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URGENT help and advice desperately required!!!

Discussion in 'Televisions' started by Salty Seadog, Dec 9, 2004.

  1. Salty Seadog

    Salty Seadog
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    OK I’d really appreciate some help here and feel that this is the only place that I can really get any advice that is worth its salt.

    Basically I’ve got a limited budget and don’t want to make the wrong choice as I won’t be getting a second chance.

    Firstly these are the models that I’ve eliminated from my selection…

    SAMSUNG SP50L7HX it looks gorgeous but I its pricey and I hear that the viewing angle could be better (can anyone confirm this)

    Optoma RD50 as I believe that this set has problems when playing back NTSC material and I’ll be mainly be playing NTSC R1 DVD’s on it.

    The 2 sets that I have it narrowed down to are….

    Sagem Axium for price, screen size, connections and the general comments about picture quality that I’ve read on in different posts on this forum.

    HITACHI 42PD5200 yes I know it’s a plasma but it’s the set that I originally had my eye on before I was even aware that DLP sets exist (they’re a new discovery to me) and it’s at the top end of my budget with a decent screen size (although not as tempting as 50”) and good connections.

    Would the picture quality of the Sagem be comparable to the Hitachi plasma, not as good or superior (even).

    Any help and advise on which large screen set to drop for would be much appreciated as time us running out (would like in time to view over Xmas) and the money will probably get confiscated by the Mrs soon to pay some bills.
     
  2. Carl_Docklands

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    Hi,

    If it is any help after much research and time, i decided to buy the Toshiba 46 inch DLP set and the latest HD player from Samsung. Its set me back around £1900 in all and will be reporting back on my findings.

    The Sagem and the Optoma seem to have a few technical issues of their own for me to have taken the plunge. And the Samsung DLP set seems too expensive for what it is and the stand is awful. Tosh have a long history in rear-projection sets and i think this experience is showing with the minor issues reported with their set.

    The picture quality from any these sets is superior to my 3 year old panny plasma it is replacing.

    I should be setup next week so ill let you know how i get on.
     
  3. emu

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    hi carl

    im thinking of buying the same combination :thumbsup:

    was a toss up between the toshiba ,samsung or the sagem :smashin:

    or am i better off waiting for the new sagem ?
     
  4. Salty Seadog

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    It has also just been brought to my attention that TOSHIBA and SAMSUNG have 46" models out for around the £1700 mark(!!)

    Now I’m really confused regarding which one to go for :suicide:

    Do they all have the same viewing angle and high picture quality and if so then I guess it's a case of which is the most cosmetically pleasing and does the 4" bigger screen size make validate the higher cost price ?
     
  5. Carl_Docklands

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    I suggest you look at a couple of sets down at a big Currys store. I never base my decisions on the look of the set - however!

    If its cosmetics you are after, this rules out the Optoma and possibly the Samsung. The Samsung set looks stunning on its own, but the problem lies in trying to mount all of your kit nice and tidy around it. I toyed with the idea of buying one of those hang on the wall dvd setups from Sony to go with it, but i dont think the cost justifies the performance.

    On looks i think this leaves the Sagem and the Tosh and its a close call. I think you should go to Currys or Dixons to check out the sets or your nearest independent :D

    As for performance I looked at all the sets and given a good HD source they should all rock. The only set i have not seen is the new Samsung. I saw one in Currys but i am not sure if it was the latest HD3 set.

    Like all projection sets the viewing angles are good as long as you are on a level viewing angle and not looking down on it from above. All sets have excellent viewing angles from the sides and in my opinion are superior to an LCD projection set such as a Sony Grand Wega.

    The only other set which has not been mentioned is the Sim2 55inch Grand Cinema. At £5000 this was out of my budget but if you have the cheese, its worth a scout as it looks stunning.

    Remember to budget for an up-scaler device (£800-£2000) and/or a new generation dvd player like the Samsung (£150), Denon (£150-400) or Panasonic (£250) which all have digital outputs. This is because your new tv can display much more detail than a regular tv and you will probably need a new dvd playing device if you want to use it to anywhere near its full potential.
     
  6. Mose

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    SALTY,

    My friend who is also my previous landlord bought the Hitachi. A great plasma display. He was at mine for a meal last week and he saw my set up, including the AXIUM. His jaw hit the floor, and he has now ordered one. Has to wait until new year for delivery though.

    I was in the market for a decent plasma, mainly the 50" Pioneer, but even without the HD demonstration on the AXIUM, the Pioneer's PQ was nowhere near as clear. So I settled for trhe AXIUM.

