1. Join Now

    AVForums.com uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

When is it OK to download a TV show?

Discussion in 'TV Show Forum' started by Marc, May 16, 2005.

  1. Marc

    Marc
    Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2004
    Messages:
    11,610
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    136
    Location:
    Portsmouth
    Ratings:
    +1,081
    In the wake of the recent tv torrent site closures, i wondered what everyone's views are, so as the title suggests, when is it in your opinion, morally OK to download a TV show? I'm not talking legally here because obviously the answer to that is never, but what do you think is acceptable?

    Personally, i don't have any morals ;) so i'll download it as soon as it's shown in America with the justification that one day it'll probably be shown terrestrially, so i'm not getting for free something i would have paid for. On the flipside though, if i enjoy a tv show, i'll normally buy it on dvd at some point, even though i dont really ever get around to watching them. Thus far i have 24 series 1-3, alias 1-2, band of brothers, millennium 1-3, buffy 1-7, angel 1-4, futurama 1-4 and friends 1-8, and i have the OC season 1 in the mail.

    But surely there's nothing wrong with me downloading the new Dr Who episodes for instance? They're on the bbc on saturday and on the net on sunday, which is where i watch them from.
     
  2. stevedster

    stevedster
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 13, 2005
    Messages:
    1,128
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Location:
    Birkenhead
    Ratings:
    +41
    im the same mate, to me downloading tv shows is just the same as it was in the old days when i used to tape stuff off the tv. Again if i really like a show i will buy it on dvd anyway. paranoid tv stations fearing loss of advertising is behind the crackdown at the end of the day.
     
  3. Mr.D

    Mr.D
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2000
    Messages:
    11,061
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    133
    Ratings:
    +1,149
    I don't generally download TV or films as a rule but I have in the past downloaded a few things which I've subsequently gone out and bought ... Firefly , BSG and the odd farscape episode.

    I really feel the BBC and other programme makers are seriously missing a trick here. If they made back catalogues available for download I'd quite happily pay for content.
     
  4. MartinImber

    MartinImber
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2001
    Messages:
    3,851
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    71
    Location:
    Worcester
    Ratings:
    +21
    I think it is OK to download any TV programme you cannot get any other way.

    However films are a nono!

    So far I have downloaded some Anime to see which series to buy, Farscape Peacekeeper Wars due to not being on BBC and a couple of episodes of Battlestar Galactica
     
  5. Kopite4Ever

    Kopite4Ever
    Member

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2004
    Messages:
    4,302
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    71
    Location:
    Liverpool: European Capital of Football 2005/2006
    Ratings:
    +76
    i dont really need to add to that. i will always always d/l my fav shows as they air in the states as im just so damn inpatient i crave them especially 24 and alias. also get the shield & joey as well but i could wait for them if they wernt shown at crap time slots on poo channels. i will always always go onto buy the dvd's for my collection though
     
  6. Mr.D

    Mr.D
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2000
    Messages:
    11,061
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    133
    Ratings:
    +1,149
    I don't really think I can justify illicit downloading under any circumstance which is a little hypocritical of me as I have already admitted doing as much myself.

    BSG could have been obtained via a Sky or cable sub .

    I wish they would cotton on to what the public wants ...legal download...give us hidef versions as well.
     
  7. MartinImber

    MartinImber
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2001
    Messages:
    3,851
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    71
    Location:
    Worcester
    Ratings:
    +21
    Or download it!

    No cable near me, and there is no CAM system for Sky as I hate the Sky boxes and you cannot use a decent receiver with Sky.

    You may note I have top end Freeview receivers so get an excellent picture as it is.
     
  8. PoochJD

    PoochJD
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2000
    Messages:
    10,992
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    133
    Location:
    Norwich
    Ratings:
    +1,863
    Hi,

    Sorry folks, but there's absolutely NO justification in my book, for downloading any form of copyrighted material from sites like Bittorent, et al. :lesson:

    I'm not going to slate you all for doing so, because I don't know any of you personally, and it would be wrong for me to simply slag all of you off for no real reason. But, regardless of what you claim, the fact that anyone has to ask such a silly question as "When is it okay to download copyright material off of the Net" is just as dumb as asking, (in a public place, I might add), "Hey folks, when would it be okay for me to go out and try and steal a BMW for myself? I only want to try it for a while, just to see if it suits me! I'll buy one, when I can afford it."


    Pooch
     
  9. richjthorpe

    richjthorpe
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2004
    Messages:
    2,026
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    41
    Location:
    dat london
    Ratings:
    +13
    What about Hi Def versions of programs already being shown on terrestrial ? For example, are there Hi Def versions of ER or Desperate Housewives ? I wouldn't have a problem downloading these as they are already being shown, it's just that the PQ would be better ! :)

    BTW, the BBC are to put episodes on their website, kind of like listen again but watch again. Can only remember Top Gear being one of them.

    Richie.
     
