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very dissapointed...

Discussion in 'Hi-Fi Stereo Systems & Separates' started by AS_Platinum, Nov 1, 2005.

  1. AS_Platinum

    AS_Platinum
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    Was doing some work at a very reputable hifi interconect manufacturer today that shall remain nameless, and was having a chat with one of the guys there and eventually we ended up in their demo room, i thought this looks nice, had closer inspection (like you do) and see Naim amps cd players etc etc and and pair of huge Kefs sitting beside it all (things were huge), very nice indeed, asked or was asked (can't remember now) if i'd like a listen, hell yeah (this kit must sound amazing i thought)

    Asked if I could go grab a cd out of the car (and see what it sounds like on this kind of equipment, not that I could ever afford such kit) so I leg it to the car like a blue arsed fly :D grab an old Garage CD (actually the 1st ever garage nation cd with Emma Noble on the disks pfhooorrr, anyway we won't go off topic)

    So i get back, hand the disk to the gentlemen and sit down on one of the sofa's getting ready for some tight deep bass line to kick in, no such joy.

    Admitdelly all the notes were there, clean crisp treble mids, but it just didn't have that ooommpph in the bass department i wasn't expecting from such a high quality piece of equipment.

    This bit is not a blowing of my own trumpet so don't get the wrong idea lads :D

    I get home, stick the cd in my kit, sat down, put exactly the same tune on, and I swear it just came to life, all of the above plus the bass I was expecting from that particular song, maybe the kit there just wasn't setup for my kind of Genre in musical tastes (the miss's wouldn't call Garage a taste, rather a big pile of poop :D she's rather listen to west life....... need i say more.) but i'm very glad i demo'ed my equipment b4 I bought it as if I just went on name brand alone I could have ended up with something I just didn't like.

    Just to let you know my system isn't smashing by the least but it does me good and here it is :S :
    (btw i put it in stereo mode at home b4 testing)
    Teac AG-10
    MS 914 - fronts LR
    MS 905C - front C
    MS 903S - bi-pole LR

    This is not a flame at the higher ended stuff b4 you cowboys start willy waving, this is just me giving my personal opinion, and I'm sure alot of the Naim stuff does sound bloody marvolous and i'll admit far better than what mine does.
     
  2. Gullanian

    Gullanian
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    I tried some Naim stuff out recently and didn't like it, but I think it all comes down to taste really. Also maybe the setup wasn't designed for Garage music.
     
  3. A.N.

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    totally agree:)

    i heard a top flite green logo'd system a few months back (read 38k's worth) at a dealers. sounded not good. infact, sounded quite bad. i dont mean sounded bad for 38k, but sounded bad full stop. the speakers were definately not suited to the electronics. the dealer even agreed upto a point :confused:
     
  4. la gran siete

    la gran siete
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    just goes to show you should always trust your ears and nothing else :thumbsup:
     
  5. karkus30

    karkus30
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    Thats all a bit loose really, there are too many variables to really consider a reply. Quality of your recording, you cant make a silk purse etc, higher end equipment reveals more faults on poorer recordings. I dont rate Kef speakers so its really hard to judge that part. New Naim/old Naim, which amp, was it warmed up, but I can tell you that it will not sound worse than any other amplifiers at any rate. Listening enviroment has a massive effect. Your expectations, a £1000,000 hifi will not be that much more stunning than a £10,000 hifi therefore it stands to reason that a 10K hifi wont sound amazing compared to a grands worth. Its not an immediate difference and takes a few hours to understand where the improvements are.

    You have just found out what many people know already, if you stick an average recording on a fantastic system it will sound crap, if you stick the same CD on a cheaper system it will still sound crap but you will be happier because you spent less.
     
  6. A.N.

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    agree. just because a system has high credentials, price tag etc, does not guarentee that it sounds superb. i've heard many a setup costing tens of thousands of pounds. some have been excellent, some havnt. same goes with lower end kit, you can get astonishing sound for 1500 quid that will highly embaress kit costing 10-20 times more.

    room acoustics play a huge part in a systems synergy. as do ones ears :)

    as stated before, had listened to the top flight kit in the dealers, had v high expectations but was totally disappointed. definately not a worthwhile improvement on what i have at home imo.

    advice? if a certain sound sounds right to you, it IS right for you, regardless of cost, badge, or reputation.

    it does help tho if you do have well recorded music to listen to tho, it really does show what hifi is capable of :thumbsup:

