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What ever happened to THE ACTION MOVIE

Discussion in 'Movie Forum' started by dUnKle, Aug 23, 2001.

  1. dUnKle

    dUnKle
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    were have they all gone, I have just watched EXIT WOUNDS and it was like the majority of all action films recently, just a couple of good fights towards the end in a "matrix" type style

    Im not after much, loads of shoot outs, plenty of punches and kicking, a few car chases ( preferably with shooting ) and all set to a pumping techno type soundtrack, but they seem thin ( almost anorexic ) on the ground !

    Why is this ? What happened to the Leathal Weapons, the Arnie movies, the Bruce Willis and the Nicholas Cage films with tons of bullets and everything that ( used to ) make the genre great.

    I want some good action films <img src="smile.gif" border="0">
     
  2. PoochJD

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    Duncan,

    You said: "What happened to the Leathal Weapons, the Arnie movies, the Bruce Willis and the Nicholas Cage films with tons of bullets and everything that ( used to ) make the genre great."

    Ummm, I think you'll find that they were all done to death! When was the last truly great Arnie film? When was the last truly great Bruce Willis movie, that didn't involve the supernatural?!

    If you want quality action films, try some of the Hong Kong Legends titles, as their are plenty of them, that aren't all martial-arts stuff, that will interest you, I'm sure.

    Pooch
     
  3. dUnKle

    dUnKle
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    I love these done to death movies, who cares if they have no plot, they fill the saturday evening gap before the pub perfectly
     
  4. General Skanky

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    I'm with you on this one Duncan. We need something to feed our jelly brains! <img src="smile.gif" border="0">
     
  5. Ars longa, vita brevis

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    beer and action films, the way it should be

    i just bought firestorm, that will probably be really ****, but hey, its a witless action film, you can crank up the volume and take the **** out of it and enjoy a beer at the same time.

    i was just wondering what was the last good arnie action film, last one i can remember is true lies, were there any after that?
     
  6. Juzminator

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    Sorry Pooch - I'm with Dunc, The General and Ars on this one mate <img src="rolleyes.gif" border="0">

    I too, love the big, dumb, no-brainer hollywood action movies of yore (Tango & Cash, Last Boy Scout anyone? <img src="smile.gif" border="0"> ).

    Like somebody's said more than once on this forum: why is it you can watch a no-brainer with loadsa guns/cars/explosions/gadgets over and over again and still enjoy it, but re-watching a dialogue-heavy "more worthy" film is relatively hard?

    Anyway - where have they all gone?
     
  7. dUnKle

    dUnKle
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    Yes indeed, perhaps its time for the 80s sequals <img src="smile.gif" border="0">

    Tango and Cash II<br />Last Boy Scout II<br />Commando II<br />Raw Deal II

    Evan have to raid my LD collection at times for films such as HARD TARGET ( I love this, one of the best pure kick ass films I have seen, must get a 5.1 DVD when I see it cheap ) SUDDEN IMPACT, BROKEN ARROW, UNIVERSAL SOLDIER

    Another top action movie ( slated by all ) that I like is Soldier, which was kinda like Commando in Space.

    Just out of interest but what is firestorm ?
     
  8. Ars longa, vita brevis

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  9. Ars longa, vita brevis

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    so what was the last good action film you enjoyed, i think the last good one i can remember is the rock, there may be a few after that, i cant remember.
     
  10. PoochJD

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    Hi All,

    I was in no way slating "brainless" action films. I love them, as much as you folks all do! Hell, "Die Hard", "Commando", et al are all great fun movies. However, I was only answering Duncan's original question, that in my opinion, the "action" genre had pretty much been done to death, and hence there is now very few decent "mindless" action/adventure movies that are any good.

    Of course, there will always be plenty of Steven Seagal and Jean-Claude Van Damme films filling-up your local Blockbuster or wherever, if you like that kind of thing, but I don't think that was quite what Duncan meant. After all, there is a big difference between a "mindless" action flick, and a "crap" action flick!

