Warner CEO Unconvinced By PS3 Argument

Rasczak

Distinguished Member
AV Zombie has posted a report that the CEO of Warner isn't convinced that the PS3 will have a significant impact on the format war:

According to Time Warner CEO Richard Parson, the adoption of Blu-ray by Sony’s PlayStation 3 will not prove decisive in the next generation format war. Warner currently provides software in both formats, however Parson has been quoted by Reuters as saying that consumers buy the PS3 as a games machine first and foremost. He says the console will not drive a great conversion to Blu-ray movie software.

Meanwhile, HD DVD continues to be the darling of the internet chattering class. According to a study of blog and discussion board posts by trend measurement company Cymfony there were 46 percent more ‘positive discussions’ about HD DVD than Blu-ray.

The operation looked at over 17,000 posts on over 300 blogs and noted HD DVD was the subject of the most positive banter.
 
Well, yeah the late release has almost killed the PS3. The Wii has sold out everywhere, and nobody has any stock left. Argos never even got their supply in the end. Nintendo were as surprised as everyone else. So even though they argue that people buy the PS3 as a games machine, even this has been reduced in numbers. So less people are going to be holding their free Blue-Ray ticket in their games machine.
 

BadAss

Banned
These sort of threads are getting ridiculous.

So now that we have the Samsung, Panasonic, Sony, Philips, PS3, BD50's, VC-1/AVC and MPEG-2, Firmware upgrades, lots of PCM tracks and DTS-HD tracks, good reviews and a big jump in sales. Now we have to argue who talking about what format the most! I mean, come on.
 
These sort of threads are getting ridiculous.

So now that we have the Samsung, Panasonic, Sony, Philips, PS3, BD50's, VC-1/AVC and MPEG-2, Firmware upgrades, lots of PCM tracks and DTS-HD tracks, good reviews and a big jump in sales. Now we have to argue who talking about what format the most! I mean, come on.

Getting worried you went with the wrong format are we? The fact is Badass Hd-dvds are outselling blu-rays.... Doesnt take a genius to work out which formats going to be in the bargin bin soon...
 

Rasczak

Distinguished Member
These sort of threads are getting ridiculous.

So now that we have the Samsung, Panasonic, Sony, Philips, PS3, BD50's, VC-1/AVC and MPEG-2, Firmware upgrades, lots of PCM tracks and DTS-HD tracks, good reviews and a big jump in sales. Now we have to argue who talking about what format the most! I mean, come on.

BadAss - you are going to give yourself an ulcer if you continue this one man fight againt the internet. Save yourself some stress - buy a shiny new HD DVD player to accompany your Sammy, go dual format and let the war wash over you content in the knowledge you can have any high def title :thumbsup:
 
D

Deleted member 63580

Guest
So now that we have the Samsung, Panasonic, Sony, Philips, PS3, BD50's, VC-1/AVC and MPEG-2, Firmware upgrades, lots of PCM tracks and DTS-HD tracks, good reviews and a big jump in sales.

And Blu Ray is still running last.
 

gandley

Well-known Member
If there are no announcements in favour of HD-DVD at CES, then blu ray is still a contender, if not the format that will drive forward thru 2007.

The early release list going around for blu rays 2007 line up is looking killer.

and on a sad note the PS3's blu ray playback is a tad soft for my liking at present.

I would say if the BR backers could just relasese a disc and say, "do that on a single HD_DVD disc" then it would provide the killer ape the tech savy require.

I await CES to see if there is any advancements.
 

HeweyBoy101

Active Member
I was all geared up to buy a BD player to go along with my existing HD-A1. I'd always intended to go dual format. However, I've decided to hold off a while - I just detect that there is a shift towards HD-DVD lately, and I don't want to make an expensive mistake.

There is precious little on BD that I actually want to own at present anyway, and all the internet comment is largely pro HD-DVD - regardless of what forum you read. If you look at the BD forum on here - looks like a fairly lonely place to be!

