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wake up and watch the movie!

Discussion in 'Projectors, Screens & Video Processors' started by knodell, Jul 21, 2004.

  1. knodell

    knodell
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    I’m new to the home cinema game but realised some months back that I was missing too many good movies as I couldn’t be bothered to go to the cinema and can’t stand watching them on a small TV screen.

    So I did a bit of research in magazines and went out and purchased the Hitachi TX10 complete with a BEAMAX 80x45 screen – both from Nexnix.

    I’ve got a spare 15x10ft bedroom so the screen simply hangs from two ceiling hooks at one end and the TX10 sits on top of a wardrobe at the other along with a DVD player and VCR which provides TV programme tuning. Sound output is to an old midi system with speakers mounted each side of the screen.

    If I’d purchased everything new I would have spent less than £1500 and results are fantastic.

    The Hitachi is so easy to set up with its wide zoom and vertical and horizontal lens shift that I can’t see why anyone buys anything else!

    Yes of course it could be brighter but heavy curtains provide all the darkness needed - and maybe the blacks could be blacker - and if you look closely you can see the screen pixels – but you are supposed to be watching the movie for god’s sake!!! – If it’s worth watching you don’t notice these very minor defects.

    I just can’t understand how all the nerds out there come to pay thousands of pounds for something I got for so little – the truth is that there is a whole industry and its magazines out there desperately trying to convince you it all matters. The fact is that technology is moving on and getting very cheap so save your money and get on with watching the movies.

    Right now I would say to anyone – buy the new Hitachi TX100 which cures any small defects the TX10 may have and don’t spend silly money on the rest of your set-up. If your total outlay is more than £2000 you must be daft.

    Happy cinema going!
     
  2. Dunners1

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    Couldn't agree more :)
     
  3. SCOTT_SCOTLAND

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    I am under the £2,000 bracket for complete set up, but, its the same as buying a car. A £5,000 car can take you from a to b just like a £500,00 car, its all a matter of taste and how much money you have. If you have the cash to spend on more expensive equipment, wether it being a projector or a house then do it. If i had more spare cash and all the essential things were yaking care of then i'd splash the cash...

    Just found out, beside were we stay there is a house just been built, it has only 3 bedrooms and is valued at a cool, wait for it, £1.500,000.00, is that right for 1.5 million?? :lesson:

    They have a 8 seat cinema in it and i presume hes not using a plvz1 :blush:

    The moral of the story is, if you have it, splash it. WHY NOT????? :cool:
     
  4. theritz

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    Hi and welcome to the forums...............


    There's no doubt that a basic "bigscreen" setup can be achieved on a relatively modest budget and the fact that you're happy with your setup says it all................ however...

    "all the nerds out there" are the members of this and other forums who give their time and experience to help newcomers to the hobby. The reality is that those who have bigger budgets don't get what you've got, they get something which in their opinion (and it's their opinion that counts 'cause it's their money) is better.

    ............ not in the first flush of enthusiasm, when the WOW factor is working well, but after a little time those "minor defects" might not seem so minor - on the other hand if you remain happy with your setup, then that's a great result.

    I had a demo of the Hitachi TX100 last week and was unimpressed - the level of Fixed Panel Noise and Vertical Banding was quite marked. I was disappointed, tbh, because I had gone to see it with the intention of buying one...... Without further information on whether a firmware upgrade can solve these artifact issues (unlikely as all D4 panel projectors other than the Epson TW500 seem afflicted with the same ailment) I would not be inclined to opt for it.


    Sean G.
     
  5. Messiah

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    Well, I'm one of those 'nerds' (great way to welcome yourself to the forum btw :( ) who have spent just a little more than £1500 on my setup. Do I think it's worth it? Yes. Could I live with a sub £1500 setup? Not on your life.

    I can only assume you have not seem a setup costing more, and I would wholeheartedly suggest you do not otherwise your enthusiasm for your purchase may soon start to wane :D

    At the end of the day, if you are happy with what you have bought then that is all that matters, but may I suggest you do not start 'name calling' those individuals who seek a little bit more perfection.
     
