What Projector

[thedude]

Hey everyone, my budget is about the 2-3k mark and I've been looking at the uhd65, tw9400

from the back wall to the front wall is 3.29m

Im looking to get a 92" screen out of it at 16:9 (max size of 205cm wide)

I watch mainly 4k blurays and my walls and all-white apart from one that's blue! my rooms fairly dark at night but not black out dark.

 

[ShanePJ]

Looking at the throw ratio's both projectors will just about squeeze in, but you are on the absolute edge of the tolerances according to the throw ratio calculations once you have take the depth of each projector plus space for cabling at the rear. So this is far less than ideal and any discrepancy (which happen with projection due to differences in the lens manufacturing for better and worse) could come and bit you by not filling the screen.

Taking these measurements, it seems as though the Optoma UHD65 may give you up to 3cm extra over the Epson EH-TW9400 which really shows you how tight your throw is and for me it's a little close to recommend both as an absolute solution for that room.

If you are happy to take the risk, then as you're able to control the room conditions at night to a degree, you should be fine with both

Regarding the general clinical side viewing, the Optoma should be sharper (its really is a DLP thing with less components to interfere with the outputting image (filters etc...)) whereas the Epson in reality will not be a million miles away on a 92" screen from your distance (but if you're watching 4K and had both side by size, you would see the differences from the Optoma).

As you are not going to have both playing next to each other, I'd say, once the film has started, both projectors will pull you in and even though they have differences, neither is poor in reality (it really doesn't happen at this price point). What could happen though is that because the room isn't ideal, the Epson should show you have it works in rooms which are less than ideal which is something DLP's are not as forgiving with black level detail.

But the Optoma (within its black level ability) will have a better gray scale that is ideal for shadow detail. and even though the Epson should be better however if it cannot produce a better black level than the Optoma, then it will loose out to it as the gray scale is where most of the colours are made up due to shadow detail. The end result is you may find that you will see more colour when watching the Optoma because of this. If you do pay more attention to the room light levels, then the Espon will show why many people do enjoy the Epson overall

So, which will be better is not a straight forward answer as it will really depend upon the room and I feel it will ultimately depend upon how much effort you put into controlling the rooms light level.
Would I be disappointed with either, nope as both are extremely good and neither is significantly better than the other (in my opinion) for watching films in a room which is less than perfect once you become familiar with them. The only real thing that bothers me as I've mentioned above is the short distance you have open to you. If you was able to reduce the screen size by 2" then that would be more comfortable (using a 90" diagonal screen) but these are not as widely available

 

[tegonik]

On these two projectors the Epson is miles ahead. The 6-7.000:1 native contrast compare to the 800:1 on the UHD65 it is not even comparable. The Epson has better lens too so the sharpness will be better although we are talking for a 3LCD projector VS one chip DLP. There is no comparison on these two models. Epson is far ahead if you want my opinion...

 

[thedude]

On these two projectors the Epson is miles ahead. The 6-7.000:1 native contrast compare to the 800:1 on the UHD65 it is not even comparable. The Epson has better lens too so the sharpness will be better although we are talking for a 3LCD projector VS one chip DLP. There is no comparison on these two models. Epson is far ahead if you want my opinion...

Where do you get the native contrast levels for them?

 

[tegonik]

Where do you get the native contrast levels for them?

I have measure them by myself. (not on TW9400 but on the previous moedel TW9300, i suppose the TW9400 have the same or even better native on/off contrast)

 

[ShanePJ]

On these two projectors the Epson is miles ahead. The 6-7.000:1 native contrast compare to the 800:1 on the UHD65 it is not even comparable. The Epson has better lens too so the sharpness will be better although we are talking for a 3LCD projector VS one chip DLP. There is no comparison on these two models. Epson is far ahead if you want my opinion...

We are each allowed to have our opinions, yet over the years of being in the industry, I have yet to seen a 3LCD chip projector at the same value outperform a single chip DLP projector for clarity and sharpness. 3LCD Chip projectors also tend to have a much brighter lamp to create a similar contrast and this is basically because a DLP projector will reflect the light through its colour wheel whereas the LCD will loose light from passing light through each chip. You will also find that they will also be many more filters on and LCD projector zapping further lumens from the projector. As for the for sharpness side, we only have to mention the convergence issues when trying to align these ultra tiny chips which have been magnified to huge screen sizes. One thing I will add its amazing that the convergence is so good out of the box and a testimony to the engineers work in the first place. It's also fantastic that as end users we even have the ability to adjust further to get them as close as possible (but sadly even on a 92" screen, you will never get all three chips aligned perfectly as that's just impossible and this is where the sharpness will always fail on any 3 chip device even if the lens is slightly better - With that said, Optoma has always used good quality lenses on their premium projectors which again shouldn't allow the this Epson to outperforming on sharpness when viewing with a critical eye).