    I have mentioned before that I was born with a deathwish where TOSHIBA TVs are concerned and never ever again will anything with the TOSHIBA logo come within 100m of my home. Point taken that technology moves forward, and granted that the new RPTVs are much improved, I start howling at the moon whenever TOSHIBA is mentioned.

    If possible try and get a dem side by side, not easy in places like COMET or JOHN LEWIS.

    MOSE
     
  7. n_s_simpson

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    wait for the new Sagem! That's what I'm doing. It's due in January / February.
     
  8. Salty Seadog

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    OK I went to a couple of places today in an attempt to view some of these sets first hand….

    First up was a trip to the local COMET where after a quick walk around I located the only DLP set in the whole store which was the SAGEM. My heart sank as soon as I clapped eyes on the screen as the quality of the picture was without doubt the worst that I’d ever seen on anything before. I consoled myself in the fact that it was a god awful RF signal that was even making the plasma sets look awful. I waited around for about 10 minutes(!!) in an empty store before being asked if I needed any assistance to which enquired about seeing the set with HD source material. The sales assistant promptly returned with a DVD player, scart lead and a STAR TREK III DVD disk (not exactly the demo I’d been hoping for). I left him to it while he set everything up and had another wander around checking out the sexy plasma screens (one of which was playing SPIDER MAN on DVD and looked great!!). After about 20 minutes (!!) he was done setting up and called me over for my demo. The first thing that hit me was how dark the screen was and I couldn’t move back more than a few feet as there was a big display of boxes stacked directly in front of where the SAGEM was situated. I asked the assistant to skip forward a few chapters to find a scene with a bit of light and colour and was then horrified to find that the widescreen picture was just a very narrow black strip in the centre of the screen (literally a letterbox). The sales assistant must have seen the look of horror on my face and commentated that perhaps he had chosen the wrong disk for the demo. When I mentioned the incorrect aspect ratio he assured me that it was correct and the way the movie was shot (lol). I managed to persuade him to hand over the remotes and then promptly set the player to 16:9 and the TV to ‘Cinema’ mode and obviously the quality of the picture was drastically improved. I then asked if it would be possible to try the SPIDER MAN disk that I’d seen playing on one of the plasma sets in the store, which he was good enough to. I have to say that as soon as got that disk playing on the SAGEM that my previous impression of how smart it looked on the PANASONIC plasma that it had been playing on changed drastically as it looked so much more detailed and vibrant on this DLP set that was only really hooked up with a bog standard player via a scart cable with a limited viewing range. The sales assistant came back and was himself amazed at the picture quality that the set was displaying. He asked me if I would like to purchase and I tried to negotiate a discount. Well it wasn’t much of a negotiation as I asked for 15% and he said 5%, I then said 10% and he replied 5%, I came back with 7.5% and he replied 5%, I asked to speak to the manager and he replied I am the manager (I simply could not believe it!!!). So basically after a ****e demo from a guy who didn’t have a clue what he was doing I negotiated a £99 reduction of the £2000 price tag. I think that the free delivery and 5 year guarantee at JOHN LEWIS sounds much more appealing to me.

    My second and last visit today was to a massive CURRYS superstore (honestly you simply wouldn’t believe the size of this place). After a good walk around I was drawn in on what felt like a tracterbeam from the Deathstar itself to a massive screen with amazing picture quality. The closer I got to the screen the more I realised just how sexy looking the SAMSUNG 50” DLP is (talk about a looker!!). However I can’t justify paying £3500 for it despite its designer looks, although I hear that you can pick it up for around £2700 online which is very tempting. Can anyone please confirm if the viewing range of this set is better, the same or worse than the SAGEM (as this will be costing around £2300 with the ALPHASON stand). The SAMSUNG unit was displaying some SAMSUNG promo source material which looked very decent but when I asked a sales assistant if he could give me a demo with something else he told me that he wasn’t allowed to. I then asked to see some other DLP sets but he said that the SAMSUNG was the only they did. I asked about the 46” SAMSUNG that they were supposed to be stocking and after some checking he informed me that he could have one in the store for me on Monday for £2299.

    Where exactly would be the best bet to go to actually get a decent demo of DLP TV’s ?

    Now the only thing concerning me about the SAGEM is the issue concerning HDCP that I’ve been reading about on these forums. I have to be honest though as I’m not even sure what exactly it is and if it would affect me. I really want the set for viewing digital freeview TV (but will probably be upgrading to SKY+ in the new year), viewing my massive DVD collection (mainly import R1 NTSC disks) and for letting the kids (and me) play the X-BOX.

