What small sub?

[mij]

Hi, I am about to get a new subwoofer and have been reading as much as I can on here for info, my problem is space, I will have to have a small sub.
I have heard the quake and was impressed, but nobody on here seems to be impressed at all, so my question is what alternatives should I be looking at, bearing in mind I want a small one and dont want to spend any more than £300, which is the best price I have been quoted for the quake.

One other question is Rel have a high level Neutrik connector and a low level phono connector, am I understanding things correctly in thinking this means the sub can use both, and switch between either connector depending on the input (music or film) and if that is correct how does it switch from one to the other, or have I misunderstood the whole thing.

Thanks in advance for any replys.
mij

 

[buzlightyear]

The new kid on the block is MJ Acoustics Pro50 sub, do a search on this site for it, everyone "seems" to like it and so do the mags. is its tiny, and its £299, I dont have one as yet....the girlf still has not forgiven me for my Denon 3800 Hifi Junkies and Sevenoaks stock these babys, go for a demo.
http://www.mjacoustics.co.uk/mjacoustics_17.10.02/productselect.htm

Buzz.

 

[rooo]

Depends how small you mean - do you have any dimensions?

The general opinions seems to be 'small box, small sound'. Even from my limited knowledge I would have thought that you would be disappointed with anything less than 10" (now stop it!).

 

[mij]

The Rel Quake is 10"x10" and about 12" tall, I would consider something slightly bigger, but not as big as some of the beasts I have seen.

mij

 

[Jase]

Originally posted by mij

One other question is Rel have a high level Neutrik connector and a low level phono connector, am I understanding things correctly in thinking this means the sub can use both, and switch between either connector depending on the input (music or film) and if that is correct how does it switch from one to the other, or have I misunderstood the whole thing.

Rels have a mode switch so you choose whether you want to use the subs crossover for the low level input or not. The High level input has the sub crossover active all the time.

Depending on what amp/receiver you have, you can leave the sub on Mode 2 or 4 which means it ignores the subs crossover for the Low Level input (as the crossover will be controlled by the amp) which is ideal for movies or a straight stereo mode. This leaves you free to adjust the crossover for the High Level input for any Direct or Pure Direct mode you have for listening to music.

The Rels are very flexible in terms of connections etc.

 

[mij]

Thanks, that's made it clearer for me, my Marantz 5200 has a source direct switch.

mij

 

[beth0]

If you have heard the Quake and like it, does it really matter what people on the forum think.
I have a Q150 and that gets nothing but people slagging it on here, but I like it and thats what counts.

Everyone has an opinion, that does not mean they are right.

 

[BigAde]

Can second the choice of MJA Pro50.
It is 11" x 11" and about 13" high. Cost is £299.

I've heard a lot of subs and, yes, for more money and/or with a bigger box you can get a better sound. But for the size and money I don't think it can be bettered.

Best thing is to get a demo and decide for yourself.

 

[mij]

beth0 & BigAde, I totally agree with you both regarding other peoples opinions, but the only small sub I have seen is the quake, so without this process I would not have found out about the MJ Acoustics Pro50 sub, and who knows what else, I might even find out about something that I prefer to the quake.
I consider £300 a lot of money and want to make sure I get the best for my money.

cheers
mij

 

[Ian J]

Originally posted by mij
I might even find out about something that I prefer to the quake.
I consider £300 a lot of money and want to make sure I get the best for my money.

If size is an issue, the Quake and MJ are the only two alternatives at that price point.

Demoing a sub isn't as easy as it sounds and certainly not as easy as demoing ordinary speakers. Many have never heard deep bass before so don't know what to expect or to listen for.

The ideal scenario would be to listen to the two subs side by side at the same shop, then after listening to both subs, carefully make your own mind up and buy the MJ.

Joking aside I have heard both and thought that the Quake was so bad that the overall sound was much improved when it was switched off. That was at the Manchester show last month and it was on demo in the REL room and had presumably been carefully setup by REL staff.

 

[Burt]

I too have decided to buy a small sub - It appears that the only two 'real' contenders are the Quake and the MJ. My problem is that I live in N Ireland and cannot find a dealer for the MJ and therefore cannot hear it for myself.