    Whilst not in quite the same area, I rewatched the superb "The Negotiator" again, last night, and that's got a reasonable amount of action scenes, without requiring too much brain-power. And it's fun trying to spot where all the actors have been seen before. (ANyone notice that Paul Guilfoyle who plays Nate, or Nathan, is now the character of Brass in Channel 5's superb US drama show "CSI: Crime Scene Investigation"?!)

    Anyway, this is only my opinion, so feel free to ignore it or take the complete opposite viewpoint, if you wish to. <img src="wink.gif" border="0">

    Pooch
     
  11. Reiner

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    The Rock and Face/Off also rank on top of my list and IMHO there has been nothing to match after those.<br />Closest comes perhaps Swordfish, I did really enjoy that one - but as I said above, it's not on par.

    The Negotiator is also one of my fav, is as The Long Kiss Goodnight (cool DVD release with lot's of LFE), Broken Arrow, Speed and, not to forget, Bad Boys "What you gonna do ...".<br />The rest goes more towards Sci-Fi, like MiB, The Matrix and Terminator (1 and 2).
     
  12. dUnKle

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    The Action Movie it seems has been turned into a new genre, according to the back of EXIT WOUNDS and a few other of the recemt action films they are now called ACTION THRILLERS.

    So what we now have are films which would be very rubbish thrillers having a couple of Matrix Style fights and called an Action Thriller, it just does not work for me <img src="frown.gif" border="0">

    Last good action films ? CHRALIES ANGELS, fights and techno music, great <img src="smile.gif" border="0"> also DRIVE ( although its getting on a bit ) Other top films of recent years are BROKEN ARROW, LONG KISS GOODNIGHT, THE ROCK, CON AIR and FACE-OFF. But I love a good Segal or Van Dam movie, really like Under Siege and Hard Target.

    As long as it has the fights, the guns and the music I am happy. Yes some of the HKL movies are good, but far too many of them are set in some mythical ancient world and that does not light my fire <img src="frown.gif" border="0"> I enjoyed Purple Storm but I feel it would have been better with a Prodigy type soundtrack and a couple of B list hollywood actors <img src="smile.gif" border="0">
     
  13. philmate

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    Unfortunately Duncan I believe these action film actors are to old now and there is'nt any actors like these to fill their boots for good action films, the only other film I can think of right now is Blade,loads of fights etc and the soundtrack is immense fun.Ah, just thought of one but irritatingly can't remember the title.But it had Christopher Lambert in a futuristic jail,not sure if on DVD yet but that was great fun.

    Philmate.
     
  14. squid

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    firestorm is ok . i saw it on sky a while ago .

    there are a few guns involved <img src="biggrin.gif" border="0"> <img src="biggrin.gif" border="0">
     
  15. Guest

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    Ive always thought 'Predator' was a brilliant action film, decent acting, great action, great directing, just great.<br />That is what I call a 'pure' action film, where there is no sub-plot, no side story to divert attention from.

    Although its my own personal opinion, I thought the Negotiator was OK, nothing great,bit corny, cheesy dialogue and full of the usual Hollywood codes and conventions, black-bonding, moral ethics etc.
     
  16. PoochJD

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    Philmate,

    You said: "Ah, just thought of one but irritatingly can't remember the title. But it had Christopher Lambert in a futuristic jail,not sure if on DVD yet but that was great fun.!"

    I think it's probably "Fortress". As for DVD availability, I don't know. Alternatively, there was another very-similar-in-themes movie, called "No Escape". I think it had Ray Liotta in it, if memory serves.

    Does this ring bells to anyone else on here?

    Pooch
     
  17. Reiner

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    I think you are spot on with 'Fortress' and 'No Escape' though I personally wouldn't rank them very high. As well 'Predator' did never really appeal to me. But that's just my opinion or bad taste ... <img src="wink.gif" border="0">

    Acutally it looks like really good action movies are very rare now, this "action thriller" thing might not be what people want (though I am looking forward to 'Along came a Spider' which probably fits into this category). Ah, what the hell, Hollywood seems only be able to produce sequels, prequels and remakes nowadays - I guess all the script writers suffer from braindead - or do they just want to cash in on some successfull films? Now what would me make think that!? <img src="confused.gif" border="0">
     
  18. BadAss

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    I think Pearl Harbor has spurned an even newer type of movie, the action love story. Or was it Titanic that started that one? Still if they had of put a few more Air to Air combat scenes in earlier on this would of been a classic.
     
