When will a coronavirus vaccine be ready ?

JimmyMac

Distinguished Member
What you don’t quite grasp @apolloa which is what others are trying to intimate to you is that virology is extremely complex and without some knowledge it’s understandably difficult to realise why we have vaccines for some viruses and not for others.

Flu for instance Mutates constantly, vaccines we have cover many mutations but not all and the vaccine given out will only generally cover 3/4 mutations at one time. The WHO decides which will be most prevalent each year and the flu vaccine for that year is created. However some may catch another strain and unfortunately the vaccine does not help and thus there are sadly deaths

Another issue is cost, it costs hundreds of millions to create a vaccine. Many will fail trials in early stages and be binned off despite a huge investment in initial work. Also if a virus burns out then a vaccine trial may not continue to further stages due to its not being financially viable. Coronavirus (MERS and SARS) are a perfect example here, they are not as susceptible to large mutations as the likes of flu (subtle mutations) but they pretty much burned out. So extensive work was done on vaccines but in the end they were not taken to final trials and production as there was no need. Companies would have spent hundreds of millions on a vaccine that wasn’t needed for the masses, if it had been created it would have cost an insane amount per dose just to break even. Yes those horrible pharmaceutical companies do have to actual consider making money back from the drugs they create but let’s not get into that debate.

So here we sit with the latest coronavirus, this time a vaccine is nigh on essential, so work carried out on MERS and SARS will have likely helped in the initial creation. Now there is a real reason and thus an investment in working towards it

Knowing how this one works and reading about the mutations so far i’m pretty confident a vaccine will be made. My thoughts are that it will be one that needs an annual dosage like the flu vaccine rather than the lifetime vaccinations MMR provides but a vaccine none the less
 
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apolloa

Distinguished Member
Where on earth did you get that idea from? The concern is that you seem to be setting yourself up as a coronavirus vaccine expert, so people are asking why.

My brief here is to prevent the spread of misinformation, and if you are spreading the idea that there will be no vaccine because you read it on the internet then I question the wisdom of your posts.
I don't know why your getting that idea, maybe they will make a vaccine, but it is a fact no vaccine has ever been made for any coronavirus, a quick google will provide you with endless proof of that. It's no secret and doesn't take a genius to see those facts, but when someone challenges those fact and claims no vaccine was made due to monetary reasons and they are not deadly enough, lets not forget the flu for one is a member of the coronavirus club and still kills thousands yearly, then I request some hard evidence to back that claim up, its hardly an overreaching request is it surely?

This is a good read:


And this:

Four coronaviruses already circulate in human beings. They cause common cold symptoms and we don't have vaccines for any of them.

From here:


And the last time I checked those were not social media websites.
 

apolloa

Distinguished Member
What you don’t quite grasp @apolloa which is what others are trying to intimate to you is that virology is extremely complex and without some knowledge it’s understandably difficult to realise why we have vaccines for some viruses and not for others.

Flu for instance Mutates constantly, vaccines we have cover many mutations but not all and the vaccine given out will only generally cover 3/4 mutations at one time. The WHO decides which will be most prevalent each year and the flu vaccine for that year is created. However some may catch another strain and unfortunately the vaccine does not help and thus there are sadly deaths

Another issue is cost, it costs hundreds of millions to create a vaccine. Many will fail trials in early stages and be binned off despite a huge investment in initial work. Also if a virus burns out then a vaccine trial may not continue to further stages due to its not being financially viable. Coronavirus (MERS and SARS) are a perfect example here, they are not as susceptible to large mutations as the likes of flu (subtle mutations) but they pretty much burned out. So extensive work was done on vaccines but in the end they were not taken to final trials and production as there was no need. Companies would have spent hundreds of millions on a vaccine that wasn’t needed for the masses, if it had been created it would have cost an insane amount per dose just to break even. Yes those horrible pharmaceutical companies do have to actual consider making money back from the drugs they create but let’s not get into that debate.

So here we sit with the latest coronavirus, this time a vaccine is nigh on essential, so work carried out on MERS and SARS will have likely helped in the initial creation. Now there is a real reason and thus an investment in working towards it

Knowing how this one works and reading about the mutations so far i’m pretty confident a vaccine will be made. My thoughts are that it will be one that needs an annual dosage like the flu vaccine rather than the lifetime vaccinations MMR provides but a vaccine none the less
I am fully aware of everything you've typed, I’m not sure what the aim of your post was?
 
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IronGiant

Moderator
lets not forget the flu for one is a member of the coronavirus club.
No., it isn't, and that exposes how little you know.

Not withstanding you can't argue that we will never get a vaccine for a corona virus if you claim it's part of the flu family club that we do have vaccines against.
 

apolloa

Distinguished Member
No., it isn't, and that exposes how little you know.

Not withstanding you can't argue that we will never get a vaccine for a corona virus if you claim it's part of the flu family club that we do have vaccines against.
I was just reading up on the family of viruses, and was about to state this, their are seven viruses from the family that can infect humans. And the flu isn’t one of them as you rightly point out.
So I self expanded my knowledge.
 

IronGiant

Moderator
I'm not holding my breath, but I haven't seen any scientific reason why we might not get a vaccine if one is needed. But I doubt it will before I get my flu jab this year.
 

apolloa

Distinguished Member
I'm not holding my breath, but I haven't seen any scientific reason why we might not get a vaccine if one is needed. But I doubt it will before I get my flu jab this year.
Well all you’ve got to go by is the common cold, SARS and MERS don’t seem to have been researched enough to show the possibility of a vaccine but it’ll help point in the direction, and I’m sorry but their have been many attempts to cure the common cold, let’s not forget it used to be a killer virus too, but no one has succeeded due to the number if different strains of it. It seems the scientific community is split over the number of Covid 19 strains, but if theirs many it may be like curing the cold.
Personally I think it’ll end up like the cold with regards to it’s affect but it’ll take many years, maybe generations for that to happen. Or if they can create something that stops the virus from killing people on the whole but not stop you from conceiving the virus.
I don’t think it’ll be any miracle cure in the next few months, it’ll be years I believe.
 