  6. Dunners1

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    Seems no ones mentioned actually watching the movies....to busy prattling on about vertical banding,pixellation,deviation and defiberatin,calibration blah blah blah

    now you have set em off :laugh:
     
  7. Messiah

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    Watching the movies is great. But I'll wager it won't be long before you start analysing the movie, and not just for its content or directorial prowess. Then you'll begin to understand what we mean :)
     
  8. knodell

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    Sorry to hear that the TX100 may not be so good after all – its spec looks great. I know there will be others out there that give good results at around the £1000 mark and by the time I upgrade in 3-4 years time I expect there will be virtually faultless projectors for this sort of money. It’s the zoom and lens shift that makes the Hitachi so easy to fit to your room and few have it at anywhere near the price and quality just now.

    I guess my real point is that you can spend a lot of time and money seeking ‘perfection’ but it’s not the hardware that matters in the end – it’s the movie and if you are allowing yourself to sit there evaluating the failings of your set-up you are missing the point.

    I go back a few years and when I was a student I remember there were many others who built their own Hi-Fi amplifiers, speaker enclosures and whatever to listen to music – they’d argue for hours about different circuits and couldn’t listen to a record without stopping everything to replace a capacitor or adjust a resistor – the hardly ever got to listen to a whole album .

    I suspect that’s what I am observing on these forums – but if that’s what makes you happy – why not……..
     
  9. Messiah

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    Dunners1

    How is the fan noise on your pj btw? Oops, I forgot, you're not interested in things like that cos you're only watching the movie :laugh:
     
  10. inzaman

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    I would have to agree with Messiah and the Ritz on the above. Once the wow factor wears off then you do notice those particular problems and they do start to niggle away at you over time hence why people, myself included, get the upgrade bug.

    I have it at the moment with my current pj but am waiting, or trying to wait, until the 1280x720 dlps are more in my price range (or more what i am willing to pay) before upgrading.
     
  11. theritz

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    .......... and..........

    Perhaps you should be looking at the AV Food part of the forum - there's plenty of discussion/reviews of movies etc there................ it's vaguely insulting to suggest that because we discuss/advise on technical issues related to digital projectors that we don't watch/enjoy movies.......... why in heaven's name do you think we got into it the first place ? Take a look at the link to dvdprofiler in my sig............. it's woefully out of date, less than half my collection is in there.

    The bit that you're missing is that there wouldn't be a movie on your screen without a projector, and the quality of the image you see can affect your enjoyment of the movie - or maybe in your case the quality of the image is unimportant............which is fine for you. My projector is not perfect by any means - but I've had 1500 hrs of movie watching over the last two years (and made good friends through the hobby). I recognise it's shortcomings and will upgrade to something better in time - that doesn't stop us watching movies nor does watching movies prevent me from helping/advising/discussing technical issues here. Your approach is a bit like asking why there's nothing about movies in the Technical FAQ....................... :rolleyes:




    Sean G.
     
  12. Dunners1

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    Calm down messiah its only a comercial

    if you read all my threads you would see that the fan noise is audible but not at the expense of the MOVIE.......keep looking for v-banding,structure,noise etc......i hate too say it but some of you guys would be twiddling your thumbs in frustration if the perfect picture was available with none of the above .......so sit back relax and let the show begin its movie time......

    apolologies some of above toungue in cheek :laugh:
     
  13. Messiah

    Messiah
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    I think you are the one needing to calm down. If you read my post again I think you must have missed the smiley ( :laugh: ) so please. don't tell me to calm down when I'm already one of the most chilled out guys around :D <<note the smiley. (Just in case you missed this one also.)

    [end of troll watch]
     
  14. Matt Horne

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    Slow day today then ;) Messiah
     
  15. Dunners1

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    "Calm down it's only a commercial"....is a joke Messiah its an advert with Michael Winner in it.....so calm down its all in jest :laugh: .
     