  10. shoehorn

    shoehorn
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2003
    Messages:
    1,602
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    51
    Location:
    The Garden of England
    Ratings:
    +32
    I HAD to download an episode of Desperate Housewives once, as I'd forgotten to set the video and the Mrs would have TOTALLY lost it......!
    Is there really any difference in this and setting the video recorder to do it for you...??
     
  11. dynamic turtle

    dynamic turtle
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2004
    Messages:
    1,501
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    41
    Location:
    Central London
    Ratings:
    +17
    Well, if its BBC content I'll bloody well download it and feel not a shred of guilt! I pay that financial black-hole of an institution £126 a year for the privilege of watching pikeys on eastenders and house/cookery/gardening programs all day. I deserve my money's worth, I think!

    In a huff,
    DT :mad:
     
  12. MartinImber

    MartinImber
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2001
    Messages:
    3,851
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    71
    Location:
    Worcester
    Ratings:
    +21
    Theft no - you are not stealing but you may be breaking copywrite.

    However if you use it to see what a programme is like go ahead - great way of trying new stuff - download something weird - if you like it buy the DVDs.

    People forget that a lot of this downloaded stuff is of poor quality and also logo ridden.

    How am I supposed to find new stuff unless I can try it first.

    Good example is Anime - I had no idea if I would like it or not - I now have a few DVDs - I will get a few more - once I have tested an episode.
     
  13. neilo

    neilo
    Banned

    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2002
    Messages:
    1,564
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Ratings:
    +21
    Damn i feel so bad now at d/l Lost ... i should have had a new BMW in my drive instead
     
  14. stevedster

    stevedster
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 13, 2005
    Messages:
    1,128
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Location:
    Birkenhead
    Ratings:
    +41
    this whole topic brings me to another point. When you buy bbc dvd's in the uk, shouldnt licence payers get a big discount (i.e. only pay for the manufacturing and distribution costs). Sorry just had to throw that one in, but its a very valid point i feel !
     
  15. Mr.D

    Mr.D
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2000
    Messages:
    11,061
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    133
    Ratings:
    +1,149
    You do get a discount. Your licence fee is slightly less than it would have been without the beeb merchandising.
     
  16. richjthorpe

    richjthorpe
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2004
    Messages:
    2,026
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    41
    Location:
    dat london
    Ratings:
    +13
    This whole downloading from the BBC website, would I get a better PQ with less blockies if I downloaded it when compared to a decent signal freeview ? Would it be the quality we should have on Freeview or will it be the same sh!te ?

    Thanks,

    Richie.
     
  17. pragmatic

    pragmatic
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2004
    Messages:
    12,120
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    133
    Ratings:
    +1,678
    I think it can be justified if you missed an episode that you would have watched otherwsie (you didn't see the adverts but you probably would have ignores them anyway).

    Also if there is a series that you saw the begining of many years ago i.e. from america it got canceled over here but ran for several years over there. There is no way of seing it so your not hurting anyone, (bit like abandonware games) if a medium is not provided for you to see the content then there (not) lossing money by not providing it

    If you were then to sell that which you downloaded that i couldn't agree with as your profiting from others work, but to download it for you personal use i think is ok.
     
  18. Azrikam

    Azrikam
    Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    I find the exact opposite. TV shows I've downloaded are sometimes free from DOGs, since they're DVD rips if available. And I've never, ever seen a "Red Dot" on a downloaded programme. :thumbsup: And the picture quality is usually quite good, and definitely beats our pixelated freeview box.

    As for guilt, I have none for downloading TV shows. I can understand some people being against it. What I can't understand, however, is someone being against a licence fee payer downloading a BBC programme. That's no difference than time-shifting with a Sky+ box. And if the BBC goes ahead with their on-demand programming, then it'll be the way that everyone watches their programmes in the near future.
     
  19. Mr.D

    Mr.D
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2000
    Messages:
    11,061
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    133
    Ratings:
    +1,149
    Well for a start paying a licence fee does not mean you then have unlimited right to watch or copy a given programme. You pay a licence fee the BBC provides a broadcast service.

    Whilst I was almost inclined to agree with you on the "morality" of downloading an already publically broadcast programme I take issue with your downloading of dvd-rips as being acceptable. Dvds are licensed products sold primarily to bring in revenues for the production company and the distributor. For Tv material the distributor may well be the BBC but you are also effectivley stealing from the production company.

    Any way you slice it illegal downloading although quite common is not readily justifiable.
     
  20. pragmatic

    pragmatic
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2004
    Messages:
    12,120
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    133
    Ratings:
    +1,678
    If you download something and you like it, you will buy it on DVD (especially people on this forum) because it usually looks crap on a projector (but admittedly ok on a TV), doesn't have surround sound and is missing any special features.

    Lets hypothetically say that you have a friend who has every piece of copyrighted works you will ever want to see in your life, instead of buying any of them when ever you wanted to see the desired material you lent it, would this be wrong? it is technically illegal.

