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Upgrade advice needed - pleeeze!

Discussion in 'AV Receivers & Amplifiers' started by rscott4563, Jan 10, 2004.

  1. rscott4563

    rscott4563
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    I currently have a Denon AVR2802 but I'm in the first stages of upgrading my whole setup, my KEF eggs are getting changed bit by bit for Q1's and a Q9c (front 3 asap) and I've just got a Lumagen Vision and will be getting a plasma soon, probably a 50". I was going to stay with my 2802 for a while longer but I am now thinking that an audio delay facility would be pretty important as poor lipsynch really annoys me and I think it might become apparent due to the Lumagen + plasma, the possibility of upconversion to component would be good for simplifying my connection issues, also I was thinking that once my speakers are upgraded they might appreciate a bit more power and quality behind them..

    So my question is what would be a good choice for an upgrade, my budget would be around the 300-400 at the most plus whatever I can get for my 2802, its 16 month old 2802 in mint condition in gold, I don't mind going second hand and would actually prefer second hand quality to new mediocre! ;)

    Really appreciate the help

    Ryan :smashin:

    :hiya:
     
  2. wilber

    wilber
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    Denon 3803 costs £700 new and will do what you want - I've even seen the odd one second hand. I reckon you'll get £250 - £300 if you're lucky for a 2802 so that's in the right ball park.

    Mind you it's not as good (IMHO that is) as the spanking Yamaha rxv1400 - £800 rrp, considerably less if you import from Germany - do a search for user wasabi & you'll find all sorts of info on this
     
  3. rscott4563

    rscott4563
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    Had a search and found the thread in which wasabi gave a brief comparison of various AV receivers and I took a look at the Yamaha rxv1400 and the 2400 both look very good, although they are both only 6 channel amps compared to the Denon and Pioneer and the review for the rxv2400 does state that the self calibration isn't of the highest standard, but I suppose the Denon 3803 doesn't have one at all, and the Pioneer AX5i which apparently has a very good auto calibration doesn't have video upconversion...

    Whats the thought on the Yamaha rxv1400 and 2400, I've always thought Yamaha equipment was a bit dodgy, as in not quite in the same league as say Denon, a bit like Sony, good but the sort of thing you'd buy in Dixons.. :rolleyes: But I suppose thats just a completely unbased misconception?? Afterall they do both have THX select certification!

    I've just noticed that there is a Denon 3803 for sale for 575, assuming I could sell my 2802 for 2**, is there a better option for this sort of money or would the 3803 be my best bet??

    Cheers

    Ryan :smashin:
     
  4. wilber

    wilber
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    Sorry, didn't make myself properly clear - wasabi has done a lot of research about importing from Germany.

    If you search for 1400 in this forum, you'll find some reviews and opinions - I've had mine for six weeks or so now and I think it's great. And no Yamaha gear is not dodgy - were kings of AV for years until recently. The 1400 & 2400 (which you certainly wouldn't find in Dixons) have gone a long way to pushing them to the top again.

    Having said that £350ish to upgrade to a 3803 sounds like a good deal.
     
  5. rscott4563

    rscott4563
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    Thanks for the info Wilber, the Yamaha's do look very good, and your right 'Dixons' what was I saying!!! Thats going to far :laugh: one of the things that did put me off a bit in the past was the use of their own DSP effects and they always used to push this element and quite frankly I thought they were a bit naff, but now that they have all the latest processing and THX. Its just a shame there isn't a Pio AX5i & Yammy 1400/2400 going second hand at the mo along with the Denon 3803, that way I'd have more of a choice to make, but as you say the price I could get the 3803 for at the mo seems a very good idea..

    How much do you think I could get for my 2802, is 200ish a good price or a bit under priced??

    Cheers

    Ryan
     
  6. wilber

    wilber
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    I have sold two amps in the past year a yamaha 630 for £220 & pioneer 811 for £200 - I think a 2802 is better than either of those so £200 is the minimum I'd expect. A quick search for 2802 in the classified section will give you a clue as to what people here will pay - Ebay may be a good option though.

    As for yamaha - I've had two amps and never turned on the dsp functions except for by mistake, complete waste of time IMHO.
     
  7. rscott4563

    rscott4563
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    Just been having a bit more of a look at the Yamaha 1400 and only just noticed it has PLIIx and THX Ultra 2 which I hadn't realised! Wow thats some spec, I've read some really good stuff about the THX Ultra 2 with creating 7.1 and I didn't know PLII was available on anything other than the brand new flagship amps.. So big thumbs up for the Yamaha's there.... :smashin:

    I will have 7 speakers once I get my Q9c and Q1's but in my current home I wont be able to use the surround backs :( so if I went for the PLIIx and Ultra 2 then it would be for future use, then again by then I might be wanting to upgrade again anyway.. Oh the decisions :confused: :confused:

    When I bought my 2802 I listened to the 3802, a HK (not too sure of the model but it was a bit cheaper than the 2802), a Sony think it was a 1070 or something, and a cheap Sherwood of some description. I much prefered the sound of the Denon and from reading posts here the Yamaha's are meant to be brighter sounding and a bit harsher than the more neutral Denon sound, do the new Yamaha's 1400/2400 suffer from this same traite or does the THX certification stop this?