  16. Peter Parker

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    It makes me smile when a newbie with the 'WOW' factor comes here and tells us old timers (and 'nerds') how it should be. :)

    How many films have we all watched on a projector(s) over the years while he was watching the tv?? :D

    I just hope he doesn't start noticing things and ask the nerds for advice... ;)

    I rarely go to the cinema now, but if I do, I find it difficult to concentrate on the movie when there are people talking, 'phones are ringing, or kids running around. I know I should watch the movie, but when something is distracting you, it's harder to concentrate on watching. The distraction seems to take on a life of it's own... The same can be said of home cinema, hence the occasioanal need for tweaking or an upgrade. Sometimes curiosity is enough to make you tweak if you're that way inclined..

    At the end of the day - we all go to the extremes we're happy to go to - just because you're less picky than some, or you don't see things that others do, doesn't make you right and them wrong. We all have different ideas of things, so don't knock those who wish to improve upon their lot. One day, it could be you! ( Ever thought of getting a 5.1 or 6.1 system? You'll be impressed with the improvement - especialy if you get a good subwoofer too. ;) )

    As for buying anything else, if you see many different projectors (and maybe screens), then you will see why many people spend a bit more (sometimes a lot more) money and get something else.

    Gary.
     
  17. hornydragon

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    OUCH... wether it be a 14" portable or an 8 foot screen (you having issues messiah?) or a 13k plasma if looks rubbish you wont enjoyit, rubbish is a very subjective term, i recently had had my socks blown off by a £20k 3 chip DLP from infocus. but i am not about to buy one!
     
  18. theritz

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    Gary,

    You've hit the nail on the head there................ You'll note the rush to answer the scrolling bars on an AE100 question............ :laugh:


    Sean.
     
  19. Messiah

    Messiah
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    Same as usual :rotfl:

    Never did like Michael Winner, so apologies I did not know it was an advert :blush:

    I'm chilled :beer:
     
  20. Messiah

    Messiah
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    Let's just say it's not a Stewart :devil: Any problem with yours? Mine has banana sides again :rolleyes:
     
  21. Paul Williams

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    Personally, after years of striving for perfection with Hi-Fi (& I had a serious investment made, both in time and money) I approached my move to Home Cinema with the view that I don’t get involved in the upgrade, technical analysis, ongoing tinkering process. This meant just deciding on a budget and ensuring I got the best for my money. I don’t even know what half the menu’s do on my projector or receiver. I just set it up, looked OK, sounded OK, did some minor adjustments for sound balance and have not touched it since. Now a year later I have no wish to upgrade and think everything is good enough. Before you ask, I do know what compromises I have made, weaknesses in the system and so on. As much as anything it’s a personality or interest issue, there are probably loads of people out there for whom the end of the process is just to get an acceptable home cinema, for others it’s the journey to get the best that matters. Neither is wrong or right, its just differing perspectives. I know at some stage I will change various components, but these will be initiated by failure or obsolescence issues as and when they arise.

    Paul
     
  22. Comer

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    Lucky bugger :rotfl:
     
  23. knodell

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    Hell - sorry to wind everyone up - but I think a lot of people thinking about home cinema must be put off by all the tech talk and the implication that you have to spend £10K to get acceptable results. I'd be interested to see any inputs on what others reckon a starter set-up should look like - projector, DVD, VCR, amps and speakers etc

    product names and rough prices please and not on an 'If money was no object basis' - my guess is that £2K is about all most people would want to spend first time out, but if it needs to be more - how much?
     
  24. knodell

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    I think Paul Williams has got it right and it's pretty much the way I got into this and I don't plan to worry about hardware for 3 or 4 years now though I'll keep an eye on developments!

    Yes Gary - I will probably go for a 5.1 sound set up later this year if the price is right - just as long as it doesn't need copper free solid gold cables and £100 a time spiked speaker stands etc etc....! I've seen one in Argos for less than £100.....

    but seriously - any suggestions??
     
  25. rogeralpine

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    I partially agree with what you are saying on the PJ front – I look at what my AE100 & HCPC can do and find that it performs more than adequately for my current needs – I watch a movie and don’t notice (usually) any shortcomings. I get absorbed watching the film and “minor” image problems (that I know are there) seem to “disappear”.