    *anyone remember the recording quality of Oasis' definately maybe? a case in point. you can have the most revaealing, detailed fast accurate sounding kit, and it will still sound pants, the quality of recording on that album is dreadful :thumbsdow
     
  7. Pezerinno

    Pezerinno
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    Don't get me started on poor recorded CDs :thumbsdow
     
  8. Knightshade

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    Interesting points.
    Goes to show just because it costs a fortune doesn't mean it sounds good. Too many people throw expensive kit together and sit round listening to it convincing themselves it sounds good.
    To me a good system should get the best out of any CD. Some CD's will obviously sound better than others but if you are unable to listen to some of your CD's because the system you have makes them sound really bad then what's the point?
    This is where in the high end 'Source first' is absolutely true. If your CDP gets it wrong you can forget the rest. So many people forget this.;)
     
  9. Mike-M

    Mike-M
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    Most of these comments ring very true with me. For some time now I've been struggling to get to a sound quality which I consider to be "generally" good. I've been trying many and varied combinations of my kit (quad, dennon, nad, mclaren dac20, rotel, proac and monitor audio) and not been able to find a setup where I don't feel the need to tweak and adjust setting for practically every cd I play.
    I am coming to the conclusion that room acoustics are capping the sound quality I will be able to achive.
     
  10. AS_Platinum

    AS_Platinum
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    and just another point, the miss's likes the look of the Teac with its brushed aluminuim front, now thats gotta be worth its weight in gold if anything :D

    on another note, the bedroom is the next little project, now we are looking at the Harmon Kardon kit as it would match the 17" samsung lcd tv to a T, know of any place that actually sells HK gear so we can have a listen?
     
  11. Knightshade

    Knightshade
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    Where in the Country are you?
     
  12. AS_Platinum

    AS_Platinum
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    hythe, hampshire.
     
  13. karkus30

    karkus30
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    The new Naim stuff sounds like just about every other mid range amplifier IMO except when you pay for the 500 or whatever they call it these days.
    The older Naim equipment has stunning midrange and a dry and tight bass, its what makes it rythmic and gives tremendous slam, however it doesnt do clever things at the higher frequencies, just sort of ignores them. But and its a big BUT.........they need warming up for 2 days minimum and this isnt a hifi myth its in the instruction manual, otherwise they sound shut in, brittle, have no bass and sound generally pants :lesson: this is why many people get a demo of a Naim system and hate it, the difference between a fully warmed up Naim and something thats had a few hours switched on is chalk and cheese. Its also a mistake to think that the smaller Naits have the clout of the bigger models, it just aint true, you need at least a pre power of the 72/140 to drive properly.

    They also hate any speaker cable other than Naims standard stuff which is dirt cheap and do not react well to fancy interconnects as they sound just as good with el cheapo standard stuff (Naim use standard mains cable for theirs).

    Speakers with a forward sound can sound awful too as the ultra dry bass tends to highlight the shoutiness and makes the bass seem recessed so speaker choice is critical.

    Yes, I am defending Naims older models. I have heard lots of amplifiers and settled on Naim because they blew away every amp I had ever tried........and did the badge sway me ? No. I didnt even know they were well regarded, infact I was worried they were some old fashioned amp that was way out of date in its funny looking black box.

    Anything more I can add. Yeah the DIN plugs drive you mad but its a minor complaint. The build quality is exceptional, proper discrete components all tolerance matched and laid out and soldered nicely and if they go wrong you can get Naim to repair them, just like the legendary quad service.
     
  14. A.N.

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    agree again, the olive series to these ears have a more revealing sound. i bought mine because of the detail, drive, dynamics compared to others. but, i dont like the full naim set, and i think the speakers are pants.

    as regard to cables, i found the ones i'm using vastly superior to the nac series of cables. better bass, openess of mid-treble AND easier to route!)
    horses for courses really.
    oh, and totally agree about leaving the kit on. it does sound aggressive, brittle, hard and generally poop when cold :)
     
  15. Knightshade

    Knightshade
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    Radfords in Bath stock HK. Not a million miles away....
     
  16. karkus30

    karkus30
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    Easier to route, definitely. I have used several different cables for comparison (Chord flatline gold was the best)and you do notice different emphasis on treble etc, but overall the NAC cable just sounds right sort of complete.

    Oh yeah Naim speakers, dont like em, or Linn. The Isobariks can be interesting when carefully set up. But I bought Neat Ultimatum 7s instead. I do like the Naim Cd players, but I am using a CD17 at present and will be picking up a heavily modded CD80 for comparison.
     

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