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Viewing distance (again!)

Discussion in 'Plasma TVs' started by vanwel, Nov 8, 2003.

  1. vanwel

    vanwel
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    Sorry for bothering you again with a subject about viewing distance. I used the search and found some answers, but I really want to be clear on this.
    I am planning to buy the Pioneer 434HDE. I will be watching it from 7ft. Will this screen be too large, or will it be fine from this distance? I'm thinking of getting digital tv (I live in the Netherland, don't have any idea what that sky stuff is you english people talk about all the time! :rolleyes: ), so that should be better then the analog signal, right?
    Of course I know that I'll have to look for myself, what I find comfortable. But I'd really like to hear your views on this one.
    Thanks!
     
  2. loonatic

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    I think that it really just comes down to personally preference and your viewing habits.

    For me 7ft would be too close for normal day-to-day viewing but for DVDs it would be fine.

    Also it depends on the quality of the source you are watching. If it's a low bit-rate digital channel then at 7ft you will see all of the artifacts due to the encoding...whereas DVDs which have a higher bit-rate will look great.

    My advice would be go and see in person what you think but not to judge this on DVD playback but rather normal TV stuff - if that looks okay to you then DVDs should look great.

    Cheers, Lee
     
  3. Phil_Yeoman

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    As usual the answer lies with you. Different people have different preferences. I would be more than happy with this distance.

    At present I watch a 61 inch plasma from 3 meters and the screen in the home theater is around 138 inch with a viewing distance of 4.5 meters.

    Personally I like the screen to fill my field of vision. This has the effect of making me feel more involved with the material.

    Phil
     
  4. vanwel

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    I don't think the screen will be too big, I like 'm big! But I wonder if the structure of the plasma won't be visible and annoying. All that pixelcrawling and stuff like that...?
    But I agree with you that you feel more involved with such a screen. Doesn't give you the effect of looking to a screen, but rather makes you think you are in the picture.
     
  5. AndyGo

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    I would definitely demo one. I think you'll find the PQ unnaceptable from that close.
    It's all fixable (Lumagen vision, HD Leeza, scalers, etc.) depending if you have the money & access to a calibration expert to sort it out properly.
    Otherwise, demo one & see what you think first.
    The Pioneer, Panasonic & Fujitsu were on display at the event in guildford this weekend and at that distance none of them were particularly spectacular.
    Personally I have a panasonic for day to day use and with correct set-up & viewing distance it can look spectacular. (Still saving for Lumagen Vision though !!!!)
     
  6. vanwel

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    Unacceptable? Hmmm... well, I will demo one soon I hope. Too bad no store allows you to take one home for testing :(
     
  7. Phil_Yeoman

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    If You really are that concerned you can always hire one for the day!

    Phil
     
  8. bond007

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    Well that’s not entirely true, some shops in a way will let you, I had a panny 42pw6 for just over a month, I ended up returning it as I didn’t like the PQ and got a full refund. Also if you do order it, and don’t go onto their premises when ordering (distance purchasing) you have the right to return it within 7 days (if they inform you of it, if they dont, i believe its 28days, take a look at the CAB website to be sure). With a full refund, only return delivery costs chargeable.
     
  9. pauld

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    I like to have a large screen and be involved also, but I think 7' ft is just too close. As others have siad it's not the size and distance ratio that poses the problem, but the highlighting of picture artifacts and imperfections.
     
  10. mikeq

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    The panny I've got is not a high definition model. Should I expect to see more artifacts and imperfections than a HD model. Well I wish someone would point them out to me because I have never noticed any, with any sources that I feed it.

    I sit about 7 feet away from the screen.

    Can anyone post some pictures of what these artifacts look like when sitting 7 feet away from a plasma.
     
  11. vanwel

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    Ok, that's some good news. And the Pio is HD, well, highER def, so that should theoratically be better if you're close.

    However... I was thinking... I can just buy a plasma of 35" to watch tv. From the money I save from the 43" Pio, I can buy myself a projector and screen!!
    This I will only use for watching movies and I will be able to put my couch at 9ft away from the screen. I think I can take a screen with a width of max 6 ft, right?
    This is probably a better solution then e 43" plasma. What do y'all think?
     
  12. loonatic

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    That's what I ended up doing myself.

    I had a 43" Pioneer 433HDE to start with and found it to be too large for general TV viewing, especially on some Sky channels, yet it did not seem large enough for films.

    So...I now have a Sony 30" LCD for general viewing and a Sony HS10 projecting onto a 5ft screen for films - both of which are viewed from about 9ft.

    For my size of room this has turned out to be the perfect solution.

    However...if I had the room to replace the 30" LCD with a 32"/36" CRT I would do so.

    Cheers, Lee
     
  13. Jasonjo

    Jasonjo
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    loonatic => what size room do you have?

    JJ
     
  14. loonatic

    loonatic
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    JJ,

    The room is just over 3m square.

    It's not the living room but rather the games room.

    On one wall I have the TV on a DIY stand which house's all the other AV kit and consoles with the fixed screen for the PJ above it. Then I have a settee on the opposite wall above which the PJ is mounted. Also in one corner is my PC stuff.

