VHS to DVD, what disc?

Discussion in 'Blu-ray & DVD Players & Recorders' started by n8384, Aug 14, 2006.

  1. n8384

    n8384
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    Hi all,

    i have recently purchased the LG RH200MH. I have copied loads of VHS tapes onto the HDD on the highest quality setting. Most of the videos are over 2 1/2 hours long.
    Question:
    1) whats the biggest dvd size available?
    2) without creating multiple discs, how else can i copy onto a single dvd without loosing quality?

    thanks
     
  2. HMHB

    HMHB
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    Unless your recorder is capable of using dual layer DVDs there really isn't a way of recording over 2 hours on a single DVD without losing quality. A 2 hour recording on a DVD will lose some quality to the original, albeit not really noticable.
     
  3. grd2

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    I would suggest you need to experiment with your record settings from VHS.

    In order to match the VHS quality on DVD you do not need to be anywhere near highest quality. In fact, from my experience, you can go down to LP (on my Sony 710) to keep the quality to a similar level. Certainly no greater than SP for a VHS.
     
  4. Gavtech

    Gavtech
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    I agree that it is a good idea to experiment to see what you find acceptable.

    However , it is a common misconception that because the standard quality of a DVD recorded at, say SP, exceeds the specification for VHS quality, that it is therefore OK to record at at lower speed.

    It is not.

    Recording at a lower speed will increase the digital shortcomings of the system which are totally unlike and have nothing to do with the analogue limitations of VHS. You would introduce more digital distortion which did not exist on the original material... mostly in the form of unwanted digital artefacts on moving scenes, and general re-encoding 'mess'.

    My recommendation would be to stick to SP. Certainly no lower.
     
  5. senu

    senu
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    Ditto :
    No more than 2 hrs on a DVD disc (ie 4.7Gb single layer ) should be your target .
    My LG RH177 does record to Dual layer discs ( therefore 4 hrs for SQ) but I only use them for Data as Im not confident about dual layer disc compatibility for video

    As is stated above, the deficiencies in the mpeg encoding process begin to show up beyond this and while VHS quality is probably equivalent to (SP) SQ at most, your strategy of recording them at XP ( HQ) is sound.

    If you transfer to DVD disc at sub SP (ie LP or less) , there is a strong chance that the DVD footage will look worse than VHS because of over-enthusiastic Mpeg encoding
    HTH
     
  6. nwgarratt

    nwgarratt
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    I find at least with Panasonic recorders, that LP is good enough for VHS. There is no point using anything above that as you can't suddenly make VHS look any better. I have done several VHS to DVD using LP and they don't look any worse.
     
  7. senu

    senu
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    I guess you need to "experiment". I did have a Panasonic DVD recorder in the past and PQ at LP was fair ( for Sky recordings on DVD RAM I was going to wipe off later).
    Mpeg encoders are not equal and only a bit of trial and error can show you what your LG unit can do beyond SP for VHS footage :cool:
     
  8. Gavtech

    Gavtech
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    Bear in mind that in this case it will be a second encoding.
     
  9. nwgarratt

    nwgarratt
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    Doesn't matter.
     
  10. Hal_loe

    Hal_loe
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    It does matter what the subject of the recordings is though.

    If you are transfering for example a concert with lots of flashing lights you will notice the lack of bitrate whe the lights flash. You will get pixelation on the lights.
     
  11. nwgarratt

    nwgarratt
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    If that happens, it can't be a very good encoder then. I have never had anything like that with Panasonic in the years of using them even with LP.
     
  12. Hal_loe

    Hal_loe
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    Even when you record an already poor bitrate Freeview signal?

    You should see the mess my dads 60D made of the F1 when in LP mode.
     
  13. nwgarratt

    nwgarratt
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    That's different as the source is pixelated to start with so, it just records what it receives. I have only seen it on Channel 5.
     
  14. n8384

    n8384
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    thanks for all the info..
    i am going to experiment with some standard setting recordings..

    thanks again....
     
  15. Hal_loe

    Hal_loe
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    If you know what you are looking for you can see it on every Freeview channel.

    ITV's coverage of the world cup was awful for too low a bitrate.

    Next you are going to tell me that the Panasonic encoder is better than the one's used by Freeview.

    I agree you don't need XP mode for VHS tapes, i'd say use SP mode.

    With SVHS tapes it is definately worth using XP mode.
     
  16. ROYOLD

    ROYOLD
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    The Panasonic dvd recorders will record only slightly lower than SP using the Flexible Record setting set to 3 hours or less. This is the setting I use for all my VHS to DVD transfers on all my Panasonic recorders. Provided that the original VHS tape quality is reasonably good you will get a reasonable transfer of a 3 hour VHS tape. For the B&W recordings of old films then I have used the LP setting and this also gives reasonable quality. Many of my old VHS recordings done in the early 1980's are not very good quality tho', but I still see no reason to use SP. Using SP will result in having to use two discs and as the direct transfer of VHS to DVD is done in real time this would complicate matters.

    So - if you have several VHS tapes to transfer my advice would be to purchase a Panasonic dvd recorder and use the FR setting at 3 hours and do direct VHS to DVD transfers. I have copied around 200 VHS tapes so far of the around 1200 I have recorded since 1981.

    http://forum.videohelp.com/viewtopic.php?t=251884
     
  17. Gavtech

    Gavtech
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    That was the very point I was addressing. Indeed you cannot make VHS look any better in the tranfer, but you can make it look worse by introducing digital degradation, which would be significant at LP speeds .
    That is a fact beyond debate.

    That it works ok for you is fine. Maybe the system you watch it through, or your eyes are forgiving of the shortcomings.

    It also must be mentioned that VHS quality is enormously variable, from barely indistinguishable from broadcast , to the frankly dire, largely dependent on signal quality and recording device.
    It seems likely that degradation would be more obviously noticeable on high quality material.
     
  18. nwgarratt

    nwgarratt
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    Of course not. However, I stand to what I said. I get get excellent results on LP. I have done plenty of VHS to DVD so I know what to expect. It just depends on what is being recorded. As VHS quality isn't that good. I find LP was sufficient in producing a exact copy. It can't make it look any better.

    The question that needs to be found out is whether the encoder in the LG can produce results just as good.
     
  19. senu

    senu
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    ....from the Panasonic

    One has to be careful to compare the output from the various DVD settop recorders in this way. Panasonic did pioneer settop DVD recording and arguably current models are 3rd/ 4th generation. While this in no way implies that other brands are inferior it should be remebered that they all use different encoding chipsets. The Panasonics may infact have different characteristics rather than "better" than the LG.
    As for source material, VHS quality does vary widely and not all can be said to be "not that good". In the same way , some £2.99 DVDs cannot be compared to "superbit" transfers
    I had a Panasonic ( HS 2) in the past and although I never used LP I did find its flexible recording mode ( which like variable bitrate may have incorporated LP) very useful to maximise Discs without sacrificing PQ.
    My LG has no FR mode ( other models might)
    The LGs incorporate LSI logics chipset DVFX which is in use quite impressive.
    Whilst shopping for the recorder I came across various models :devil: which I gave a wide berth and a simple search in the DVD recorder threads of this forum confirmed my suspicions.:nono: to them
    As such,PQ from one models LP mode could well be similar to anothers SQ.
    What is certain is that (re) encoding more than once is a surefire way of ending up with underwhelming PQ.

    Some of this is way:offtopic: to the OP but Im sure the idea of trying the various setting from his own source VHS tapes, on his LG and his own display set remain valid.
     

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