I'm not against BD - I'll get it if I have to, and certainly the inclusion of DTS-HD MA is an attraction for me. I might have bought the Panaosnic by now if it could handle the lossless DTS format. I didn't go for HD-DVD until the DolbyTrueHD firmware upgrade was actually available. It's amazing (on both formats) how they will rush a product to market before it's actually finished !
 

jsgreen89

Active Member
The early release list going around for blu rays 2007 line up is looking killer.

Any link for this?
If there really is some great stuff coming out, then I might buy a BR player. But so far NOTHING on BR appeals to me, apart from "The Terminator". I've just checked the release list on HiDefDigest, and excluding Dual-format releases, I would only consider "Commando", and that's not exactly a classic.

If they said the Alien saga or Star Wars were coming out.. then I might be persuaded!
 

JP73

Active Member
Any link for this?
If there really is some great stuff coming out, then I might buy a BR player. But so far NOTHING on BR appeals to me, apart from "The Terminator". I've just checked the release list on HiDefDigest, and excluding Dual-format releases, I would only consider "Commando", and that's not exactly a classic.

If they said the Alien saga or Star Wars were coming out.. then I might be persuaded!

Terminator 2 will be released in Europe on HD-DVD if thats of any interest to you. Quite a few of the US Bluray exclusives are getting released on HDDVD courtesy of european distributors.
To be honest, confirmed upcoming releases on both formats are looking a little bland. Bluray's selection in particular,consists pretty much of bubblegum movies. Amazon.com are listing some very interesting titles but with very little details. I doubt these have been confirmed by the studios but they are listing both the Matrix and Lord of the Rings trilogies on HDDVD. No word on Star Wars as yet, although I did read somewhere that it may feature next year on HD as part of a mega anniversary set. The only Aliens movie is AvP on Bluray.
No doubt Badass will be along to put me straight about the great titles Bluray have upcoming:D
 

jsgreen89

Active Member
Terminator 2 will be released in Europe on HD-DVD if thats of any interest to you. Quite a few of the US Bluray exclusives are getting released on HDDVD courtesy of european distributors.
To be honest, confirmed upcoming releases on both formats are looking a little bland. Bluray's selection in particular,consists pretty much of bubblegum movies. Amazon.com are listing some very interesting titles but with very little details. I doubt these have been confirmed by the studios but they are listing both the Matrix and Lord of the Rings trilogies on HDDVD. No word on Star Wars as yet, although I did read somewhere that it may feature next year on HD as part of a mega anniversary set. The only Aliens movie is AvP on Bluray.
No doubt Badass will be along to put me straight about the great titles Bluray have upcoming:D

AvP? Where do I sign? :rotfl:

"The Deer Hunter" and "The Sting" are certainly not bland in my book :clap:
 

JP73

Active Member
AvP? Where do I sign? :rotfl:

"The Deer Hunter" and "The Sting" are certainly not bland in my book :clap:

I was looking a bit further forward into next year:D Yes i'm looking forward to the Deer Hunter myself. Certainly the HD-DVD studios are a little bit more discerning in the main,in what they are putting out. Maybe Bluray is hoping to appeal to a different demographic, who knows? Certainly, for me anyway, the HDDVD line up is more appealing.
Yeah, AvP...told you, bubblegum movies.
 

Oakleyspatz

Well-known Member
It was the same with DVD at the beginning. They save all the really good titles for when the format has reached a certain market penetration. Just look how long it took Star Wars to make it onto DVD! Must have been 9 years after DVD began before the original trilogy hit the format.
 

gandley

Well-known Member
It was the same with DVD at the beginning. They save all the really good titles for when the format has reached a certain market penetration. Just look how long it took Star Wars to make it onto DVD! Must have been 9 years after DVD began before the original trilogy hit the format.

and no doubt we wont see starwars until either there is one format or both formats make a big impact. God if starwars turned up on either of the formats, that would be a huge blow to the rival format.
 

