What to get?

Discussion in 'Projectors, Screens & Video Processors' started by Bushido, Aug 17, 2006.

  1. Bushido

    Bushido
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    Hi all,

    First of all I'd like to say HI to all!

    I have been lurking around these forums for a small while and must say your advice is greatly appreciated! I'm not soo shaby on AV but feel asking other always is best to get a good idea.

    Ok here is my question I hope you can help?

    I would like to get a DLP projector around end Nov beginning of Dec. I have about £1k to spend.

    I currently have a 32" Sony Trin TV and run my Xbox 360 through it. What PJ's can you recommend around that price that will get the best out of my HD gaming and eventually the 360 HDDVD drive?

    Also if you can help further...with the cables coming out of the 360 how would i get them over to the projector?

    I do not have a screen or at the moment a white wall to project onto...so any tips there would also be great!

    Thanks very much guys and gals...

    Chris
     
  2. Oakleyspatz

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    DLP HD projectors for around £1k are just starting to come out but for a little more you can buy any one of several. I would recommend the Infocus 7205/7210 which can now be bought for £1200/£1400 respectively. Also there is the Optoma H72i and the BenQ PE7700 both around £1200 (if you shop around). There are others which I'm sure will also be recommended to you. I believe Optoma are soon to release a HD res DLP for less than £1k but I am not sure exactly when.
    The Xbox 360 uses a component cable for HD output or a VGA lead if your PJ supports it. You can buy extention cables if you need to run it around your room for not much money.
     
  3. Wild Rumpus

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    Where can you get the 7210 for £1400?
     
  4. Kadders

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    If/when they have any stock; from here:
    http://www.luzerntech.com/
    (They also use ebay)

    Some of what they stock are recon units, but they do specify when that is the case. The 7210s were new (when they had them!). As the site is shoeing no stock right now, it might be worth giving them a call to see if they will get any more. 7210 is dicontinued, so they may not get any more.
     
  5. Wild Rumpus

    Wild Rumpus
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    Ah, yes, I thought it might be those guys, they don't have any stock at the moment, though.
     
  6. Kadders

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    As I said above (complete with spelling error - should say 'showing', not shoeing!)
     
  7. Bushido

    Bushido
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    I like the look of the HD72i...I am now going to hunt around for some prices!! Much appreciated chaps for the reponse...

    Cheers!:clap: :clap:
     
  8. Wild Rumpus

    Wild Rumpus
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    Got myself a 7210 from Luzerntech for £1400 (after they said that they wouldn't have any more for a few weeks):D
    Hopefully it will match my expectations. I'm going to have to live with a smaller screen than I planned originally (77" rather than 82") but it should be plenty big enough from 10' away.
     
  9. Brogan

    Brogan
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    Me too :D
    An unbelievable price for a brand new 7210.

    I've been trying to purchase one (unsuccessfully) since yesterday evening.
    As they only take PayPal I had to call them and make a manual payment.
    This was initially rejected by the bank due to a random security check.
    A quick call to HSBC and the payment went through.

    The lady at Luzerntech did say she would cancel the other 3 that were queued in the system for me - due to me attempting to purchase several times with different credit cards...:D

    What's the problem with the screen size?
    Is it due to throw ratio/distance as to why you must use a smaller screen?
     
  10. Wild Rumpus

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    Yeah, throw ratio is the problem. I am currently getting an AV/Family room built as part of an extension, but the room is only 11'4" wide, so the throw will be around 10'. I had looked at using an LCD projector, but as I don't suffer from rainbows with DLP I decided to go for the better projector with a smaller screen.
     
  11. Brogan

    Brogan
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    Fair enough.
    I'm fortunate in that I will be able to get away with a 106" screen.
    I could actually fit a 120" but at 3.8m viewing distance it's a bit too big.

    What screen are you going for?
    Matte white, grey or high gain (GWII)?

    And where are you getting your M1-HDMI adaptor from?
    What about the ceiling mount? Vogels or LMP?