Should I buy the Mj 'Blindly' or more to the point 'Deafly' I havent heard the Quake, but if I do audition it I will have nothing to compare it to.

Is the KEF 2000 a worthy contender to the quake? - Have also considered the Yamaha 320, but I think its ugly.

Or would I be better opting for a larger REL second hand (again my budget is £300ish)

All advice greatly received.

 

[DaveP]

What about the Velodyne CHT 10 Subwoofer Power-buy? I havn't got one but if I was in the market for one I'd go for it!

Or doen't Eric still sell them?

DaveP

 

[juboy]

Originally posted by Ian J

I did go to Manchester (specifically to hear the Gallos) and their people did themselves a great disservice by not setting them up properly.

Originally posted by Ian J
That was at the Manchester show last month and it was on demo in the REL room and had presumably been carefully setup by REL staff.

Interesting.

The Gallos sounded poor so therefore must have been set up incorrectly by their staff.

The Quake sounded poor but had presumably been setup correctly by Rel's staff.

 

[SOUNDSTYLE]

Originally posted by DaveP
What about the Velodyne CHT 10 Subwoofer Power-buy? I havn't got one but if I was in the market for one I'd go for it!

Or doen't Eric still sell them?

DaveP

He's looking for a small sub, I think the CHT-10 will be too big!

 

[Burt]

Does anyone know the dimensions of the Velodyne? - How much does it cost?

 

[Matt F]

Originally posted by SOUNDSTYLE
He's looking for a small sub, I think the CHT-10 will be too big!

Well, there's only one way to find out for sure - let's ask him:

Burt - is 40.63 x 37.5 x 49.38 cm too big?

Matt.

 

[Burt]

I reckon I could go to that size. I understand that the Velodynes are forward-firing - does that make them more difficult to position in a room? ie are corners out of the question, or behind a sofa etc?

 

[Ian J]

Originally posted by juboy
Interesting.

The Gallos sounded poor so therefore must have been set up incorrectly by their staff.

The Quake sounded poor but had presumably been setup correctly by Rel's staff.

It is a valid point and the only thing that I can add is that with the Gallos I walked into the room with Eric and he said to the Gallos boys "blow me, what silly billy set this up" (or words to that effect) but in view of the comments made about REL in these forums, the REL people didn't know who we were and we weren't about to tell them.

Whether or not the Quake can sound better I don't know, but they will have lost a number of potential customers who won't bother to find out, as will Gallo. An exhibition is the one chance that people have to showcase their products for thousands of people to see / hear and if they can't get it right they've blown that golden opportunity.

As a matter of interest the forum boys in the Denon room said that they worked halfway through the night to make sure that their kit was spot on and it showed in their professional presentation.

 

[scott]

i to went along to the mcr show on the sat morning, i went mainly to try and hear denons avc-a11sr (i own a 3801) i sat in prime position in there first demo of day,although this was with avc-a1sr,they did good opening talk saying they had been up all night deciding on the best dvds to demo, besides a clip from a thx demo disc first it was behind enemy lines then some talk scene i cant remember then their piste-de-resistance flashdance !! talk abou dissapointing, i spoke afterwards to one of their representatives(not about the disc choice) regarding the a11sr and he couldnt tell me if there would be much difference between that and my 3801. The sound that they had during the demo was so dissapointing and no were near as well set up as my 3801- which sounded tonnes better. So upgrade deffinately binned. I then went off (with wife in tow) i went into the rel room and saw the new quake( GOD IS IT SMALL !!) I have a paradim pdr10 which is twice the size! After talking to the rep he said he'd demo it with a movie-WOW !! ~For such a small box it sounds really tight and deep- much better than my paradim. The rep was the most knowledgeable rep that i had spoken to all day at the show!! I asked him if he would throw in a neutric cable if i bought one today he did - so I bought one! My system now sounds much better.

DENON was rubbish REL were great!!!
- I know wich mini sub I'd buy.

scott.

 

[juboy]

scott, your experience reminds me of my trip to the Cyrus stand at the Bristol Hi Fi Show last year... I had the cash (and intention) with me to buy two more Smart Powers but the two guys hosting the room were so ignorant and uninterested that I simply walked back out of the room and went on to enjoy the rest of the show.

