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What's This then

Discussion in 'Projectors, Screens & Video Processors' started by Timh, Oct 15, 2000.

  1. Timh

    Timh
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    What's this then?
    Anyone got any idea's
    Has anyone got progressive scan? if so what's it like?
    Cheers
    Timh

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  2. HT Dude

    HT Dude
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    The progressive scan website will be opening very soon. It'll explain what it's all about.
    Mean time I have progressive scan and so do you if you play DVDs on your PC with Power DVD or Win DVD or a similar software DVD player.
    Pipe this signal (your VGA output) through a display device capable of taking the signal and you get a MUCH better picture than from any non-progressive scan DVD player into any traditional telly.
     
  3. Wayne Moule

    Wayne Moule
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    I have Power DVD but I don't have a VGA output on my Tiny PC.

    What display devices are we talking about and how much better is the pro-scan picture,as my Sony DVD with RGB output is brilliant anyway.

    Are there any Pro-scan tvs without 100Hz.
     
  4. HT Dude

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    Yes, you DO have VGA output of your PC - what do you plug your monitor into ?
    There are no progressive scan TVs with the approriate inputs available in the UK at the moment.
    You're looking at a projector - preferably CRT. And the picture would trounce that of your Sony DVD and TV.
     
  5. Wayne Moule

    Wayne Moule
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    A Projector isn't as good quality as a CRT TV as it is projected over a distance and hasn't got the same levels of brightness,contrast and definition in my opinion.It certainly wouldn't "trounce" my Sony DVD and TV because I've seen them in action.


    [This message has been edited by Wayne Moule (edited 16-10-2000).]
     
  6. Guest

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    Slightly off topic HC Dude but have you finished your home cinema yet? Could you post your home cinema web address again? I think the sacrifices/work you have made for your home cinema are remarkable and I would love to see the end results.

    [This message has been edited by Paul J (edited 16-10-2000).]
     
  7. Wayne Moule

    Wayne Moule
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    HC Dude.

    I'm sure you're right.I'm just trying to be objective as some people rate the latest gadgets,like 100Hz tellies which I don't,and some don't.

    I have thought of a projection system,for the screen size impact alone,but CRT TV's are hard to beat,Plasmatrons do look good though.I don't like Rear Projection TV's and CRT projection is far more expensive.

    I wished I lived nearer to you,as I would take you up on you're offer,you're system sounds great but would be out of my price range.

    [This message has been edited by Wayne Moule (edited 16-10-2000).]
     
  8. Scott Smart

    Scott Smart
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    Dear Wayne,

    You don't like the look of CRT projectors but you like the look of plasmatrons! I think that this reflects more on the situation that you saw them in than on their actual quality. A CRT projectors tubes are much more like a computer monitor than a TV - they are higher resolution and can be driven with a progressive scan signal. Tghe problem is the system needs to be well set up and have a high quality source (i.e. a line doubler/scaler or Home Cinema PC). When seen at their optimum you will be blown away. Plasmatrons have terrible contrats -low resolution and bad colour - but they look flash and work better in low ambient light.
    A TV is actually very low resolution 576 (visible) lines for PAL (480NTSC) and only about 500 pixels get shown per line! (DVD PAL has 768 horizontally they struggle to make it to the TV!)A high quality projector can be displaying 1400x900 (for example) progressive, but it is a bigger image.
    The bigger image gives much more impact to a film, If your field of view is over about 35degrees (cant remember the exact figures) then you become more emotionally involved!
    If you want brightness then you can buy D-ILA projectors - similar resolution to the BEST CRT's and much brighter. Bigger and Brighter and Better means expensive though..........

    Scott
     
  9. HT Dude

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    Thanks for the thought ! If I hadn't spent all weekend working on the progressive scan site, I would have got more done. I went for a new carpet in the end, and I just need to put the speaker cable down under the underlay, reseat the carpet, re-paint and varnish the skirtingboard and I can start moving all the stuff in. www.the-wrights.co.uk
    Cheers
     
  10. Gordon @ Convergent AV

    Gordon @ Convergent AV
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    Hi HC Dude,

    Looking forward to seeing the site when it's up and running.

    Loewe offer VGA input boards as an option on their Aconda set and probably others. This would accept 480P, would it not? Haven't tried it yet so I can't confirm this. If it's true though then your statement about no UK tv's being Progressive scan capable would be innacurate.

    All the best,

    Gordon

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  11. HT Dude

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    Hi Gordon,
    re the Loewe sets - I'd best let David answer that one [​IMG]
     
  12. Dodgey

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    HC Dude - I have just "read" your web site "cover to cover". Several things come to mind.

    1. Your screen is HUGE.
    2. My girlfriend is an interior designer and architect. I wish you had known me to ask about things like ground level skirting boards!
    3. Totally agree with the religion views. Entirely.
    4. Dune is indeed great.
    5. I laughed a lot.
    6. Do you still talk with your neighbours?
    7. Don't park anything heavy over your cinema.

     
  13. HT Dude

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    We may end up having to agree to disagree, but I totally 100% disagree with you.
    A properly set up, half decent CRT projector, projecting a progressive scan images is MILES better than a standard (interlaced) TV. There is no comparison.
    The level of brightness, contrast and definition (in a dark room) can be at least just as good.
    It certainly WOULD trounce your DVD player and TV. If you are ever in Birmingham, pop in and see my system. It's pretty convincing.
     
