VCR with built in FTV tuner?

Discussion in 'Digital TV & Video Players & Recorders' started by Squirrel God, Jun 21, 2002.

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  1. Squirrel God

    Squirrel God
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    Does anyone know of any VHS or S-VHS VCRs that come with a built-in digital free-to-view tuner? Cheers :)
     
  2. MartinImber

    MartinImber
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    I asked Sony about a DTTV Beta but they said no
     
  3. Squirrel God

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    Such a VCR seems the perfect solution to the problems of recording DTTV broadcasts (for me at least). Two tuners in the VCR so we can watch one channel and tape one channel at the same time. Timer recordings wouldn't be a problem. RGB output on the tuner out scart would top it off.

    Does nobody honestly make one? :eek:
     
  4. MartinImber

    MartinImber
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    Email Pace - why?

    They do DTVA and Sky+ so a bitstream HD recorder would be possible
     
  5. Squirrel God

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    I want a VHS or S-VHS one, because it would be cheaper than a HD one. I also want to replace my current VCR. So something like this would be perfect :(
     
  6. Starburst

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    Obvious isn't it.
    VHS or S-VHS deck with DTT tuners which can go onto the market this year and be straight replacements for hardware that nearly the entire population is familiar with.

    HD recording along with DVD recorders are going to be a niche format for the foreseeable future and a DTT FTA vcr would easily grab a significant share of the tape based recording market.
     
  7. Squirrel God

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    Yes, total common sense. It's gotta happen soon. I refuse to replace my VCR until someone does it. :rolleyes:

    However, if anyone does know of someone that does make one please let me know :)
     
  8. Richard46

    Richard46
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    The continued absense of any kind of recorder HDD or VCR with Digital Tuner/s seems to me to be one of the great mysteries of current consumer electronics.

    The only one you can get that I know of is called a Sky+. I dont suppose this has anything to do with why you cannot get a FTA Tuner equiped recorder however. Surely not.

    If you want to mail Pace as I think someone suggested above I was having a correspondence with

    Craig.Charlwood@pace.co.uk

    about exactlly this in April. Anyone else interested in a subscription free HDR with FTA Digital Tuner might want to let him know that I am not the only one in the market.
     
  9. hornydragon

    hornydragon
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    Try Grundig as well as they make DTV sets in south Wales.
    Grundig UK Limited
    Elstree Business Centre
    Elstree Way
    Borehamwood
    Hertfordshire
    WD6 1RX

    Switchboard:
    Tel: 020 8324 9400
    Fax: 020 8324 9401

    Marketing Department
    Tel: 020 8324 9495
    Fax: 020 8324 9406

    Grundig Technical Services
    Tel: 01788 570088

    Grundig In-Car Services
    Tel: 01788 570088

    Grundig Customer Services
    Tel: 01788 570088

    General Enquiries:
    infouk@grundig.com
    Also no one has launched a combi model DTV+ VCR for the bedroom, they joy of FTA/FTV is with the hardware you are sorted, no more watching stuff til 3am falling asleep on the sofa and gettin no brekkie cause you didn't go to bed.
     
  10. Squirrel God

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    Thanks, but I could never buy a Grundig VCR. I want one that is a decent VCR as well as having the FTV tuner ;)

    Perhaps it's just because the market is not ready yet. After all, the FTV digital tuners such as the Pace and the Grundig have only just come out....

    Maybe the big names will release something in time for Christmas :)
     
  11. Squirrel God

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    Too much hassle for me I'm afraid. I'd also need extra RF sockets and cabling. I need something that will run off just one coax lead, at most two. :(
     
  12. Squirrel God

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    Yeah, I know. But then I'd lose my RGB output (which is why I don't send my Pace through the VCR at the moment - I prefer to use the loopthrough on my TV scart to record instead) and also I wouldn't be able to tape and watch another channel of digital at the same time. Hence why I'd need two digiboxes and one of those would have to have a built in timer. Too much hassle for me I'm afraid.
     
  13. Richard46

    Richard46
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    Fine but after 2/3 years of digital television why are we still having to jump through all these hoops just to time shift a bit of DTV unless we go with Sky+ or Tivo of course. As far as I am concerned setting two timers is more than a bit inconvenient, I expect technologhy to improve functionality not regress it. Sorry I'm glad you are happy with your set up but there must be something better.
     
  14. hornydragon

    hornydragon
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    Don't forget the extra boxes in the room, yet another mains supply to find. I think digital uptake would be improved if these devices were available, a lot of people dont like STBs the name is the worst " I dont want bloody great box on top of my TV".
     
  15. Squirrel God

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    Yes. In my experience, most people don't even know that there is such a thing as FTV. They think that they have to pay a subscription :eek:
     
  16. hornydragon

    hornydragon
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    Or they dont know about the available channels:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: Considering that Mr Blair wants to turn analogue off in under 10 years they dont seem to bother pushing it very much. A DTV box antra £5 a month on the TV Lisence (we all pay for tv reception) would surely boost uptake dramaticaly. I think everyone who wants subscription TV has it already!! But the standard service (analogue) hasnt changed drammitically for 10 years, or in essence since Colour TV in the 60's. every comparable industry except Print has changed drammatically. Just hope the BBC get the lisence and do something useful.
     
  17. Richard46

    Richard46
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    And I'm sure that they would if any such beast was on the horizon. but its not and thats what I find so strange. Obviously this is not a world wide market but even so there must be a market in the UK worth going for its not rocket science surely, its just a digital tuner linked to some kind of recording device. We have TV's with FTA digital tuners as well as terrestial ones so why not recorders?