JP73

Active Member
It was the same with DVD at the beginning. They save all the really good titles for when the format has reached a certain market penetration. Just look how long it took Star Wars to make it onto DVD! Must have been 9 years after DVD began before the original trilogy hit the format.

Wouldn't agree 100% with you there...I was a very early adopter of DVD with an import Panasonic player ( which was a great player and was still in service before i retired it for the HDDVD!) and can remember that they had some great titles in the early days. What really attracted me to the format, and laserdisc before that, was the availability of all the titles that weren't available or were banned here...its amazing to think now of the lengths you had to go to to acquire copies of certain movies which you can walk into HMV and pick up now...and it wasn't that long ago either!
Star Wars is pretty much an example of Lucas being eccentric/greedy, milking a few more cinematic releases before committing to DVD but i've no doubt it will arrive on HD next year...though which format is anyone's guess!
 

JP73

Active Member
and no doubt we wont see starwars until either there is one format or both formats make a big impact. God if starwars turned up on either of the formats, that would be a huge blow to the rival format.

Actually, given the previous history of Star Wars releases, a format war is probably a dream for Lucasfilm as they can issue another half a dozen releases on each format:D
 

gandley

Well-known Member
:D :smashin: NICE, thats probaly true.

Though i think starwars is distributed by 20th century fox iirc, could be wrong, but if not then its blu ray for SW
 

JP73

Active Member
:D :smashin: NICE, thats probaly true.

Though i think starwars is distributed by 20th century fox iirc, could be wrong, but if not then its blu ray for SW

Yes Fox are the distributors for the SW movies, although the Lucasfilm movies seem to be handled a bit differently in as much as they appear to have a lot more input into how and when their movies are released. It will be interesting to see how they play it. As you rightly say, Star Wars and Lord of the Rings are going to be heavy hitters, and Lord of the Rings seems to be headed to HDDVD!
 

Welwynnick

Distinguished Member
BadAss - you are going to give yourself an ulcer if you continue this one man fight againt the internet. Save yourself some stress - buy a shiny new HD DVD player to accompany your Sammy, go dual format and let the war wash over you content in the knowledge you can have any high def title :thumbsup:
No, he's not the only one to support Blu-ray. I'm supposed to be a bit more impartial, but this place is so one-sided that my instincts are to try and even things up a bit. And I'm really glad that someone has the guts to stick up for the apparent underdog, and use some rational, well-informed and level-headed discussion to do so. The ranters all seem to be on the HD DVD side. I have always favoured Blu-ray because I thought it would win the war - not because it's the better format. I guess I'm in it for the long haul, but I'll be there to say I told you so when the time comes....

Nick ;)
 

Oakleyspatz

Well-known Member
Wouldn't agree 100% with you there...I was a very early adopter of DVD with an import Panasonic player ( which was a great player and was still in service before i retired it for the HDDVD!) and can remember that they had some great titles in the early days. What really attracted me to the format, and laserdisc before that, was the availability of all the titles that weren't available or were banned here...its amazing to think now of the lengths you had to go to to acquire copies of certain movies which you can walk into HMV and pick up now...and it wasn't that long ago either!
Star Wars is pretty much an example of Lucas being eccentric/greedy, milking a few more cinematic releases before committing to DVD but i've no doubt it will arrive on HD next year...though which format is anyone's guess!

I admit, they did release some reasonable movies but they were not what you would call 'Top Draw' releases. I believe the first DVD released was Twister in 1996 in Japan.
I think we got titles such as Jumanji. Now these may be average movies but not exactly timeless blockbusters. I can think of countless other titles I would have rather seen to have kickstarted a new format.
The studios want to entice us, but not lay down their best cards from the outset. Otherwise, what will we have to look forward to and what will keep us locked into the format? It's like they are saying;

" These are good, but stay with us and you'll see there's much better to come!"
 