  19. Reiner

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    But that's the problem, nothing new and innovative, not necessarily limited to action movies:

    It's either a sequel (MI:2, JP III, Dr. Doolitle 2 ...), a prequel (Star Wars Ep. I, II, III, Along came a Spider, Austin Powers 3) or a lousy remake (Psycho comes to mind), besides the funny - and certainly not coincidental - "equal-story" movies: one time asteroids (Deep Impact, Armageddon), then high-budget over-long over-budget love stories (Titanic, Pearl Harbour), then mutated animals (Lake Placid, Anaconda, Deep Blue Sea - all IMHO crap) and so on and so forth.<br />Not to mention those copy-cat slow-mo or "bullet-time" (as called in 'The Matrix) scenes and the overly use of special effects, spoiling most movies actually.<br />Years ago people did better jobs using models or other tricks, making it (look) more authentic and believable.

    Like I said: braindead cash-in shemes, I just hope people are intelligent enough not to support this any further.<br />Last time going to the movies was fun and usually I left the cinema satisfied, but lately there have been to many disappointments.<br />Well, luckily we have DVD and I can watch my favs over and over.

    BTW: As for "the action movie" I also rank Desperado as one of the best (ok, it's a sequel, too, but a better one at least - IMHO).

    [ 27-08-2001: Message edited by: Reiner ]</p>
     
  20. PoochJD

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    Reiner,

    I agree almost entirely with what you say about sequels and prequels.

    However, as some of you may already know, there is only 7 or 8 actual "original" ideas, for movie scripts. Every script is one of these 7, or mixes some of them together. But, there is nothing original anymore.

    You also missed that other trend, of movies about "reality TV" - "The Truman Show", "Ed TV", and "Series 7 - The Contenders", although "Series 7" was actually reasonably good.

    Pooch
     
  21. DPS

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    Personally I think Raiders of the lost ark is a better action film than any Commando,Die Hard or Matrix style movie.
     
  22. Reiner

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    You are right about the 7 or 8 original ideas, I think what I wanted to say is there is nothing new inside those categories. Sequels and the like don't make one category I guess but that seems to be the easiest way of making money (or at least trying to) without too much thinking - and that's what ****es me off.<br />Hell, I bet there are millions of books out there which would make good movies or lot's of screenwriters which are just waiting for a chance but aren't given any, because it's just so easy "to make people buy an inferior product". <img src="frown.gif" border="0">
     
  23. Miniholic

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    I've got to agree with you guys, we definately need more no brainer action movies. Saw planet ogf the apes the other night, but wasn't that impressed. Great make up, effects and everything, but no where near as good as i expected.

    Can't relly think what the last good action movie i saw was, maybe saving private ryan (is that war or action? are they the same?). The action i Pearl Harbour was good, but the love story was way too distracting.

    As for car chases, gone in 60 seconds was the best i've seen in a few years, but not a match for the vanishing point et al 70's films.

    Ian<br />ian@miniholics.co.uk
     
  24. Dirk 2

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    Until the 80's big budget action films were not so common.The Bond franchise led the field.

    Action films were often more plot driven, and yes even the brits still made them.

    What has killed them in the 90's? Political correctness and **** editing and direction.

    Take a 70's action movie such as "Wild Geese". Good pacing, solid cast, not too implausible script. Excellent 2nd unit direction and stunt coordination.

    Compare "Magnum Force" with a "Lethal Weapon3" movie. One is lean, plot driven, punctuated with minimal but hard hitting action sequences. The other is a self indulgent string of set pieces link by a pitiful attempt at a plot. (I'm picking on the 3rd installment co's it was the worst and not written by Shane Black, master of action movie scripts).

    The bench mark that all action movies should be compared too is "Where Eagles Dare". This is a masterpiece that flows, beautifully.