    I know this post is dragging on but I’m a real novice and help and advise at this point really is proving invaluable as I simply don’t have the spare cash (in my first year of a new business) to replace any bum purchases.

    My final question is regarding which DVD player to go for to replace my aging PANASONIC DMR52 DVD recorder. I was originally considering the PIONEER DV-575A because of it’s top rating in HOME CINEMA CHOICE, it’s progressive scan capability (does this really make a huge difference ?) and the fact that RICHER SOUNDS are offering it for £120 multiregion (which is an essential requirement for me).

    However now I’m told that HDMI digital connection is the way to go (I take it that the SAGEM does have this connection ?). Does this new digital connection really make the most of the PQ capabilities of DLP sets and is the improvement that drastic compared to say progressive scan ?. Any recommendations of suitable players containing this feature would be greatly appreciated and any links would be a great help. I’m also going to be replacing my YAMAHA amp as it’s a couple of years old and hear that DENON do a integrated AMP/PLAYER does anyone know the model number and if it’s supposed to be decent and does it feature the HDMI output ?

    Sorry for all the questions but I’m slowly starting to get my head around the whole thing and want to make my complete home cinema overall a worthwhile one. :confused:
     
  9. Hellicopter

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    As far as video is concerned,HDMI and DVI are the same and an adaptor can link one to another.
    Even though I have had a Sagem for six months and am still delighted with it, I would stongly suggest you do not buy one until the HDCP situation is clarified.
    On current knowledge,SKY HD will not be viewable without it.

    Alan
     
  10. Salty Seadog

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    I was thinking of getting the DENON 2910 DVD player to go with the SAGEM but am concerned that the DVI/HDMI connection will be HDCP encoded. Will this be the case :confused:
     
  11. welsh113

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    yes it is hdcp on the denon........you need to get a yamakawa or a motsumo dvd player as they upconvert and dont have hdcp also upconvert via component also if you want them too so pretty cool
     
  12. Salty Seadog

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    Seriously thinking against the SAGEM now (had my heart set on it as well).

    yamakawa or a motsumo (never heard of these brands i'm afraid)

    Are there any other compatable DVD players with a HDMI/DVI link ?
     
  13. philangst

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    saw the Sagem this am playing the HD clips and it was stunning. Salesman confirmed they should have the 45" new sagem in Jan/Feb. Quizzed him about the Tosh 46WM48P they sell (on web) and he knew nothing about it. Havent been able to see the Tosh anywhere yet!
     
  14. Nick_UK

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    Viewing angle has always been a problem for rear-projection TV's, ever since they made their appearance in the 1930's (yes, the 1930's !). Obviously the technology has changed a bit, but the optics have not. Since the shape of my lounge dictates a wide viewing angle, that (and the rainbow effects of DLP) made me choose the Hitachi 5300.

    When Sky HDTV makes an appearance in about another 18 months, I will then choose from what is available then, and a new generation of LCD screens is set to appear too, and there may be better plasmas by then hopefully. Until then, the Hitachi will do fine.
     
  15. Salty Seadog

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    Can someone please inform me if there are any DVD players with DVI/HDMI connections that are compatible with the SAGEM as I need to make my mind before tomorrow in order to get it in time for Christmas.

    How about the Samsung DVD-HD945 ?
     
  16. welsh113

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    yamakawa 375 and the Momitsu dvd players will for sure as they are the most versatile for the hacking options (even work over component).
    But they are harder to get a hold of!! Germany is usually where they come from in europe although some people sometimes sell them on ebay over here!
     
  17. n_s_simpson

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    Wait for the new 45" Sagem. It is much much better and has a much better viewing angle. 3000:1 contrast ratio and better sound system!
     
  18. soni

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    Welsh113: I'm getting the Tosh after i get back from my Christmas Hols. Just a quick question. I've read on this thread that certain players arn't compatible with the Sagem. I've decided to get the Denon 2910 DVD player to work in conjunction with the Tosh, but would the two of them be compatible? I really havn't thought about it up until now.
     
  19. welsh113

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    yes the player has hdcp as does the telly so they will work perfectly fine....actually will be hard pressed to get a better dvd player then the denon 2910!!! both use hdmi which is good one cable for both sound and picture!
    in the states for some reason some people are saying that hdmi to hdmi is better then dvi to hdmi so getting both to match (may) be the best option
     
  20. n_s_simpson

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    when you say you're going for the toshiba, are you referring to one of their DLP's? If so, why are they better than the Sagem's?
     