StooMonster

Well-known Member
The Wii has sold out everywhere, and nobody has any stock left. Argos never even got their supply in the end.
My brother-in-law received his Wii order from Argos on Friday 8-Dec-06, so they did get stock. My Woolies sourced Wii arrived a day late, damn couriers didn't get round to delivering it until 8am Saturday morning.

We were both lucky after getting pre-orders cancelled by PLAY.COM

Now, if only there was a Wii component cable to be had in UK.

StooMonster
 

gandley

Well-known Member
No, he's not the only one to support Blu-ray. I'm supposed to be a bit more impartial, but this place is so one-sided that my instincts are to try and even things up a bit. And I'm really glad that someone has the guts to stick up for the apparent underdog, and use some rational, well-informed and level-headed discussion to do so. The ranters all seem to be on the HD DVD side. I have always favoured Blu-ray because I thought it would win the war - not because it's the better format. I guess I'm in it for the long haul, but I'll be there to say I told you so when the time comes....

Nick ;)

well there is no doubt, and its lost on most around here, blu ray in the long term will offer the best option, for home HD media. The transfers from cetain houses are now very good (and getting better KOH), in line with HD-DVD. but in the long term blu ray offers more to us as end users and to HD media itself., which is why im a bit lost to all this babble about the death of either format, when there not even properly launched yet., tis like saying a baby will need a brace before its teeth have even grown.

Give it six months at least after both formats have had there global launches.
(main regions that is),

then let the slacking format have a battering, but this fanboy rubbish has just carried over from the early generation console boys who are now in there 30's. And all it does is confuse people even more, it dosent help, IT DOSENT HELP, becuse too much of it is based on personal opinion and preference, too much, "i think this", or "this will be what will happen", etc.
Why judge a format so early, if we did that with some of the early dvd quality then that format would of died early as well, I dunno but if blu ray pulls thru there will be a few red faces around here thats for sure.:D.

Now with that said, blu ray needs to get its butt in gear, but one thing i will say, each time i buy a HD-DVD, i really think hard before the purchase, i kinda hesitate, like i think im making a mistake. (like being 29stone and buying another chocky bar, not that im 29 stone mind )
 

Oakleyspatz

Well-known Member
No, he's not the only one to support Blu-ray. I'm supposed to be a bit more impartial, but this place is so one-sided that my instincts are to try and even things up a bit. And I'm really glad that someone has the guts to stick up for the apparent underdog, and use some rational, well-informed and level-headed discussion to do so. The ranters all seem to be on the HD DVD side. I have always favoured Blu-ray because I thought it would win the war - not because it's the better format. I guess I'm in it for the long haul, but I'll be there to say I told you so when the time comes....

Nick ;)

Before either of these formats went into production, I was full of , if not praise then at least optimism for Blu-Ray. Sony and their Blu-Ray partners can certainly talk the talk, focusing on the format's higher storage capacity and high profile studio support. But since then we have seen empty promises, products that seem ill-conceived, badly made, lacking in specification and over-priced.
The question we should be asking is not why do the HD-DVD supporters dislike Blu-Ray so much, but why do we still have Blu-Ray supporters at all?

What possible reasons can anyone have for supporting Blu-Ray?

1) Higher storage capacity discs- Are we really going to see a 50gb disc filled to the limit and if so, how much of that space will be utilised for improving the image/sound quality and how much with games, bonus features etc.? Sony believe that the consumer wants games and interactivity, not necessarily maximum image and sound quality. Are they correct?

2) More of the big Studio support- It would be naïve to think that any studio will not change to another format if that format proves more popular. Many are already producing movies for both formats and I am confident that number will increase as HD-DVD continues to gain support.

Errr....That's about it really. Not exactly a convincing argument to sway me so far.

Now what so far is counting against Blu-Ray?

