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Why Alien 3 is a very pants movie.

Discussion in 'Movie Forum' started by Jeff, Feb 13, 2001.

  1. Jeff

    Jeff
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    Please bare with me because I haven't seen it since it was first release at the cinema.

    1) Right from the start they kill off all the survivors from Aliens except Ripley.

    2) The only characters that you give a **** about are Ripley and the maybe doctor. The rest are low life scum.

    3) Half way through the movie they kill off the doctor.

    4) OK we still have Ripley, but no they then let you know that Ripley has a chest buster inside her. Er, how, when...?

    5) We now have the final third of the movie, everyone that you ever cared about is dead and you know Ripley is going to die.

    6) No final surprise at the end, Ripley does die.

    7) The end.

    Alien3 should have been a great movie like the first 2, but some very critical story line errors were made.




    [This message has been edited by Jeff (edited 14-02-2001).]
     
  2. tee

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    I don't think it's anywhere near as bad as people say it is - OK it doesn't come close to the first 2 but then they are exceptional films. I'm a big fan of Fincher and I think he did a good job considering what he was working with, the film looks fantasitc and has a very dark feel to it which I really like. I don't think it worked purely for the s*it British cast and the ending which is really, really poor. You've gotta love those chases through the corridors though.... [​IMG]

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  3. Ars longa, vita brevis

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    8) no guns makes for a very dull picture, give the humans half a chance and add a little excitement rather than a two hour stalk 'n kill film

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  4. PoochJD

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    Jeff,

    I have to agree with Tee. "Alien 3" is one of those movies that at first watch, seems awful, but when you watch it again, a while later, it doesn't seem half as bad.

    You have to bear in mind, that it went through loads of rewrites, and several different people were connected to it, before Fincher did it. At least, that's what I've read and heard.

    Admittedly, they should have kept Newt and Bishop, but then again.....

    Also, every Alien movie has been very distinct, and different. "Alien" was more of a horror/sci-fi film. "Aliens" was a high-tech action thriller, with a hefty dose of sci-fi overtones, whilst "Alien 3" was more of a drama, with horror overtones.

    Pooch
     
  5. desade

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    I actually quite like Alien 3, despite its faults. Aliens was going to be a hard act to follow whatever Alien 3 was like, though.
     
  6. Stuart Wright

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    Alien 3 was plagued by the same problems as The Island Of Dr Moreau - i.e. the project was go, but important people (e.g. director) and the script were changed inappropriately.
    There were possibly some real restrictions on Fincher and all he could do was make the most of a bad job.
    Compared to the other two, Alien 3 was crap because, yes, you didn't care about anyone except Ripley, and you just knew there wasn't going to be a happy ending. Also both movies I have mentioned show how casting English people with English accents and giving them American dialogue just doesn't work.
    I thought Resurrection was good, though.
     
  7. MacReady

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    When Alien 3 was first released it was pretty much slated by everyone....until Seven and then Fight Club came along and all of a sudden LOADS of people were singing Alien 3's praises purely because it was a 'Fincher' movie.

    I am not having a go at the people who genuinly found it a good film but rather at all the people who are just wanting to be seen as fans of the latest 'in fashion' director.

    I personally have mixed views about Alien 3. I think if they had used the origonal cut of the movie it would have been better and made much more sense (and more importantly had fewer plot holes). I also hated the way the whole basis behind the second films plot progression (Ripleys saving Newt) was destroyed in the first few minutes of 3 by killing Newt and Hicks. I realise that Carrie Henn had obviuolsy aged and so it would have been awkward, but surely they could have worked the plot around that.
    The other major fripe I had was that all the inmates were so faceless. Ridley Scott managed to make the Nostromo crew familiar in Alien with very little character development and so did James Cameron in Aliens, but Fincher introduces a large cast and by the end of the movie we still have no idea which of them survived and which didn't.
    The film HAS grown on me over the Years....it looks gorgeous and oes manage to creat a very tense atmosphere on many occasions, but overall I felt it was a let down and a wasted opportunity to further the Alien mythos witha more origonal story.

    Just my two pence worth....

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  8. Ars longa, vita brevis

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    what about further alien fims

    i'd like to see more of them, i think that a very interesting universe has been created where not everyone's nica and happy and people are still greedy. I'd like to see more of that massive alien as found in that spaceship. Apparantly aliens were GM/created beings and not naturally evolved hence their excellent faculties/properties.
    I'd also like Cameron to diredt it as i love the huge sets he uses for films, i love hugeand well thought out sets.

    I am, however sceptical of sequels and another would probably destroy the series.

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  9. General Skanky

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    I'm ok with it now. Thought it was absolute sh*te when I first saw it.
    Won't go out of my way to buy it or anything, but a watch on sky is ok.
    At least it didn't have such an 'oh so scary wubber monster' at the end like Alien 4!

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    [This message has been edited by General Skanky (edited 14-02-2001).]
     
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    The one thing that I think we all can agree on is that even if Alien 3 was a good or a bad film, Alien Ressurection was absolutely terrible! Agreed?
    Neil

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  11. MacReady

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    If they had just based the last two movies on the Dark Horse comics then they would have been onto a couple of superb movies.