I have measure them by myself. (not on TW9400 but on the previous moedel TW9300, i suppose the TW9400 have the same or even better native on/off contrast)

So, even though you're measurements show one thing, how did you perform the test. Was it as a dynamic (native on/off) or ansi test as it's ought to be. If it was a dynamic test, this will not simultaneously measures the room and the projector black and white levels giving you a real World single measurement. Out of interest what picture setting did you have both projectors on and what features were turned on and off to give you such a difference?

As for black detail on the Epson. I concur that it is stronger for black levels, Epson have been producing solid black detail since the 9000 (and that was a turning point for LCD) and for the original question which I answered above, so long as the room can show what the Epson can do at these levels, which in this instance could be debatable, it could be trumped by the Optoma and this is simply because of how the technology works and its nothing against the Epson, but more over the room conditions which let the projector down in this area

 

[tegonik]

I take on/off contrast measurements with the clasic way. No dynamic black or auto iris, just pure native blacks and whites. The ansi contrast is a different contrast and on both projector gives almost the same measurement (~400:1). The ~7.000:1 native contrast of TW9400 compare to the 800:1 that Optoma gives, it is a huge difference, you can not just walk away with this.
As far as concerning the lenses, i am sorry to say, but optoma does not use good quality lenses any more even at the top range models. So the result is a DLP projector with foucs, sharpness and clarity that reminds 10 years old 3 chip projector. Also the color aberration on these lenses is terrible and gives you the impression that you watching a misalignment 3LCD projector.
One the other hand Epson had make a huge step on the TW9300-9400 series with a good quality motorized zoom/focus and an almost perfect factory panel alignment. The result is a nice crispy and detailed picture.
My opinion is that there is no comparison on these two models, the Epson is far ahead as far as concerning the picture quality. The UHD65 is just another DLP model...

(this screenshots is from my review on TW9300)

 

[thedude]

Sorry I'm a little lost! How did you measure the native contrast of the projector at home? Is this possible?

I have had a dlp before but never an lcd projector.
My room I don't think will ever be pitch black. Although it gets dark at night it's a living room first and foremost

 

[tegonik]

Sorry I'm a little lost! How did you measure the native contrast of the projector at home? Is this possible?

I have had a dlp before but never an lcd projector.
My room I don't think will ever be pitch black. Although it gets dark at night it's a living room first and foremost

It is very simple. You put your lux meter 20-30cm facing the lens of the projector (the lens at the tele position). First you put a 100IRE pattern and take the measurement, and then you put the 0IRE pattern and take another measurement. After you make the division and you have your on/off contrast.
You confuse the on/off contrast with the ansi contrast. On the ansi contrast the method is almost the same, but the projector has to throw on a black material in order to observe the light and avoid the reflections. The ansi contrast you don't have to measure it, we know how much is the ansi contrast on a DLP for example (~400:1, and for most projectors is on that range). The on/off is something you have to care about.

 

[moujik]

Hey everyone, my budget is about the 2-3k mark and I've been looking at the uhd65, tw9400

from the back wall to the front wall is 3.29m

Im looking to get a 92" screen out of it at 16:9 (max size of 205cm wide)

I watch mainly 4k blurays and my walls and all-white apart from one that's blue! my rooms fairly dark at night but not black out dark.

I believe for 92" from 3m watching distance, 4k is an overkill.
There are also 85" TVs in that price range.

What about the 3.29 wall, can you project on that instead? Then just get a short throw pj and have a massive screen!

 

[thedude]

85 tv isnt an option, i only want a large screen for occasional use and nothing is overkill for 4k!

 

[moujik]

85 tv isnt an option, i only want a large screen for occasional use and nothing is overkill for 4k!

overkill in the sense that you won't be able to tell the difference between 4k and 1080p

 

[thedude]

Surely the closer you are to a screen the more you notice the difference?