    Cheers, Lee
     
  15. Jasonjo

    Jasonjo
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    Ta - so basically, you dont think 3m is far enough away from a 42" then?

    JJ
     
  16. loonatic

    loonatic
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    Well I think what suits one person does not necessarily suit another.

    For me watching Sky on the 43” Pioneer was painful. You could see all the artefacts present in the source plus on any fast movement it would pixelate badly. It also highlighted the chroma bug very clearly. The only channels I found to be bearable were the film channels but trying to watch say Easters the picture was not a patch on the Sony 28” WS CRT we have in the living room and some of the lower bit-rate Sky channels such and Home & Leisure, which I view a fair bit, were unwatchable IMHO.

    Now on the Sony 30” LCD I watch Sky through an iScan Ultra and the picture is great on the main channels but the lower bit-rate is still evident on say Home & Leisure but it’s on a par with the CRT.

    DVDs are a different case and they could look great on the 43” plasma but once you take into account the black bars at the top & bottom of the screen present on most films you don’t really get that huge picture feeling that you do with a PJ.

    But like I said everyone has their own ideas. Perhaps I am particularly intolerant as even with the PJ I have a smaller screen than I could have. I did try a 6.5ft screen but found that to be too big for me and settled on the 5ft screen.

    Cheers, Lee
     
  17. fuzzybee

    fuzzybee
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    I sit around 10ft away for day to day viewing of my 42inch Hitachi plasma and find it perfect, i do sit closer for the odd ps2 gaming session(around 6ft away)
    I think height also comes into it, the higher you have your plasma the farther away you need to be, i have wallmounted mine 900mm from the floor and feel the height and viewing distance are perfect. Thats my take on the situation, however as usual with questions like this it's all down to the individual and what he/she is happy with.

    :hiya:
     
  18. steve36

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    I feel I must point one thing out that was mentioned earlier, in the amplifier forum the distance selling regulation has been discussed.
    There is no guarantee that you are entitled to your money back.
    Most retailers will insist on a 20 - 30% restocking fee if the product is used. This fee is charged because they can not return the product to the manufacturer if used unless a fault exists.

    According to the thread (a while ago), one CAB also agree with the retailer in this respect.
    I have tried to return a top of the range VCR to COMET (ok my own fault !), and had to have a 45 minute discussion regarding what I knew to be a fault, but the manufacturer supposedly said was the way it was designed.
    Anyway not to digress too much, do not rely on this regulation. Some retailers such as SUPERFI appear to allow returns, most do not.

    P.S. I have a Panasonic HD going from SKY+ to JSIM to component and find it very very good from 7 feet away, with very few artifacts.

    Also, IMO you should find that the low res version should actually show less artifacts.
    I feel that the Pioneer sometimes is criticised because it's higher definition sometimes shows up the flaws in the signal.

    Steve:)
     
  19. loonatic

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    I think you are correct in saying that an SD panel will show less artifacts but at closer viewing distances you could start to see the panel structure itself.

    That said I saw the new integrated Panasonic 37" plasma in Comet today displaying a freeview image, some music channel, and it looked great. The image looked smooth and motion seemed very natural and the colour balanced seemed pretty good also. I must admit I was both very impressed and very supprised.

    The only thing I did not like was the flap at the front covering the front AV ports which seemed to stick out too much...might have been better situated onthe side of the display - especially if you wanted to connect a PC.

    I think at the end of they all the talk about SD vs HD, Progressive vs Interlaced/ALiS, Panasonic vs Pioneer vs Hitachi, Plasma vs LCD etc it really comes down to what you like. Just trust your own eyes.

    As for taking stuff back on Watchdog tonight a guy bought some surround sound kit which he was told would work with his existing kit. When he got it home and opened up the box to read the manual he found it would not. He tried to return it to Comet or Currys and they said they would not take it back because he had opened the box :mad:

    Cheers, Lee
     
  20. vanwel

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    About the restocking fee and the ferusal of taking back the speakers, they're talking bull****! I live in the Netherlands, so I don't know for 100% if what apllies to me here, does to you too. However, as this is a matter of European law, I think it does.
    First, if you buy something over the internet, you have the right to return it in 8 days. If the store doesn't tell you that before or at delivery, this will turn into 28-30 days. And which store tells you that, right?
    Second, this law is protected by 'forcing law' (don't know the English term, but this comes close I guess). This means that a vendor can't put anything in the legal terms and conditions, to change this to the detriment of the customer.
    Of course they can demand that the box must me in a condition to be sold, but if it's not, you only have to pay for the box (and the possible costs of sending the product back).
    I had problems returning an LCD monitor for my computer, but I just sent them a registered mail stating my legal rights and demanding to take it back and they did.
    The funny thing was the construction of their legal terms and conditions. It said that you could return an article in 8 days when unopened. Howver, it also said that you were obliged to unpack the article immediately after getting it, to check if everything was there. So, how is that possible? :laugh:

    So, for that guy on watchdog. He seems to be an easy customer. Stores usually try fobb of the customer. to He should know his rights and play it hard, but clean.
    1. He has the right to return it, bearing in mind the 8 days.
    2. They sold him something of which they said it would work. It doesn't. This is called non-conformity (free translation from Dutch again... non-accordance?) of the article. It would be stupid to be put off like this!
     

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