    What about copy righted works that will never be broadcasted again and there is no available dvd/vhs would that still be immoral to download?

    Single sales have plummeted, but album sales are at an all time high. This is quite likely due to illegal downloading, people like a song or two they will buy an album but they don't want to fork our £4 for a single and maybe a re-mix if your lucky.

    Its the same with a TV series, if they made the first episode freely available it would interest a lot of people and they would then watch/buy the rest of the series based on what they have seen already.

    If you were to take someone else’s copyrighted works and then sell them to make yourself some money I would consider that wrong, as you profiting without compensation for someone else’s hard work.
     
  21. Matthew Attoe

    Matthew Attoe
    Member

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2001
    Messages:
    695
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    Norwich
    Ratings:
    +11
    One question I have for all those who don't believe in downloading TV shows is have you ever read someone else's newspaper or magazine?

    It's still copyrighted information and you've seen it without paying for it.
     
  22. Mr.D

    Mr.D
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2000
    Messages:
    11,061
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    133
    Ratings:
    +1,149
    yes but you haven't run it through a photo-copier and left a stack of them outside with a big sign on it saying "get your free paper here only suckers pay for them". The same is true for dvds and other media. You can show it to whoever you like as long as you don't copy it or charge for viewing. By downloading something you are intrinsically copying it.

    Ever wondered why its called "copyright"?

    As for people downloading as a taster prior to a legitimate buy: all the heavy downloaders I know have no intention of buying a legit copy. This even includes elderly members of my family who actually regard anyone who pays money for music/video/software as being fundamentally daft when you can download whatever you need. They simply don't make the connection between piracy and what they are up to.

    These are the people all the fanatical FACT and other anti-piracy blurbs are primarily targeting.

    Copyright usually does not differentiate between enthusiasts downloading a taster and downloaders whose main priority is to get something for nothing. And to be honest why should it ? Its the act that's legislated against ...not the intention.

    You can argue copyright in general has not moved with the times and even that content creators are not adequately exploiting the newer medias potential for distribution which has naturally been filled with less than legitimate alternatives.

    However as much as some of us do it with seemingly more noble intentions than getting something for nothing we should be honest about it and avoid trying to justify what is at a fairly fundamental an act that is tantamount to theft somewhere along the line.

    Its like saying that its ok to shoplift as long as long as you destroy the stuff you don't like and eventually pay for the stuff you do.

    If you buy a dvd in one shop then later on you walk into another shop and nick the same dvd its still theft. You haven't gained the right to every single copy of that material on the face of the planet just because you paid to own one copy on one dvd.
     
  23. clever dicky

    clever dicky
    Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    But, regardless of what you claim, the fact that anyone has to ask such a silly question as "When is it okay to download copyright material off of the Net" is just as dumb as asking, (in a public place, I might add), "Hey folks, when would it be okay for me to go out and try and steal a BMW for myself? I only want to try it for a while, just to see if it suits me! I'll buy one, when I can afford it."


    What a load of CRAP, there's always one!
    How about a photograph of the sun.
     
  24. Garrett

    Garrett
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2001
    Messages:
    33,570
    Products Owned:
    2
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    167
    Location:
    The best thief you’ll never see.
    Ratings:
    +4,461
    Don't encourage people to blind themselves :nono:
     
  25. KoThreads

    KoThreads
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2005
    Messages:
    2,978
    Products Owned:
    1
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    86
    Ratings:
    +164
    I'd like to think most people on this forum act like myself. When I was in my teens (a long time ago, although it doesn't seem like it) I used to record albums and the radio etc and didn't even think about it despite all the 'Home taping is killing music' stickers on albums.

    However now I'm older I have bought every CD I ever wanted. All the ones I taped and now everything I like, not much at the moment! The same now goes for VCR and PVR recordings, anything I like enough I buy.

    It's almost like the programs are adds for things to buy. I pay my license fee and Sky subs and I buy the DVD's. I'm giving them a small fortune and don't consider I'm stealing as if I don't like it I won't keep it.

    It's a bit like getting a free trial of soap powder, I've paid a bit towards the add through ITV, C4 etc and if it's crap I won't buy it, if it's good I wll.
     
  26. WildeKarde

    WildeKarde
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2004
    Messages:
    4,805
    Products Owned:
    1
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    136
    Location:
    Glasgow
    Ratings:
    +897
    It's already been touched upon but there are a lot of TV shows which you simply cannot get by any other method than choosing to download them. This is still illeagal but if you wanted the show you would have no legal way of obtaining them currently.

    Examples of these are shows like Brisco County Jr, Automan, Space: Above and Beyond & Tales of the Gold Monkey.

    These are all available somewhere to download but currently you cannot purchase them even as a legal download.

    Isn't there also some law prohibiting keeping recorded material from the TV beyond a certain length of time? Anyone still got films from years ago on tape (I know I have)
     

Share This Page

Loading...