1) Cost- Blu-Ray initially cost more to produce discs as the process is different to DVD and needed whole new production facilities built. HD-DVD on the other hand used existing, albeit modified, DVD facilities. The players are generally more than their HD-DVD counterparts.

2) Specification- The Samsung BD-P1000 retails for £1000 and the average price if you shop around is still over £800. But look at the spec and it stinks of a 'budget' model. No network ability, lacks some important HD audio support, no true 1080p output. You would imagine that if you upgraded to the £1300 Panasonic DMP-BD10 then these omissions would be rectified. Right? Wrong! Still no network ability (Blu-Ray are making a big thing about their BD Live interactivity which cannot be accessed on either of these players) and still no support for either Dolby TrueHD or DTS Master Audio. You could understand this on a £400 player, but on a £1300 one? Unforgivable!

3) Quality- Maybe not the fault of the players, but the decision to opt for using MPEG2 codecs on initial releases stinks of penny pinching and is almost certainly a price driven decision and not a quality one. Either way, objective comparisons have found these discs to be of a lower quality to those using MPEG4 codecs.

4) Reliability- There are reports of the new £1300 Panasonic DMP-BD10 'crashing' during playback, displaying a message blaming the disc(s) as the cause before promptly shutting down. Not what you would want from a £1300 investment! The Samsung too had 'image quality' issues which have now been resolved so I understand.

So it seems strange so far that Blu-Ray has any loyal supporters considering the facts.

HD DVD has what against it?

1) Lower storage capacity- Ok, 30gb may not be as good as 50gb, but it sure is plenty for a superb quality HD movie and then some. Using the more efficient MPEG4 codecs, releases to date have surpassed their Blu-Ray rivals as well as having ample added extras. Surely if 30gb is not enough to carry the movie and 30 hours of bonus material (Zzzz) then just have a 2 disc boxset! We love our boxsets don't we!

2) Less studio support- As mentioned, the studios will go where the money is. HD DVD is steadily but surely gaining support from both studios and the buying public. Especially in light of Blu-Ray's delayed launches and the PS3 fiasco.

Errr..That's about it again!

Now what's good about HD DVD?

1) Cost- Probably the single biggest advantage HD DVD has over Blu-Ray is price. Close to half the price for a similarly spec'd HD DVD model compared to Blu-Ray. It is all very well us AV nuts singing the praises of one format over the other, but they will only succeed once the general public start buying into them. What pushes the general public to buy into something new? Quality and price! Is it better than what they already have and can they afford it ? A £399 HD DVD player? - possibly / A £800 Blu-Ray player?- Probably not.

2) Quality- The image quality is what is gaining HD DVD so much respect within our elitist community. Up until now it has surpassed Blu-Ray. Finally as Blu-Ray uses better codecs and uses more of their disc space, they are equalling that quality. But remember those prices! Same quality for twice the price isn't very good value for money in my eyes.

3) Connectivity - Even the budget HD-E1 model when it is released has ethernet/network connectivity as does the American HD-A1/XA1. The higher end HD-XE1 will have 1080p support, more audio format support and for half the price of the Panasonic Blu-Ray player.

4) Xbox360 Add-On- The Xbox 360 already has a huge owner base and the add-on will allow those owners a cheap way into HD DVD. If Blu-ray is pinning its hopes on the PS3 for Blu-ray to succeed, then the Xbox360 already has a huge advantage for similar reasons.

5) Time- HD DVD was launched earlier, the Xbox 360 add-on was launched earlier and this advantage will give them a commanding lead in gaining support. All the time people cannot get a PS3, they will get a XBox 360 or a Wii instead. All the time they have to wait for an affordable Blu-Ray player, they will opt for a cheaper HD DVD player instead.

Which ever way i look at this, HD DVD seems the better option. Blu-Ray should be the better option but a complete cock-up of the launch has done massive harm to its reputation.
Why not launch with a 50gb VC1 movie and a player with full connectivity at a competitive price and say; "Hey HD DVD, beat that!". Instead they rushed into production with a sub-standard product that they then expected the public to pay a premium for!