    Here's to receiving our new PJ's :D
     
  12. Wild Rumpus

    Wild Rumpus
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    Unfortunately I can't use the long throw (4.5m) in the room as it has doors at both ends.
    I'm still researching screens, but I will probably go for matte white (Beamax). If you do a Google on "M1 to HDMI" on Google, you can find a few people selling the adaptors for £10 odd, so I will probably use one of them.
    What ceiling mount do reckon on using? I haven't done much on this yet, either (my extension won't be ready for 5 weeks or so so I hadn't planned on making any purchases now, but I couldn't resist this bargain)
     
  13. Brogan

    Brogan
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    Me too.
    I don't know whether to go for matte white, gray or high gain.
    I may just project onto the wall and see how that looks.
    Then I can make a judgement on which screen (gain) to get.

    Thanks.

    I have read on this forum there are some problems with adjusting the Vogels so I am looking initially at LMP.
    The other reason for going with LMP is they make it to the exact length you want so I could get it so the top of the image aligns perfectly with the top of the screen when it is fully extended.
    Alternatively, there is a seller on eBay doing universal InFocus mounts for about $30 but they would need shipping from the US (and they are aluminium and not powder coated/painted).
     
  14. Wild Rumpus

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    Thanks, the LMP looks pretty good, I'll need to do some calculations to see what length I need. THe main problem will be having this projector in my house and not being able to use it! I can see some kind of Jury-rigged screen being set up:)
    Anyway, thanks to the forum as I wouldn't have got this bargain without the advice on here - exactly the same situation as with my Plasma that I bought a year ago.:D
     
  15. Brogan

    Brogan
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    I contacted InFocus this morning to ask them what the lens center to projector base measurement is but they couldn't tell me.
    I've sent a PM to another forum member asking him if he can measure it as this will factor into the mount length.

    Agreed.
    Specifically to AVdavid as he was the one who first posted about Luzerntech (on my thread).

    I've just bought an M1-HDMI adaptor from digitalkind.co.uk for £12.84 delivered.
    Another retailer wanted £10 for the adaptor and £10 for delivery...:rolleyes:
     
  16. Brogan

    Brogan
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    Just make sure you can accomodate the rather large vertical offset on the HD72i.
    I was all set to go for one when Kadders pointed that out to me (thanks Kadders) and I worked out that I can't actually get it to work in my set up.
     
  17. Wild Rumpus

    Wild Rumpus
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    "Another retailer wanted £10 for the adaptor and £10 for delivery..."
    Yeah, I nearly ordered from them until I saw the delivery price.
     
  18. Bushido

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    Sorry I am a tad of a pj newbie...can you quickly explain the above so that I can translate it into my home setup??

    Also I have been looking at the Hitachi TX200 as a viable answer...In all honesty whilst I love paying extra for great products I am always wondering if I will really notice the difference for £200-£300?

    What you peeps think of the Hitachi compared to the HD72i? Honest comments please!!

    Thanks
     
  19. Brogan

    Brogan
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    Me too but thanks to a few days of research I'm now starting to at least get the basics...:rolleyes:

    Basically the vertical offset will determine how far down from the ceiling your image will be - assuming you are ceiling mounting.
    Optoma don't give it as a ratio but as far as I can work out, it's about 138.5%.
    This means you have to multiply your image height by 38.5% to get the offset from the center of the lens.

    So assume your image height is 114cm, the offset will be 44cm (114x0.385).
    Add to the that the distance from the lens center to the base of the projector - about 10cm say and then the length of the ceiling mount, another 15cm and you have a total of about 69cm.
    This means unless you tilt the PJ and use keystone correction, the top of your image will be 69cm from the ceiling.

    This was too much for me as the bottom of the image would have dropped off the bottom of the screen which is why I couldn't go for the HD72i.

    Hope that helps.
     
  20. Bushido

    Bushido
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    Is that from top to bottom of the image? I assume I would be able to work this out from the height that I mount the pj? I would have its distance from the screen which would give me the size of image?

    Let me know if im on the right track! Sorry to be an arse pain but I just want to make sure I get it right thats all!

    What size screen were you going to use?

    Thanks

    Chris
     
  21. Brogan

    Brogan
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    That figure was for the actual image height - top to bottom, not the screen size but the viewable area.
    I just based the calculations on a 92" (diagonal) screen.

    You can start from either approach - either decide on a position where you want to mount the PJ or decide on a screen size.
    They are both related as PJs have maximum and minimum throw distances, coupled with zoom ranges so you need to make sure the one you want will be able to project the image in the size you want from where it is sited.