  14. Ludae

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    I have not heard that Loewe have a progressive scan TV yet. If the VGA input accepted progressive signals which is likely, it will no doubt interlace them for display. Also, in order to make use of the DMI and DMM standards conversion feature of some Loewe TVs, the internal processing would de-interlace the signal, convert the frame rate and then re-interlace it again for display.

    Loewe buy their CRTs and semiconductor processing ICs from Philips. Philips do a version of the Real Flat widescreen CRT that will scan progressively to 48KHz horizontal scanning rate. That's enough for 1280x720@60Hz (HDTV), VGA at @90Hz and XGA @60Hz. I would image this CRT will be incorporated into a European product fairly soon.

    Metz do a 32" widescreen progressive scan TV in the UK that has a progressive scan VGA input. This is the only one I am aware of available now.

    Cheers.

    David.
     
  15. Wayne Moule

    Wayne Moule
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    HC Dude.

    Great website,a nice insight.

    Ludae.

    Interesting article,especially about possible HDTV screen.

    I am impressed by all of this,but can we have some prices please?I don't suppose this is all within reach financially of the general consumer.

    Keep it going!

     
  16. HT Dude

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    Dodgy,
    thanks for taking the time to visit!

    >1. Your screen is HUGE.
    yeah - 8 feet wide and *just* fits. It's fantastic. I'm totally sold on progressive scan and CRT projection.

    >2. My girlfriend is an interior designer and architect. I wish you had known me to ask about things like ground level skirting boards!
    Ah well - the walls have dried out nicely so it's not a real problem.

    >3. Totally agree with the religion views. Entirely.
    Cool
    >4. Dune is indeed great.
    Absolutely

    >5. I laughed a lot.
    Good
    >6. Do you still talk with your neighbours?
    Yeah, we get on very well. Particularly with regard to neighbours of home cinema fans - it's good to talk.
    >7. Don't park anything heavy over your cinema.
    I wont! But I'm sure the garage floor could take it.

    Wayne - thanks.
     
  17. Gordon @ Convergent AV

    Gordon @ Convergent AV
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    Ludae:

    The Aconda uses the Philips tube of which you speak I believe. It had a slight glitch with NTSC DVD's on its release and the temporary service option was to turn off the progressive scanning within the digital chassis, returning the unit to interlaced set up.

    This suggests to me that this set is capable of accepting progressive inputs. I know of at least one manufacturer of DVD players who is using this very model for this purpose. I am not at liberty to say who they are or whether it is accepting the signal from their progressive output DVDplayer.

    Gordon

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  18. Wayne Moule

    Wayne Moule
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    CRT Projectors look like the best option in terms of price and performance,compared to other viewing systems,including Plasma TV's.

    CRT Projectors are under half the price of a Plasma screen.What about servicing and reliability though?
     
  19. mysteriousjimmy

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    Hi ..
    I live in Australia and have been thinking of buying this Metz TV (model Artos).. Does anyone have one or now of any reviews on it???

     
  20. Ludae

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    I don't know of any reviews, but I have seen the 32" progressive scan version twice and found it to be the best progressive scan CRT TV available in UK/Europe. (Not that there are many to choose from!)

    Certainly better than the Hitachi models. The Metz had very good contrast, rich colours and good focus and convergence. Power regulation was also very good. It was also among the best as a 100Hz interlaced TV.

    I believe that Metz also use Philips CRTs but have no immediate plans for a 36" model.

    Be aware though that when in 50Hz progressive mode flicker can still be a problem (depending on how annoying you find it). Field flicker on 50Hz interlaced sets is replaced by frame flicker on 50Hz progressive sets, although many other interlaced artifacts are of course reduced or eliminated.

    Personally I would never buy a TV without trying it out for myself, but I know this can be difficult to do if demo models are few and far between.

    Cheers.
     
  21. mysteriousjimmy

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    thanks for the info...

    will get to demo one this weekend, the shop I just purchased my new HC kit from will have another one in on Friday. Have looked at the Phillips 36" W/S, $7,000 here. I can get the Metz Atros W/S for about $4800 here.
     
  22. mo

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    the metz is a mighty fine tv.
    amongst the very best.it sells for £2400 in the uk.audio T is one dealer.
    as good as it is i have never found a more complex tv in all my viewings.
    the amount of picture settings goes on & on,the teletext at first glance will s**t the life out of you because,i ,assure you you've seen nothing like it .
    the rep was telling me it takes on average them 3 hours to set it up right and to the customers liking.
    as great as it is, spend a lot of time with it, if you want a simple tv be prepared!
     
  23. mysteriousjimmy

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    got to demo the Artos today for a short time but will back at the store tomorrow with a handful of DVD's. They are going to set it up out the back for me with DVD player and VHS and let me play with it for a few hours.
    I have to say I think I am already sold.

     
  24. mo

    mo
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    the black piano finish is the best built finish.the caseing is almost twice as thick as the others.
    for me, the stand is too low but looks good with the tv,avoid if you can help it.
    5 year guarantee comes as standard in the uk from metz,so check in your part of the world.
    if you like this tv then you will also love the loewe acconda.same family of electronics,similar build quality,similar picture,simpilar to use and more features!
    and of course cheaper!
    enjoy ,know that your looking at the best a tv can offer
    look forward in hearing your comments
     
  25. mysteriousjimmy

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    I will also be checking the Aconda, the price here on it is $5750 and the Metz is $5500 (without stand) The shop I just picked up my amp, speakers and DVD player from have given me a price of $4799 for the Metz. But will shopping around to see what I can on the Loewe.
    At present in Australia we don't have much choice to choose from.

     

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