    In a way the fourth does go some way to try and capture a little of the storyline used in the comics (military using humans to breed aliens), but then ruins the whole thing with the silly alien at the end.

    Whatever happened to the Aliens vs Predator movie??
    If they got that right it would be one hell of a film !!!

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  12. tee

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    The 4th Alien film was ruined by a) the **** ending b) the **** ending and c) the REALLY **** 'new' alien in the **** ending.

    I can't tell you how dissapointed I was because much of that film is actually quite good.

    Yeah, and I would LOVE to see an Aliens vs Predator movie as well [​IMG]

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  13. RMCF

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    Just to agree with what has been said with most posts here. I was a big fan of the 1st two films and was disappointed at first with Alien 3 when I saw it in the cinema. However, it has got better with each viewing since. I believe that it gets slated unnecessarily, mainly due to its being compared with Aliens. It is a different type of film to this, which was basically an all-out action flick. I think that Alien3 returned to Alien in style, with its claustaphobic feel.
     
  14. ptmbradley

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    I would've walked out of Alien 3 at the cinema if I wasn't there with 4 other people. Just wish I knew at the time that they all felt the same way! [​IMG]

    I watched it again when I bought the box set, just coz I felt like I should, and it wasn't *quite* as bad as I remember.

    Still a steaming great pile of poo though, IMHO. *Much* preferred Resurrection to it, and that was hardly a classic!!

    Ptm

    PS. Hello again. Haven't been around these parts for the last 10 days or so as I was struck down quite badly with flu. Feeling better now though, thanks for asking. [​IMG]

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  15. Jeff

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    The film could have been rescued if they hadn't killed off the doctor. i.e. the doctor gives Ripley some hope that he could help her in some way which in turn gives the audience a reason to watch the final 3rd of the movie. Also it makes the sacrifice in the end more interesting because he thinks he can save her but she doesn't believe him.
    And someone nice lives. I agree that not all films should have a happy ending, but you don't want to come out the cinema ready to cut your wrists.

    [This message has been edited by Jeff (edited 15-02-2001).]
     
  16. Jeff

    Jeff
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    OH yes Alien4, I thought it was a fairly good action movie but nothing more. What they should have done was to completely forget Alien3 and do another sequel to Aliens or do something similar to Highlander 3 and do a what happened between Aliens and Alien3.

     
  17. charles

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    I loved the first 2 alien movies,hated 3,4 was o.k.
    It would be interesting to see a storyline about the aliens home planet-or somehow enable them to communicate?

    Like the predator movies,i would love to see a third that explores more of the time travel?-or the fact that they had been visiting earth for a very long time... theme alluded to in the second movie..and why did we never see the indian fight the predator on the crossing in the first movie?(..i wonder if there is deleted scenes of this anywhere?)-big build up-then nothing...
     
  18. General Skanky

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    Someone somewhere said the 'next' Alien will be about them getting to Earth and starting a war. Nice. [​IMG]
    Hope that happens. Want to see how easily American Marines can wipe themselves out again. [​IMG]

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  19. MacReady

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    the 'getting to Earth and starting a war' rumour has been around since before Alien 3 and I dont think that there has been anything confirmed about another Alien movie yet has there? (I know there was that rumour in the papers a couple of weeks ago but most places ..including Fox...have said it is NOT true!)

    Who remembers the rumour that Arnold Swarzzeneger was going to be in Alien 3 when it was first announced?

    I think if they do a new movie they should forget Ripley and do a movie showing the origin of the speices..on the space jockeys home world for instance.
    OR...they could just do the bloody Alien vs Predator movie....PLEASE!!!!

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  20. RMCF

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    I think that the reason most of us were disappointed when we seen Alien 3 in the cinema was because we had gone expecting to see Aliens Pt II. But lets not forget that James Cameron handled that (and he isn't half bad at the old action flicks) and maybe Fincher just wanted to impose his own style on the series. Directors tend to do that. Its their job.
     
  21. MacReady

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    That wasn't why I disliked it SOK, I actually like Finchers style of directing (Alien 3 anyway...I can't stand Seven or Fight Club...sorry I know I am in a minority with that one, but I just dont like them).
    It was the pointless storyline that I hated...what was the point of it? It didn't add to the Alien story or enlighten us to any new information regarding the alien itself (other than the creature takes on some of the characteristics of the host animal)...it tried too hard to be different to Aliens whilst trying to capture some of the sheer terror and claustraphobea of Alien...but just ended up being a pointless exercise in 'stylish' film making.

    but do you know what annoys me most about it? Fincher taking the 'pipes' off the aliens back because 'he' didn't like them !!!!
    That's like making a Star Trek movie and calling the Enterprise 'Dorothy' because the director didn't like the name Enterprise !!

    Sigourney Weaver also had a BIG say in Alien 3 if I remember correctly and she pushed a lot of the storyline...I remember a magazine at the time saying that the storyline changed drastically quite a few times right up to shooting starting.