Trollslayer

Distinguished Member
That reminds me, I will have to find out if I will be getting a flu jab.
Caught it in March last year, turned out to be because of a long term B12 deficiency.
 

Autopilot

Distinguished Member
I request you to provide proof to backup your claims, I mean if you believe theirs no money to be had in curing the cold or even the flu virus that does still kill, let alone the other virus in the group, please provide proof to, backup your claim.
What?

You’re the one who wrote “their won’t be a vaccine” along with an article that doesn’t even say that.

None of us are experts enough on this forum, but I base my opinion on countless scientists who have said those things. But I don’t think there is any point in finding and posting the articles I have read, given how incorrectly you have interpreted the article you posted. You seem to just be looking for an argument anyway for some reason, so I’ll leave you to it..
 

IronGiant

Moderator
I'll just leave this here:

"The common cold is an upper respiratory infection that is caused by several families of viruses. Within these virus families, more than 200 specific viruses that can cause the common cold have been identified. The virus family that causes the most colds is called rhinovirus. Rhinoviruses cause up to 40% of colds, and this virus family has at least 100 distinct virus types in its group. Other important upper respiratory virus families are named coronavirus, adenovirus and respiratory syncytial virus. Since so many viruses can cause cold symptoms, development of a vaccine for the common cold has not been possible."
Quote from: Common Cold (Viral Rhinitis) - Harvard Health

On the other hand the SARS-Cov-2 virus causing Covid 19 is, at the current time, still a single specific virus of which there are many very minor variants.
 

starfarer

Well-known Member
Well all you’ve got to go by is the common cold, SARS and MERS don’t seem to have been researched enough to show the possibility of a vaccine...
SARS and MERS are researched extensively and vaccine were in development. Note that development and manufacturing of vaccine is different process. Manufacturing of vaccine need huge commitments from big pharma companies for years (=££££). On Oxford's livecast yersterday, Sarah Gilbert said that the biggest obstacle was the lack of funding for development. Better news is phama's are willing to gamble on manufacturing side. I don't think this has ever happened before in any vaccine production.

There are vaccines already developed for covid19 and deployed for clinical trials. Whether we'll have mass population level vaccination with these is the real question.
 

SteveAWOL

Distinguished Member
Well all you’ve got to go by is the common cold, SARS and MERS don’t seem to have been researched enough to show the possibility of a vaccine but it’ll help point in the direction, and I’m sorry but their have been many attempts to cure the common cold, let’s not forget it used to be a killer virus too, but no one has succeeded due to the number if different strains of it. It seems the scientific community is split over the number of Covid 19 strains, but if theirs many it may be like curing the cold.
Personally I think it’ll end up like the cold with regards to it’s affect but it’ll take many years, maybe generations for that to happen. Or if they can create something that stops the virus from killing people on the whole but not stop you from conceiving the virus.
I don’t think it’ll be any miracle cure in the next few months, it’ll be years I believe.
FWIW... Oxford University started trials of a MERS vaccine last year...


And research into SARS vaccine was well advanced before the virus (thankfully) petered out...


President of the Sabin Vaccine Institute and Walter G. Ross Professor and Chair of the Department of Microbiology, Immunology and Tropical Medicine at The George Washington University (GWU).

Prof. Hotez is the recipient of the Henry Baldwin Ward Medal from the American Society for Parasitologists, the Bailey Ashford Medal of the American Society of Tropical Medicine and Hygiene, and the Leverhulme Medal of the Liverpool School of Tropical Medicine.
 
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apolloa

Distinguished Member
What?

You’re the one who wrote “their won’t be a vaccine” along with an article that doesn’t even say that.

None of us are experts enough on this forum, but I base my opinion on countless scientists who have said those things. But I don’t think there is any point in finding and posting the articles I have read, given how incorrectly you have interpreted the article you posted. You seem to just be looking for an argument anyway for some reason, so I’ll leave you to it..
And yet still don’t provide a shred of proof. We are all meant to take your words at face value.. I respectfully will not do that.
 
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IronGiant

Moderator
@apolloa You are completely blind to any scientific input on here.

I'll lay it out once, and once only:

To get a cold vaccine you would have to target at least 200 completely different evolving viruses from many viral families at the same time. So you would need a vaccine with at least 200 different components.

Flu is easier because we can predict which 3 or 4 will be the worst and hopefully get it right.

The SARS and MERS vaccine research was progressing well, but when they disappeared off the planet they stopped researching them. There was no second wave of them.

Sars Cov 2 may be the same, but if it confirms to type it won't evolve very fast.
 

Panavision

Well-known Member
The global vaccine community has come together to produce an effective vaccine; that gives a viable solution a higher shot (no puns intended) of being found. I still think we are several months away from finding one, but with so many scientists working on it, I'm fairly optimistic they will do it.
 

doug56hl

Distinguished Member
From that report:
The vaccine, which Sanofi expects to reach the market sooner than the vaccine it is partnering with Translate Bio on, employs the approach used to make the company’s flu vaccine, Flublok, called a recombinant vaccine. Genetic material from the surface protein of the SARS-CoV-2 virus is inserted into insect cells, which express antigen that is then purified.

Having seen that movie with Jeff Goldblum which warned about the problems you get mixing up insect and human cells I think I'll be giving that one a miss...:eek:
 

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