    "Charlie's Angels" is the epitome of everything that has killed this genre. Digital effects mitigate what real craftmen like Jackie Chan can really do. Superficial, hollow, poorly crafted (yes Hollywood editor type, multiple rapid edits don't always work.E.g. slo mo climax of "The Wild Bunch" good. Anything by Michael Bay, pants).

    Who the hell is Mc G anyway? Made a few Korn videos? Well la de da. This movie should be expunged from existence.

    Rant over
     
  25. PoochJD

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    HI,

    What about Brian DePalma's superb 1987 action/drama "The Untouchables"?! That's a corker!

    Plus, there's always "Runaway Train" (Written by a Japanese, starring Americans, and directed by a Russian!), or "La Femme Nikita" (The excellent French thriller, and prequel-of-sorts to "Leon"!)

    Pooch
     
  26. BadAss

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    Planet of the apes is the biggest no brainer in ages. Lets look back and what do we get? A good storyline? Ehhh, did I miss something or wasn't there one. The special effects? Ehhh, nothing to write home about, can't remeber anything special about them. The acting? Ehhh, a lot of mumbling and bad lisps. The make-up? Ok it was good but once youve seen one ape youve seen them all.

    I knew it wasn't that good before I went into the cinema so why did I pay £5 to go in and watch it? Oh yes so I didn't have to spend £17 to watch it on DVD. Bargin!
     
  27. Guest

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    First posted under "Is it time to revisit so called turkeys" in General Chat.<br />There were a lot of very good gun ho 15/18 rated Sci Fi/Action Films during the 80's but it is almost if the film Industry got embassed to make such movies and then moved on to making weak action Less movies for 12 year olds were are the Next Generation Paul Venoven's his moves are great although he did try to go main stream FOOL.

    Its my opinion that this year and to a lesser extent last year have lacked any really MUST SEE blockbusters and than the Idustry as for a few years now cared to much about spin off sales in the form of lunchboxes and colouring books. The effect of this is that any really Big film as to be made with the 12 year old market in mind which sadly means no swearing of serious Killing.

    Add to this the fact that Kids get to see all films while under age (we own so many of them and often use little or no control) that makers sadly have to bear this in mind, So it becomes Inceasinly easier to make a kids film in the first place. Look at the Pop world its aimed at 8 to 12 year olds.

    Lets have more solid 15 and 18 rated films.

    [ 29-08-2001: Message edited by: General Pasty ]</p>
     
  28. gargoyle

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    The sad fact is that film makers are running out of ideas - think about it - some of the best action/adventure movies ever made came from the eighties - here's a few examples - Aliens, Predator,Terminator,Highlander,Die Hard, Bladerunner,Indi Jones - I could go on but the point is that all these films have one thing in common - technology - today,we have computer generated graphics which means that almost anything a film maker puts his mind to,can be realised-Final Fantasy anyone? However,its now so easy to get bigger,flashier,jaw dropping sfx that what we see nowadays is'nt a blockbuster but a showpiece for the latest computer generated sfx technology and the most important part of the film - the story - gets a back seat. The titles mentioned above relied on traditional optical/mechanical sfx which was only capable of so much so the story took precedent-Maybe its me, but it seems that every blockbuster I watch these days looks and sounds the same-spectacular imagery but plot-lite. <img src="mad.gif" border="0">

    [ 29-08-2001: Message edited by: gargoyle ]</p>
     
  29. Reiner

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    I would say you are spot on, Gargoyle. No plots, just some SFX scenes somehow pasted together (Tomb Raider for example, lousy movie IMHO).

    BadAss' example of Planet of the Apes is one of those I mentioned before: a remake of a classic - and most have failed at that (Psycho the worst example).<br />Name one which beats the original, I can't come up with one.

    Just waiting for the day when they want to re-do Casablanca ... <img src="eek.gif" border="0">
     
  30. SILVERBACK

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    am i the only person to think the hong kong legends movies an crouching crap hidden rubbish are a total joke.i mean those films really do suck ass.the last action no brainer i seen that i enjoyed was rush hour 2 although i aint keen on jackie you have to admire his skill especially when his acting is so bad lol
     

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