    The last film I saw at the pictures was LoTR – TT and it was dire. Firstly they had a stereo track only and then there were all of the scratches and dust that had accumulated on the film which put me off whilst watching. Compared to my home setup, I know what I’d choose (and why I haven’t been back to the cinema since)

    BUT – once you’re in this game you’ll invariably look at what else is round the corner and make comparisons. You then have to assess whether the improvements you notice – if any – would be worth the extra outlay. For me personally, I’ve seen higher quality LCD’s machines and at the moment the cost to upgrade is not worth it for the improvements I see. A decent DLP is a different matter all together and if I had the funds available, I’d upgrade now. All this is subjective though and is relevant to my eyesight and a level of performance that I am prepared to accept.

    On the sound front though the difference between 5.1 and stereo, and a budget £100 set-up compared to a dedicated system, are worlds apart IMHO. I’ve heard the budget set-ups and to my ears they are awful. The same applies to a sub - many ppl can take or leave them, for me it is an essential ingredient that I cannot live without. A film takes on a different aspect once a good sub is thrown in the mix. Again, I understand that this is down to personal preference – but for me, the soundstage is one area of HC that I believe can, and does, make a difference. I would avoid like the plague the £100 stuff and look to spend a little more on some separates - you don't need to spend the earth either.

    At the end of the day you are only changing a number of variables to enhance the pleasure of watching a film. You could argue that watching a film on an old 14” black and white (sitting 1 foot from the screen) with a mono speaker is sufficient for your needs to enjoy the film – at the end of the day you see and hear the same movie as someone who watches it on a 10ft screen with a thumping 7.1 setup. It’s all a matter of personal preference and in every walk of life there are exactly the same type of arguments to be made.
     
  26. knodell

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    I wasn't being serious about the Argos stuff - but then again -- what sort of money should I be looking to spend? - I've seen 'best buy' reviews on systems from less than £200 to five or six times that!
     
  27. theritz

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    Knodell,


    There are separate forums dealing with Amplifiers/Receivers, Speakers etc.... I'm sure some of the guys over there would be happy to advise you - you should think about the kind of budget you'd like to dedicate to the setup and give some information about the size of room etc.

    Something that's £200 and a "Best Buy" in a magazine is usually being compared to other stuff for £200 - not being compared to stuff costing £2000 or more. If you're concerned about budget, get some recommendations for kit from the guys on the other side of the forum then lurk on the AV Hardware for Sale forum for a couple of weeks............... the stuff you want will come up for sale sooner or later, enthusiast owned and cared for and at a very hefty discount on what you'd have to pay for new.

    Try not telling them how wonderful your midi stereo system sounds with movies, wondering why anyone would want anything better or calling them "nerds" when referring to their interests, budgets or their taste in equipment............... doesn't really encourage people to be helpful towards you............

    Sean G.
     
  28. Comer

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    I don't thnk he really meant his original post to be taken up like this. IMO all he was saying was that perhaps some people spend too much time tweeking etc and not enough time enjoying the movie, and I for one have to raise my hand and say that I have, at times been guilty as charged :)

    Conor
     
  29. theritz

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    Conor,

    It was meant in a "tongue in cheek" kinda way.............. ;) I don't think anyone is immune to tweaking...........


    Sean.
     
  30. Peter Parker

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    I think there's a lot of 'snake oil' in cables and the like, and I've done some testing with component cables of varying prices and mains cables, and couldn't see or hear any difference in any of them. Placebo plays a huge part in cables and I've fallen for that effect myself after reading a review of a DVD player (misread 'overblown' as 'overbrown' and thought the colours looked brown in one scene of a DVD) :rolleyes:

    I think you need either some serious kit to hear/see the differences or better ears than I have. As for speaker cable, ordinary mains cable is hard to beat for the money, so unless you can get some thick cable at bargain prices, save your money. IMHO. :)

    Gary.
     

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