  21. n_s_simpson

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  22. Salty Seadog

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    Well after a few weeks trying to decide on which TV screen to go for I’ve finally been won over by the SAMSUNG SP50L7HXX seductive looks and picture quality. Now the only thing is that I’m not paying the £3500 that CURRYS are asking for it so can anyone help me out regarding a retailer that actually has this sexy beast in stock and available for delivery for around £2800 ?

    I’ve also decided to partner it with the SAMSUNG DVD-HD945 player to make the most out of the digital video connection facility. Likewise can anyone please tell me somewhere that has this in stock at a decent price ?
     
  23. rasb0

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    Hi Salty
    Yesterday I demo'd the Tosh 46WM48 (and bought one). The demo included the new Panasonic S97EBS HDMi DVD player and the picture quality was awesome. Sound and Vision, Bolton (where I went for demo) are selling it at £230 with HDMi cable. I haven't yet had the oppotunity to do any homework on this DVD player yet (reviews or pricewise), but thought it was a direct answer to your last question. Something to consider anyway.
     
  24. n_s_simpson

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    Do you guys not think the 50" Sagem is better? Their new 45" is supposed to be even better!

    I saw the Samsung but wasn't as impressed with its picture quality. I haven't seen the Toshiba.

    I don't understand why you didn't wait.

    I realise that the Samsung looks very nice but I'm not that bothered about that.

    Please let me know as I need some advice.
     
  25. rasb0

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    Same old predicament, in my opinion, you have to grasp the nettle at some point. I've been promising myself for about 18 months to upgrade my 37" Tosh CRT. Every time I've been about to go for it, the promise of something bigger and better on the horizon has put me off. This time I've seen what I like and I seriously like what I've seen. Technology improves daily, prices drop daily but I'm still watching my Tosh CRT. which is akin to having a mini in your living room. The time is right for me and so is the New Tosh. I might be wrong, I'll just have to live with it. 'Til next time!
     
  26. welsh113

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    i personaly like the tosh better then the sagem BUT as i have a toshiba dlp i am sorta the wrong guy to ask.....but saying this one is better then that is hard as everyones tastes are different!! But the new sagem looks nice but really does not have anything the toshiba doesnt except maybe pip or pap if that floats your boat....have had it on almost all my tellies and never used it once (who wants to watch two things at once).If you wait for the new sagem why not for the panny that will surely come some time next year or the promise of the xhd3 chip from TI that is 1080p not the 720p or wait even longer i am sure something will be better the year after ect ect...... you can wait forever
     
  27. n_s_simpson

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    these are all valid points. I certainly wanted to wait until TI bring out a SCR colour wheel, but unfortunately this is still in the prototype stage. I decided that 720p/1080i is perfect since that's all that will be required for Sky next year etc. It'll probably be a few years until 1080p is out and by that time I might upgrade.

    This TV is going into a new extension which won't be completed until Feb 2005. So based on this what would you go for? Also is the toshiba HDMI compatible?

    I haven't seen the toshiba, is it really better? Do you think it'll be better than the new Sagem?
     
  28. Capt Morgan

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    That is the great $64K question.
    No one has seen the new Sagem its not out till Jan. Also unless you can view these side by side your reduced to compairing the spec's and arguing via that route.

    An that way madness lays.

    Sorry if this sounds unhelpfull but I'm also in the market for one of these big screen jobs, my advice would be to get out and look at some sets.

    Also most folks who have already got one of these sets as helpfull as they are (And they are) may be just a little biased :)

    Its a case of being happy with the cost, quality, performance points of your chosen set and trying not to worry too much about the next big thing.
     
  29. n_s_simpson

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    That is a very valid point. I think I'll wait for this new set and then take it from there.
    The only problem is comparing, since most stores only seem to have one DLP at best :(

    Just out of interest what are you going for?
     
  30. Capt Morgan

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    I've a longish list, the main factor is funds which will be set by this years bonus.
    From this I've been working out the VFM factor....

    So....

    Bad Year = Sony KV-32FX60 The CRT I'm watching now :)
    So-So = Tosh 46" or the new Sagem

    Good Year = well I was thinking about the RD50 but not sure about this NTSC issue or the Samsung SP50L7HX.

    Above that well the RD65 looks nice :)

    I haven't done much more that the learn from this fourm as I'm not going to actively look a screens until the funds are 100% but saying that I've seen the SP50L7HX live and its a sweet looking set....
     

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