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    [This message has been edited by MacReady (edited 15-02-2001).]
     
  22. MacReady

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    Another thing...did Fincher actually ever watch Aliens?? If so, why did the cryo sleep pods that they get in at the end of Aliens morph into ones that looked nothing like them for Alien 3???

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  23. MacReady

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    Oh yeah, and yet another thing....did the different departments in charge of the Alien ever actually talk to each other during the films production? And if they did how the hell did they manage to make the puppet, CG version and guy in suit versions of the alien ALL LOOK SO BLOODY DIFFERENT FROM ONE ANOTHER !!!
    I swear the first time I saw the movie someone in the cinema behind me asked the person they were with how many aliens had been 'born'....they thought that they were all different ones they all looked so different.

    Right, I'll stop complaining now (I am actually a big Alien fan and have all the movies on VHS, LD and DVD in all the various box sets that have been released, plus a few of the model kits and books about the movies, as well as the soundtracks and novels....and I am not kidding!!)


    P.S. Just been flicking through Sky movie channels...guess what's on Sky Cinema at the mo..lol
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    [This message has been edited by MacReady (edited 15-02-2001).]
     
  24. BadAss

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    Alien 3 was a balls up from the start.
    Fincher was a nut on the original movie to the point of obsession, on all counts he wanted to be Ridly Scott filming Alien.
    He started shooting the movie with a story line which was totally different to the finished artical. Evidence of this is on the original trailer which used some of this original footage, where every one on the planet was a MONK!
    Thats why there was no weopons, thats why every one is bald, thats why theres still some religouse over tones in the film.
    As footage came in from the dailies Fincher, trying to show who was boss decided it was all a pile of **** and scrapped the lot. Siggy put her awe in and dicided to spice things up a bit and concocted a new story which could easily be worked into the original script.
    Lots of the original SFX were dropped at the last minute because they looked cheesy.
    The chest burster was suppose to of spawned from an OX not a dog and the model was filmed but then dropped.
    Chaos pursued the film from start to the finish.

    At the time of release I thought Alien 3 was crap. Things didnt add up, to many questions were left unanswered, poor shot selection and the editing was chopped to hell leaving no flow to any of the scenes. But as time went on I filled in the missing story myself and answered the questions and got use to looking up peoples noses. But one thing ill never know is why kill Ripley?
    We've watched Ripley battle all the odds, go through hell and back for what? To die? Well it killed the first two movies stone dead. How can I watch Alien when I know she dies? How can I watch Aliens when I know she dies?
    Its totally piontless. The whole point in watching a movie is to put yourself in the main characters possition. How do you do that when you know shes going to die. Alien 3 shot itself in the foot bigtime.
    But a least Alien 3 was made by a man who loved the orininal and tried to capture a bit of the original. Alien 4 on the other hand was not. Bring back Ripley! That smells of producers milking a franchise to me.
    It went from one bad idea to the next.
    Atleast Alien 3 had some redeaming features though, Alien 4 did not.
    I myself wrote a full screenplay for Alien 4 but thats another post.
    Alien 5 is on its way. Siggy has just signed a £10,000,000 deal to lead the battle against the Aliens as they finally find there way to Earth!
     
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    Where did you hear that from? That would be great if it is true! Please do tell more!
    Neil [​IMG]



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  26. Guest

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    i've heard about alien 5, but it's 3 years away! in any case, i love alien 3. i may be in a minority, but i think it's a quite clever remake of the first film. faster and nastier and, admitedly, not quite as good. but nowhere near as bad as some say. and who said the british cast were ****? they made the damn film!
     
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    oh yeah, if someone could just write alien 4 out of the time line, i'd be much obliged.
     
  28. DPS

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    Fincher is possibly now my favourite director,but alien 3 was pants.it should of been made out as a bad dream(a ripley nightmare) after its box office disaster and alien 4 could of carried off were aliens finished but that film was wasted to.as far as im concerned i will only ever own the first two films.
     
  29. h0l1yw0od

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    I love Alien 3! :p Its my second favourite of the Alien saga. Admittedly it wasn't Aliens which is the best IMHO.

    I'm now going to upset you all by stating that i hate Alien. Nothing happens for what, an hour?! The endings great i'll give you that but thats all there is. Jim Cameron made the Alien highpoint with his far (far, far, far, far etc.) superior sequel. If i'm given the chpoice of having to watch 1 or 3, bring on the prison colony. Much more interesting, exciting and fulfilling then the original. And the ending was fantastic.

    Alien Reserurrection was all right but i didn't like the evil Ripley.

    Heres my fav order:

    Aliens
    Alien 3
    Alien Ressurection (not exactly brilliant)
    Alien
     
  30. dUnKle

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    There have been rumours about alien 5 for a long long time.

    I think they wanted to take it the way of the comics and have the alien earth war story, which is a very good story. The only problem is that both Hicks and Newt were in that story, in fact Ripley did not turn up until about half way through.

    Also rumoured for a long long time is alien V. predator, again based on the comic, but it was very action orientated and maybe hard to make as a movie
     

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