.... :D

    OwenW
     
  10. jayjay

    jayjay
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    Careful Owen :D

    The other thing I hate (while I'm here) is when the guy insists on demonstrating just how loud the TV is :p

    "Yeah great sound isn't it - that's crystal clear that is!"

    "Ummm yeah, but I don't need the sound. It'll spend it's life with the sound down actually, I already have 5 speakers for that. I'd rather not have to pay for those 12 speakers and twin subby in the back of that TV if I had the choice..." :D

    Jay
     
  11. lynx

    lynx
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    Thats what i actually meant :blush:
     
  12. Nobber22

    Nobber22
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    My local dealer (and they are higher-end than Richer Sounds/Curry's/Etc) has his store setup all wrong. The telly's are setup in the bright front section by a huge window, so it is impossible to compare them properly. He has another darker area at the back of the shop which would be perfect, but here he has speaker stands and subs on display. :rolleyes:
     
  13. GadgetObsessed

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    Has anyone tried getting professional calibration on a CRT?
    How much does it cost and is there anyone offering such a service in kent?
     
  14. lynx

    lynx
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    An enterprising sideline perhaps. :)
     
  15. fatbob

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    I don't hold out much hope of ever seeing well setup tv's in dealers showrooms, even if good advice or calibration services were available to them.

    In my local Comet, I noticed that a Toshiba PF2 had a dvd player connected to it, so I asked the assistant if I could have a fiddle with it's settings, and surprisingly (for this particular branch) he said yes.

    I put the PF2 into the picture mode that disabled SVM, and reduced the sharpness until ringing disappeared, but as I began to reduce the contrast, the assistant began to comment over my shoulder that I wasn't setting the tv up properly (?) and that everything needed to be set much higher.

    When I'd finished, the tv looked much better (but the dvd player was set to composite, and as the assistant wouldn't get it's remote, I couldn't change it to RGB or S-video), but when I gave the remote back, the assistant began to increase contrast, sharpness etc. back to about 90%.

    I think any attempt to educate store staff on how to set these tv's up properly would be like banging your head off a brick wall.
     
  16. hornydragon

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    I set mine up as properly as i canfor display but the nightmare is getting sources in a showroom!!!!
     
  17. owenw

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    LOL, sorry, jayjay I couldn't resist! :D

    A setup disc would be very useful to enthusiasts who want to get the most out of their screens, but I wonder how many people would bother using it? I can see the disc being thrown out with the carton (along with the manual, cables etc.) by your average buyer.

    Another way would be to build in some test patterns into an "advanced" or even "initial setup" menu on the TV, with instructions on-screen.

    Shouldn't be difficult/costly to implement with the low cost of memory these days.

    Are there any good calibration discs available? I only ever used the THX thingy that came on T2 / StarWars.

    OwenW
     
  18. Rojo Habe

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    This one is supposed to be quite good; I've not gotten around to buying it myself yet, but I probably will one day.

    I used the THX thingy off the Star Wars disc in my local hifi shop when I was auditioning a Loewe telly. When I'd finished, the dealer looked in astonishment at the improvement to the picture and said "Right, I know what I'll be doing when I get home!"
     
  19. hornydragon

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  20. lynx

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