VP50 Specs up

alwyn

Active Member
Joe Fernand said:
Hello Togad

The folk at DVDO say you'll pay what's shown on the DVDO 'Upgrade' page + the 250 USD 'Handing fee' and that's it; no additional VAT or Import Duty.

Best regards

Joe
If that is true then it means that they are selling the unit to the uk at app. $400 cheaper than they are to their own people,can you believe that?
 

TransientWolf

Novice Member
Look guys.

The bottom line is if you want one of these baby's you are going to either pay VAT on any UK upgrade programme via OWL, or (potentially worst case) VAT on any US upgrade programme. Either way it is unlikely you will get around the VAT although there is a chance you might if you go the US route.

You can be certain that if you order from OWL you will pay shipping and VAT costs that Owl incur in getting the units to the UK. Period. They won't do it for free.

That is why they are probably quoting £2000 ish for the VP50 without upgrade when at current exchange rates $3000 would in fact be £1590.

Interestingly adding VAT @ 17.5% would increase this to £1865 and adding the same $250 shipping handling etc. fee mentioned for the international upgrade would take it to £2000........ Coincidence - I think not.

QED - ok I have ignored import duty - maybe that is the ish part.

The advantage of the US route is you get the AVS discount of $400 if you pre-order before midnight tonight. That is worth a preorder in my view and I will be tapping in my credit card details shortly! If I escape VAT because of a screw up by DVDO on their offer details then so much the better.

Decision to be made should be simple:

a) Do you want it now or at some point in the future?

If the answer is "now" then order away and save $400
If the answer is "future" then ask:

b) is it worth having now to get a $400 saving from the AVS offer?

If the answer is "yes" then order away and save $400
If the answer is "no" then wait and see how things develop and be confident with DVDO their upgrade plan will be available for as long as you need it to be.

Me - as I say I answered "future" to a) and "yes" to b). Order in later. :D
 

togad

Active Member
TransientWolf said:
Look guys.

The bottom line is if you want one of these baby's you are going to either pay VAT on any UK upgrade programme via OWL, or (potentially worst case) VAT on any US upgrade programme. Either way it is unlikely you will get around the VAT although there is a chance you might if you go the US route.

You can be certain that if you order from OWL you will pay shipping and VAT costs that Owl incur in getting the units to the UK. Period. They won't do it for free.
Except I don't agree that is the bottom line at all - for the precise reason, as already highlighted, that DVDO state on their website very clearly -

International customers: an international upgrade processing and handling fee of $250 will be added to your order. This fee will also cover shipping, customs duties and taxes for your new iScan.

I'm not sure if you're aware of it, but it is becoming increasingly common for overseas retailers to include VAT and custom duty in their prices when selling to the UK.

Example 1 -
Ever ordered a single item over £18 from, say, Play.com in Jersey? The price you pay includes VAT. Play collect the VAT and pay it, thus saving you the consumer from having to deal with HMC&E, and HMC&E from having to deal with countless thousands of small transactions. Most people don't even realise that this goes on.

Example 2 -
Ever ordered software online from a US company? Handango.com is a good example. Even though they're in the US, they charge you the applicable VAT/sales tax rate depending on what country you're in.

In both examples, the VAT is included in the advertised price, and is collected by someone else - even if you're not aware of it. It is not the end user's problem.

There is no other way of interpreting the statement made by DVDO with respect to their upgrade program other than that the price we in the UK are paying for the VP50 (including the $250) includes all applicable sales taxes and customs duties.

Clearly however, $250 isn't enough to cover what's due. But that is not our problem. That's between Owl and DVDO - and neither of them can come chasing us for VAT or customs duties. And if the VAT man ever came asking, simply refer him to the explicit T's&C's of the contract made between us and DVDO.
 

TransientWolf

Novice Member
Then you are happy, and I am happy so the problem is?

Worst Case scenario either way is you pay VAT. Best Case is you don't.
 

choddo2006

Distinguished Member
liam_b said:
Yes the upgrade program is excellent, the offer pricing is excellent.

But I can't believe that DVDO have done nothing to improve the lacking performance of the S-video inputs (1.5MHz colour reponse is kinda poor especially when the Iscan did much better!)
Now I'm not sure what the significance of that is (1.5M / 720 / 576 =3? That's a lot less than 50 - sounds quite bad - what's the colour resolution of s-video?) but the empirical evidence suggests that 480p out of my US gamecube doesn't look much better at all than s-video via the vp30.

I'm not even going to begin to test the component issue you talked about, I'm going to pretend I never even read it ;)
 

TransientWolf

Novice Member
VP50 ordered :clap:

With bit of luck I might get it this side of Christmas I suppose!! :lease:
 

liam_b

Active Member
choddo2006,

the Iscan Ultra has useful colour response to over 3MHz via the S-video, the Iscan Pro/v2 was, from memory, very similar. In this area DVDO have clearly gone backwards (IMO) which is a little disappointing especially when considering the large amount of equipment that has been made with quite decent S-video outputs, people often seem to forgot that S-video is only a tiny bit lessor quality than component IF done correctly.
 

ihan

Active Member
Will the VP50 be configurable to accept 576i via HDMI from a skyHD box, or is it functionality that may be added later (as with the VP30)?
 

alwyn

Active Member
choddo2006 said:
not confirmed yet, but they are "looking at" supporting editable EDID info.
Well I think that it is essential for us to have this,and I think the more potential uk buyers who tell them this the better
 

StooMonster

Well-known Member
'Naughty box' would sort you out there mate, before I got PDP-5000EX screen I used to feed scalers with digital signals over HDMI and then at final stage use DVI-HDCP>VGA converter. PQ was superb, digital path to scalers helps a lot.