 

[Geoffrey Shrek]

Originally posted by scott
The rep was the most knowledgeable rep that i had spoken to all day at the show!! I asked him if he would throw in a neutric cable if i bought one today he did - so I bought one! My system now sounds much better.

Joey,
He wasn't your brother in law was he?
i heard this in a dealer and it sounded crap. He had a B&W sub dont know which one, next to it that blew it away.
quake makes a nice footstall though
By the way, I bought a Denon A1SR and I think you're off your rocker to say your baby 3801 sounds better.

 

[scott]

hi joey,

the point of my reply wasn't to have a go at the Denon. I actually went along -with cash in hand ready to buy one! I was just so dissapointed by the demo that in my opinion the upgrade really wasn't necessary. After listening to quite a few more films and music since- I really am happy with my current setup. I think the only way forward would be to spend alot more money ( maybe the new arcams) On the point of the Quake it really is a good little sub, for £300 im certaintly not complaining! Every where I go for a demo on any item I invariably come away dissapointed by the quality of setup and sometimes service, it seems that most people that work in the shops just arent as interested as we are.
Anyway later im going to put my feet up (probably on the Quake) and feed my baby with some DVD.

scott.

 

[uncle eric]

Originally posted by scott
i to went along to the mcr show on the sat morning, i went mainly to try and hear denons avc-a11sr (i own a 3801) i sat in prime position in there first demo of day,although this was with avc-a1sr,they did good opening talk saying they had been up all night deciding on the best dvds to demo, besides a clip from a thx demo disc first it was behind enemy lines then some talk scene i cant remember then their piste-de-resistance flashdance !! talk abou dissapointing, i spoke afterwards to one of their representatives(not about the disc choice) regarding the a11sr and he couldnt tell me if there would be much difference between that and my 3801. The sound that they had during the demo was so dissapointing and no were near as well set up as my 3801- which sounded tonnes better. So upgrade deffinately binned.
scott.

Scott,
I'd like to add something if I may.
First of all, it occurs to me that the "representative" that couldn't tell you the difference between the 3801 and A1SR probably wasn't from Denon. Roland Brooks is the CRT guy who provided and set up the dual stack 1209's for the Denon room.
Richard Ansell is employed by Snell & Wilcox and while his knowledge on all things video is beyond reproach, he's not really into what the various Denon models actually do.
Roger Batchelor on the other hand does work for Denon and his knowledge regarding Denons range is of course encylopedic. Therefore, the chances that you asked the right guy about the A1SR is slim or none.

After a chat with these fine gents, Ian J, Charlie Whitehouse and myself sat down for the same demo you had. I have to concur that we all said more or less what you said. The sound quality was well behind par. One of us even mentioned the word anaemic. Why was this?????

Quite simple really!!! As an installer, the first thing that I look at when entering a room............is the room itself.
The Denon room was at least 30ft x 20ft x 10ft (Length, Width, Height) and I think I'm being forgiving here.

This makes the total volume some 6000 cubic feet and possibly even larger. The THX Ultra/2 spec to which the A1SR is a club member is meant for rooms of up to 3000 cubic feet. Keywords "up to". The Denons humble (140-150 watts) all channels driven power rating was in trouble from the off. In short, the Kef's and Denon were never going to achieve dynamic, gutsy sound at reference levels in a room of this size. In fact, I think they were pushed a little too hard to actually try and cope with the sheer size of the room.

Now you transfer that Denon to an average living room of say somthing like mine 16ft x 14ft x 8ft (1792 cubic feet) and you will hear a total transformation in more ways than one.

The moral of the story? I'll let you decide.

 

[Member 14718]

Hi Burt

I notice by your post that you cannot find a dealer in Northern Ireland. I searched MJ's web site to no avail, so I phoned the number on their dealer page and they say there is a shop called Moore Hi Fi in Co. Down.

Good Luck

 

[SOUNDSTYLE]

Originally posted by scott
The rep was the most knowledgeable rep that i had spoken to all day at the show!! I asked him if he would throw in a neutric cable if i bought one today he did - so I bought one! My system now sounds much better.
scott. [/B]

I thought that all REL's came with a neutrik cable as standard?