    I would start with your viewing position.
    Take the measurement from your seat to the screen and divide by 1.5-2.0.
    That will give you the screen size range.
    From there you can work out where to place the PJ by using one of the many calculators available online, or the PJ spec's.

    For example, my viewing position is 3.8m from the screen.
    Dividing this by 1.5 gives me 2.53m which would be the lagest (width) screen I should go for.
    I am actually going for a screen which is 2.34m wide (106" diagonal)

    I would spend a few days or however long it takes making sure you know exactly what you're buying and how it all fits together otherwise it could be an expensive mistake.

    As posted above - a 106" diagonal screen which gives an image 234cm (w) x 132cm (h).
    I still haven't worked out which type of screen to get though.

    If you want to post some details, I'll crunch some numbers and see what I come up with.
     
  22. Bushido

    Bushido
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    Just taken the measurement from screen to seat and its pretty much bang on to yours.

    3.8m so again I could get a 92" or 106"...That should give me a vertical offset of about 76cm
     
  23. Brogan

    Brogan
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    And there's the problem with the HD72i.
    Most screens have a black border at the top which is about 30cm or so (33cm for the GWII) before the viewable area starts.
    Then you have the case which is about 8-10cm deep.
    Including the ceiling hooks, etc. the total distance is roughly 42-45cm (44cm for the GWII) from ceiling to top of the viewable area when the screen is fully extended.

    With a vertical offset of 76cm, your image is going to be about 32cm down the screen and thus you're going to lose 32cm off the bottom.

    The only way around this is to either mount the PJ on a coffee table or ceiling mount it but tilt it and use keystone correction.
    As using keystone correction degrades the picture quality, I decided that I would forget about the HD71i and go for a projector that has an offset (including ceiling mount, etc.) of 44cm or less.
    Or, you could even suspend the screen from long chains so it is 30cm off the ceiling but then you will have 76cm of offset + 132cm of screen which means the bottom edge of your image will be 208cm down from the ceiling or, to put it another way, about 30cm off the floor...
    That's how I ended up with the 7210 which has an offset ratio of 116%.
    Screen height = 132 x 0.16 = 21.5cm + 5.78cm (lens center to base) + 15cm (mount length) = 42.3cm total offset.
    A good 30cm less than the HD72i.

    Even with a screen of 92", you're still going to have a total offset of around 69cm so you'll still be over by 25cm.
     
  24. Bushido

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    Sounds like I am in the same situation. I like you do not want to loose image quality.

    The 7210 is out of my price range to be honest...so ill have to go for a 37" LCD tv me thinks and when I move ill make my own cinema room for a pj!

    Thanks again for your advice...glad there are people like you around to help us noobs!

    Regards,

    Chris
     
  25. Brogan

    Brogan
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    I can't comment on how much image quality you would lose using correction so it may be worth asking others who have done it.
    I personally just didn't want to go down that route.

    Are you sure?
    Luzerntech are doing brand new ones for £1,399 which is about the same price as an HD72i.
    Granted you don't get it as part of a bundle deal including screen, mount and bulb but a screen and mount will only come to around £200-£300.

    As far as PJs go, it's all new to me too but I have been on a bit of a steep learning curve these last few days...
     
  26. Bushido

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    It was the package price I was looking at with screen and mount for £1500 that was appealing to me....

    I have to speak VERY nicely to my other half if I am going to spend that kind of money.

    If I get it then yay...if not boo!!

    Chris
     
  27. Brogan

    Brogan
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    Well I managed to get PJ, screen and mount for under £1,700 so you're talking less than £200 difference for the 7210 over the HD72i and by all accounts, the 7210 is another step up in terms of performance and picture quality.
    You could reduce that price even further if you went for a cheaper or home made mount and a cheaper screen.
     
  28. Brogan

    Brogan
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    Well my 15m HDMI cable, M1-HDMI adaptor and SP7210 all turned up today :D

    Just hooked them all up and it's working fine.
    I possibly could even have gone for the 120" screen as the 106" doesn't look too big at all.

    One thing I am glad about though and that is I opted for the GWII glass beaded with a gain of 1.8.
    The image is almost impossible to see in this greenhouse we call a lounge...:rolleyes:

    Just the mount and component/s-video cables (for Sky) to sort out now - screen arrives Friday.
    Hopefully I should have it up by the weekend :smashin:
     

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