StooMonster
 

Welwynnick

Distinguished Member
Just when I had started to think that the VP50 was going to take over the World, and there would be no reason to buy any other processor, I just spotted a chink in the armour.

When the VP50 relays HDMI/HDCP audio, it is only output over HDMI, not analogue or SPDIF.

That's not the end of the World; there are various work arounds. But dare I point round these parts that Calibre have found a clever way using in-band signalling to output HDMI/HDCP audio over SPDIF (having initially come to the same conclusions as DVDO).

There is also a cooling fan, but DVDO insist that it's quiet enough even for Madshi! There is no EDID over-ride or HD-SDI yet, but most folks have learned to trust what DVDO will deliver these days.

Like I've always said, there is no perfect video processor, but this one seems pretty close.

Regards, Nick
 

choddo2006

Distinguished Member
Yeah 14dB... it must be - he's actually gone and ordered something after all this time ;)

Nick, you sure about that audio issue? I'm sure the vp50 will output compatible audio formats recieved through HDMI, over optical.

edit
This from [email protected]'s announcement thread
Q: If I connect an HDMI (audio/video) source to the iScan VP50 will I be able to get audio out via the optical/coaxial digital outputs?
A: In most cases the audio that is available on the HDMI connection will be available on the optical/coaxial audio outputs. Exceptions include MLP (DVD-Audio) and DSD (SACD) which SPDIF connections are incapable of carrying due to bandwidth limitations.
No explicit mention of HDCP either way though... hmm, have you had some sort of clarification on that?
 

Welwynnick

Distinguished Member
choddo2006 said:
Nick, you sure about that audio issue? I'm sure the vp50 will output compatible audio formats recieved through HDMI, over optical.

No explicit mention of HDCP either way though... hmm, have you had some sort of clarification on that?
Yup. This was taken from DVDO's own FAQ's for the VP50, and it rather surprised me.

http://www.dvdo.com/faq/faq_isvp50.php#faq6
The HDMI inputs will also accept audio, given that the video signal is on the same input. If the incoming HDMI signal has HDCP, then the iScan VP50 can not output this audio using the optical or coaxial digital outputs, only the HDMI output.
Still, can't have everything. Hopefully the source will still be able to output audio over SPDIF at the same time as putting video over HDMI.

BR, Nick
 

alwyn

Active Member
welwynnick said:
Yup. This was taken from DVDO's own FAQ's for the VP50, and it rather surprised me.

http://www.dvdo.com/faq/faq_isvp50.php#faq6

Still, can't have everything. Hopefully the source will still be able to output audio over SPDIF at the same time as putting video over HDMI.

BR, Nick
Why put audio through the iscan anyway,I would have thought that most people would use optical direct from say sky hd box,into their digital processor,I personaly never mix audio and video in the same unit.
 

Welwynnick

Distinguished Member
Lexus said:
Why put audio through the iscan anyway,I would have thought that most people would use optical direct from say sky hd box,into their digital processor,I personaly never mix audio and video in the same unit.
Two main reasons:

  1. DVDO and some others will apply automatic lip sync / time delay compensation.
  2. You don't have to change the input on the amplifier when you change the source.
There is something to be said for keeping audio and video seperate. Universal players sound better if the video section is switched off or even removed altogether, so there's inevitably some mutual degradation going there.

Even when you do run audio through the VP, though, there is always the quandary about whether the VP or the amp is the real source / input selector. Manufacturers of each equipment seem to want their own box to be the first to get the inputs.

As more VPs get audio switching and more amps get video and HDMI switching, people will obviously be tempted to use them in series. I can see all sorts of problems there. Amps are unlikely to carry exactly what VPs want as input, or what they generate as output. 720p and 1080i is not enough.

Running them side-by-side (functionally speaking) works fine if you have a smart remote - it's all transparent then.

Nick
 

StooMonster

Well-known Member
madshi said:
welwynnick said:
There is also a cooling fan, but DVDO insist that it's quiet enough even for Madshi!
:clap:
Probably only comes on with HD and not SD processing too. ;)

StooMonster
 

choddo2006

Distinguished Member
Yep, I run audio through my VP for Nick's reason #1 - I have a pronto so no need for #2 but the auto-lipsync is pretty essential as my amp can't do delays per input and even if it could, processing 576i compared to 1080i out of the SkyHD box gives different latency. That might change with the vp50 I guess, they could be pretty similar then.
 

ailean

Member
welwynnick said:
Yup. This was taken from DVDO's own FAQ's for the VP50, and it rather surprised me.

http://www.dvdo.com/faq/faq_isvp50.php#faq6

Still, can't have everything. Hopefully the source will still be able to output audio over SPDIF at the same time as putting video over HDMI.

BR, Nick

This got me worried too but then I remember the VP30 faq used to say something similar... so I went and checked it and oddly enough most of the VP50 faq is a word for word copy of the VP30 faq which still has this statement in it!

That FAQ hasn't been updated since before the VP30 was released and since firmware 1.00 you have had output on opti/coax from the VP30 with HDMI input (so long as it's an opti/coax compatible format, DD, DTS or 2 channel PCM).

So I think it's be okay. :smashin:
 

StooMonster

Well-known Member
Nah, I think he means v1.00

I run audio from Sky HD over HDMI to VP30 and output by coax to pre-amp, and it did that well before v1.10

StooMonster
 

StooMonster

Well-known Member
choddo2006, your PM box is full.

StooMonster
 

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