    Cheers

    Ryan
     
  8. Smurfin

    Smurfin
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    :confused:
     
  9. wilber

    wilber
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    Tinny is not a word which describes the 1400 - in a straight fight with the 3803 it is no contest the 1400 is a better amp (IMHO!!!!!!!!!) I tried both (plus a pioneer) and it was immediatley clear to me which I preferred.

    PLIIx is great - the few tv progs I watch sound so much better on this amp than on my previous one (mind you part of that will be due to the amp).

    In Bristol we have two dealers I trust 7oaks and Audio Excellence - both recommended this amp to me without prompting when I told them how much I wanted to spend (Audio X previously were massive Onkyo fans and 7oaks went for Pioneer). What Hi-Fi arealso raving about it this month (for what that's worth). All in all, the 1400 is worth consideration for anyone in the £700+ marketplace. My only criticism is that the manual is awful
     
  10. Dimmy

    Dimmy
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    First things first. You're right, the yamaha does have Dolby PLIIx, but it doesn't have THX Ultra 2, THX Select certification ONLY.

    As most people reading the thread will know, I don't like - well - any yamaha kit really. I haven't heard the 1400 but I have seen it, and it looks just as ugly as every other yamaha to my eyes.

    I'm not sure what you're getting at with Denon receivers being neutral - they're far from being neutral. A very 'Warm' and 'Forward' sound. With regards to the Yamahas sounding 'Tinny' and 'Harsh', I think this is a trait of their extremely weak poweramplification, which is even lesser than that found in Denon receivers.

    Were I you, I'd buy the Pioneer AX5i.
     
  11. rscott4563

    rscott4563
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    Just what I'd read from other peoples comments from listening to them both... :confused:

    Here some links

    See Chris I's post here

    See GavinH's post here

    Maybe my use of words wasn't quite right, but I just mean that I like the sound of the Denon's and from what I've read its meant to be a very neutral sound (hence not adding anything to the original sound) and the Yamaha's apparently add a different colour to the sound?
     
  12. rscott4563

    rscott4563
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    Dimmy check this thread it clearly shows the THX Surround EX Ultra 2 symbol??

    Same on the 2400 site??

    An AX5i, yeah it probably would be my first choice if one came up second hand for a resonable price, but at the moment even if I got around 300 for my 2802, which is more than I'm asking, then the AX5i would still be out of my price range at around 950! :(
     
  13. Dimmy

    Dimmy
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    If you download the larger image of the receiver from the site you provided the link to then you'll be able to see that the badge on the receiver says "THX Select".

    If you can't afford the AX5i, the perhaps consider the VSX-D2011, which is selling at http://www.superfi.co.uk for £599 new.
     
  14. rscott4563

    rscott4563
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    Thought about that but it doesn't have the all important audio delay as far as I know...

    Cheers

    Ryan
     
  15. rscott4563

    rscott4563
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    Well it looks like my minds been made up for me, I've had an offer on my 2802 and have agreed a good price for a 3803, now I just hope I wont regret it a bit further down the line...

    I've ended up upgrading to a 3803 from a 2802 for £290, another big :smashin: for AVForums and all in less than 24hrs, wow dangerous place, these forums will end up costing me a small fortune, but at least it will at the same time save me a big fortune, compared to buying new and buying uneducated. :smoke:

    Cheers for the info

    Ryan
     
  16. Dimmy

    Dimmy
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    I'll look forward to reading how you get on with the 3803 :smashin:

    :)
     
  17. 337GUS

    337GUS
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    Ryan

    Been following this thread, always interesting seeing someone choose an upgrade. Congrats on the 3803, look forward to your views on the new amp.

    This AV lark can get pretty wallet damaging if you're not careful :)

    I was quietly browsing the usual forums/used sites today and ended up buying a used processor I had no intention of getting for at least another few months.

    Gus
     
  18. rscott4563

    rscott4563
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    Thats exactly what happened to me, I had no intention of upgrading at the moment, then a few threads later, a bit of reading and bang 24 hrs later I've just spent the better end of 300 notes and I've got a new AVR!! Maddness :laugh:

    All I need now is someone to answer my call for a second hand set of Q1's and a Q9c, for Joe to give some more feedback on the Panny 6 50" and for MAW to get back with his views of the new Fujitsu 50", oh yeah and a quick trip to Ikea... :zonked:

    I should have the 3803 by probably Wednesday and will have my speakers sorted by Fri, as I'll be visiting Superfi if no one gets back to me about any second hand ones, so a review will be following close behind. :smashin:

    Oh and Gus just wondering what did you upgrade your 2011 for??

    Cheers

    Ryan :hiya:
     

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