Hey, if that's what rocks your boat......Then you're welcome to it!
 
A

av-phile

Guest
Before either of these formats went into production, I was full of , if not praise then at least optimism for Blu-Ray. Sony and their Blu-Ray partners can certainly talk the talk, focusing on the format's higher storage capacity and high profile studio support. But since then we have seen empty promises, products that seem ill-conceived, badly made, lacking in specification and over-priced.
The question we should be asking is not why do the HD-DVD supporters dislike Blu-Ray so much, but why do we still have Blu-Ray supporters at all?

Couldn't have said it any better. Why indeed are there (censored) who still support blurry is really one for psychology books. It's amazing how they can claim that the format war hasn't begun yet and to wait 6 more months. My goodness, what do they think we've been having since April this year, a practice session? :rotfl: If Blurry can't get their acts right for the first six months of the war, what makes them think they deserve any patronage from their would be customers? Even if they start doing right in the next 6 months, they don't deserve market patronage.

Last Christmas I had little doubt that with a formidable army of studios and CE giants arrayed against HD DVD, with so much press bluster on their side, Blurry would be a sure win hands down. To$hiba was the underdog. Surprise surprise, like Rocky Balboa, look whose getting the beating now. Blurry not only shot both feet with a delayed launch and shoddy launch products, they've tried to con the early adopters with old codecs they thought the market didn't know any better than to accept. Had it not been for the wonderful VC-1 based HD DVD releases, they would have easily rammed down the throats of early adopters that MPEG2 on BD25 defines what high def is about, until they re-issue them in superbit-HD titles for early adopters to double dip. For attempting to con their customers, they deserve no support whatsoever from the HT market.

Blurry at this point in time is a FAILURE. Why? Because more than 6 months after it launched it has failed to neutralize HD DVD that I and many industry observers believed they would do right from day 1.

Blurry has always aimed to be the ONE and ONLY ONE format for the next gen video format. That has been made clear in their press releases since last year. The Blurry camp never envisioned to have any stiff competition from anyone. They have the studio and manufacturing muscle to kill the competiion. That is why they never seriously entertained nervous To$hiba's overtures to merge technologies for a single format. And if rumor is true, that is why they never licensed dual format players that Samsung was quite enthusiastic about early this year. And that is why they thought all along that MPEG2 would be sufficient for the job at this time, reserving AVC or VC1 for latter reincarnations of their titles to further milk the market with title reissues.

Their overconfidence has caused them so much. They launched late and when they finally launched every indication pointed to half-baked products compared to what the other camp delivered. Their underestimation of their markets is contemptible. Now more than 6 months later, what is happening is that, at best, Blurry is catching up but can only match HD DVD, not better it for the premium they ask. But it is clear that they will have to live with a not-so-strange bed fellow for the rest of its natural life. And what is ironic, by all indications, Blurry might just now be running for dear life. Is it too early to tell? Maybe. But IF the trend continues, the safest prediction is that both formats will coexist. There is now no way that To$hiba and Micro$oft won't or can't do to match whatever $ony et al might have up their sleeve. The die is cast, so to speak, for HDDVD to achieve critical mass ahead of Blurry. Their Xbox360 add-on answers the PS3. They have licensed HD DVD technology to the world's biggest DVD makers in CHINA. Blurry has failed to neutralize an underdog HD DVD and by its underperformance and treatment of its market, deserve no quarters from that same markets.
 

Ian_S

Distinguished Member
I have to agree with Nick...

I think the more interesting phsycological study would be why HD-DVD supporters are so fanatical, and why Sony have become public enemy number one. Anything bad about HD-DVD gets buried quick, any slight rumour of some failing for BD gets turned quickly to fact and spread around even supposedly reputable news sites. Remember the 'Sony' BD drive that apparently won't play movies? Complete rubbish.