    Perhaps someone with more technical knowledge than me can point out the flaw in what I am saying.
     
  18. Squirrel God

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    There's no technical flaw. You're absolutely right. It's a piece of pi55!

    I'm thinking maybe the cost is an inhibitor... With two tuners, it would more than likely increase the retail price of a normal VCR by £120-£200. Perhaps not many people would pay that much for a VCR...... I know I bloody would though :mad:
     
  19. SimonG

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    There is a footnote is this months HCC that says Panasonic TV later in the year to have a Sky and DTT decoders built in. Then I suppose the old Sky box can be your VCR's tuner. Just a case of upgrading to a quad LNB and running another length of cable from the dish?
     
  20. Squirrel God

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    There are loads of workarounds and alternatives. The Panasonics have been on the horizon for a while now (they've been featured in their brochures).

    The point is, why should we have to do such a workaround? They make IDTVs, why can't they make an IDVCR? It's nonsense that these don't exist to make EVERYONE's lives easier :(
     
  21. Richard46

    Richard46
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    Absolutely; but I do not even want an interim tape based solution; why is there not a full digital Hard Drive recorder with digital tuners (like a Sky+ but with FTA tuners) on the retail market yet, at any price. I for one would be prepared to pay what was neccessary.

    I have to admit I've always hated tape its not setting the timer thats the problem; it finding the damm programme later that always defeats me. Is it on that tape or this tape? where on this tape is it? etc. Not to mention VHS quality on a big TV.

    I, like I suspect many people get 10-20 hours a week to watch TV, some of which is spent watching DVD's in any case. Now there is far more good TV on the FTA channels than what remains of that time if only I could time shift it to those times I get to actually watch. I dont want 100+ channels of cack curtesy of Sky, I just want to watch what is on FTA Digital when I can.

    With a machine like the above you could sit down Sunday morning with the Paper (no need for for an EPG) set the timer for those 10 programmes/Films you want to watch, and view at your leisure.

    You could not do this with a digital VCR; because of inadequate recording time; or even with current recordable DVD; (even less recording time I believe).
     
  22. Squirrel God

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    Exactly. Digital tuners should be integrated into all consumer electronics products where analogue TV tuners currently exist.
     
  23. Richard46

    Richard46
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    Yep; and actually thats all thats needed to convert everyone to Digital, rather than all this 'monkeying' around with subscription multi-channel TV that has probably reached customer saturation point already.
    So perhaps if the government paid the manufacturers a small subsidy for every piece of kit VCR; HDD or TV with a DTT they would get almost everyone to convert to Digital by 2010 without most of them even noticing. It would just happen as they bought replacements in the normal course of events.
    Actually in my experience TV's last far longer than recorders so the digital change over could even be recorder rather than TV led.
    e.g. my second TV is a 16 year old TV (a still beautiful Solara) but I throw out VCR's about every 5-6 years.
     
  24. hornydragon

    hornydragon
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    For £100 you can buy a full ftv decoder box from pace or grundig. Forget the case, remote etc and just put the PCB in a VHS, S-VHS recorder and hey presto, thats it, I might have a go at this for my Uni project next year, but it is that simple, and would add £50 max to the cost of an S-VHS deck less than 20%. But I think that the uncertainity surrounding the technology in the UK may mean manufacturers have shelved developement of the products for a few months, Samsung is a company to watch as they build TV's in Plasma, LCD, CRT, and recorder in VHS,S-VHS, HDD, & DVD formats as well as SAT Decoders, and are launching quite a few hybrid products suchas HDD & DVD-R Combi machines. I am sure that the stuff we are talking of is available in Korea already as they have HDTV in 1080 for broadcast, for the world cup at least. So is it a case of marketing stratagey, no one would buy a analogue VCR if an Analogue and Digital VCR were the same price, the simple change in manufacturing will cost millions to implement, so the industry will wait as long as it can, why open a factory to build FTV VCRS if they have a product run of only a few years, go straight to DVD-R formats or similar.

    My semi inside opinion:confused: :confused: :confused:
     
  25. Squirrel God

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    The Grundig box is now, strangely, £120!

    As well as sticking the decoder in, wouldn't you also need a way to separate two channels from the digital signal, so that you can watch one and record one? The decoder alone doesn't provide this, so it's not quite as simple as just shoving the box in.

    If you finish your project and it works, you could go into business modifying people's existing VCRs :D
     
  26. hornydragon

    hornydragon
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    I wasn't thinking of pass through, well pointed out, You could record the bitstream and then play back through the RF in of an STB or IDTV meaning only a digital set could play back the images. That way you only need to tune the signal in not decode as well, and going from a digital source to an analogue (VHS) recording is not great, so recording the encoded image and decoding as you watch is the best idea, not as good as Tivo or SKY+ but a start.

    It seems as though there is more to this than we first thought!!:( :( :( .

    Regards my project, as long as no one brings one to the market before October I could do it depending on finance, I would probably need sponsorship of a Large electronics company to do it, and if they are doing it already or have one in developement Im shafted!!!:eek:
     
  27. hornydragon

    hornydragon
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    Bugger does this do what I think it does?
    Click here! :eek: :eek: :eek:
    :(
     
  28. Squirrel God

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    Don't think so. It suggests that it uses a digital rather than analogue conversion for PAL, SECAM, NTSC.

    You got my hopes up there :(
     
  29. MartinImber

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    Well I paid £800 for a vcr!!!!!!!!!
     
  30. hornydragon

    hornydragon
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