I have access now to both formats and have about 15 films split roughly 50/50 and I'm at a bit of a loss as to why support for HD-DVD is so strong and Blu-ray is so easily dismissed.

Having the aforementioned Sony BD burner has been very enlightening and has allowed me to compare the picture on an LCD and a CRT based screen which really helps nail where on-screen problems really belong.

Personally for quality I think the best film I own is actually Underworld Evolution. The opening section in the snow covered village is stunning. Superb clarity, detail, it's all there.

Both formats have their bad releases and on BD some are more documented than others, but HD-DVD is not immune here. Van Helsing when compared to Underworld is awful. The blacks are way too black (on an LCD too!) so on the dark scenes of which there are many, it's very hard to make out what's going on. The daylight scenes however look right, so turning up brightness or reducing contrast to help dark scenes ruins light ones. Despite being set in similarly dismal settings Underworld never seems to suffer this problem.

The Last Samurai suffers from weird interlacing artifacts that I don't notice on any other title. Again blacks on all HD-DVD titles I have look too black. Now this could well be the HD-DVD addon's fault, I'm using it over component, but then it provides NO picture adjustment controls. Like many, my TV component input is used by more than one device so adjusting the main TV settings ruin other devices. Strangely though, Xbox 360 games seem fine for colour and black levels, it's just HD-DVD that looks odd. Don't see many people criticising it though and I'm sure I'll get hammered for saying it's not very good.

The sound is better documented but, frankly after all the hype, it's awful. Flat and lifeless. TrueHD apparently sounds better, but of the 8 discs I have not one has TrueHD... ALL of the Blu-ray discs I have have lossless sound which even through a PC show a seriously better sound than the HD-DVD addon. Not even close. The HD-DVD addon won't even pass through a normal DTS track from an HD-DVD, everything gets mangled into DD-. I propose we call it that as it's not even as good as DVD standard DD...

After all the continual "I won't buy a format that uses MPEG-2" posts, I can only assume these people will now sell their HD-DVD players and discs as HD-DVD has just had what might be its first (and probably not it's last) MPEG-2 title 'Chronos'. Shock horror though, even though it's useless MPEG-2 and even 1080i and not 1080p, apparently ignoring master problems, the picture is still great... Also I don't see any of the BD MPEG-2 bashers dishing out the same abuse to their beloved HD-DVD format.

The holiday rush it seems has also tempted some of the HD-DVD studios to do a Sony as well, releasing some 80's vintage films that haven't been 'restored' and touched up to over-smoothness and as such don't look very high def... not even a whisper of complaint.

Back to sound. Warner should be hung. They are probably one of the worst studios on DVD for using 384kbps tracks, and now on HD they continue their penny pinching sound with mostly 640kbps tracks. Instead we are supposed to praise them for the smattering of TrueHD tracks they deign to offer. Rubbish. Every HD title should have a lossless track of some form or other. I don't care if it's TrueHD, DTS-HD MA or even PCM, but it should be there. In that respect BD is streets ahead. nearly all titles (except Warner) have lossless tracks, yet because many are PCM (excluding Fox) and not nice newly monikered re-hashes of existing systems they're summarily dissmissed.

Where BD have messed up is price. They need to sort that out. However if they can do that, we now have players from Samsung, Panasonic, Philips, Sony and Pioneer. BD writer drives from Sony, Pioneer, LG-Hitachi, Lite-on, Panasonic and maybe some others. Sony have been shipping notebooks, desktops and media centre PC's with Blu-ray writers for some time, Toshiba so far have only managed HD-DVD ROM drives, no writers yet.

The release of the G2 players and the Addon have been just as problematic as many of the BD company releases showing it's everyone who is suffering trying to get this new technology to market.

I find a lot of the comment here incredibly hypocritical and one-sided. It's no wonder some survey of 'buzz' shows a one sided result. Any criticism of BD gets amplified, any criticism of HD-DVD gets squashed fanatically without reason.
 

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