Under cupboard kitchen lighting - Shelley?

Thursday

Member
I am about to start a kitchen refurb and plan to replace existing mini fluorescents under the cupboards with led lighting. I'm not sure whether a Shelley RGBW2 would be the right choice for control and would appreciate some advice.

The mini fluorescents are in 3 groups each with their own mains power feed all controlled from 1 wall switch. The groups are a 4m run of cupboards on one side of the room and two 2m runs either side of a hob/extractor. Where the mains feed splits for each I have no idea but assume in the ceiling void.

I like the idea of tunable led strip but I'm a bit lost as to what/which to buy and whether I need just 2 strips with the one on the hob/extractor having a connector to bridge the gap. Or can I have just one strip with large and small connectors to bridge the gaps. Or do I need 3 strips? That would mean 3 power blocks. Does that also mean 3 Shelley RGBW2s? I assume so. I don't need the strips to be individually controllable but operate as one group. I will replace the existing switch with a 3 way retractive switch.

As you can see, I'm a bit lost. Any advice gratefully received. Thanks.
 

Thursday

Member
Thanks for your reply Seb - one run would certainly be simpler/cheaper. I was concerned that there might be a physical limit (distance) between each part of the strip and also a limit on how many "breaks". I've looked online but can't see any reference to how large a separation or how many is possible.

I'll do a sketch and upload later.

Switch is to turn on and off when needed, preferably with dimming too. This will be mainly for waf as I'll have voice and automation.
 
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Seb Briggs

Distinguished Member
I don’t think you can dim at the switch with Shelly RGBW2 module so a retractive switch is not needed

the limitations of distance are load and drain related

I have a calculator somewhere but on a train at the moment .
 
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netsukekoi

Active Member
I had a similar quandary when I was doing my kitchen, what I ended up with was 3 sets of lights - the ceiling downlighters which I switch on in the morning and off after I have cooked dinner in the evening, the 'over counter' lighting mounted under the cupboards which is switched by a motion sensor in the middle of the ceiling, if the sun is out they don't come on which is fine but at all other times they come on when someone goes into the kitchen and go out when they leave. These are great at night when you walk into a dark kitchen and you get just enough light to open a bottle of wine or make a cup of tea. The 3rd set of lights is over a low worktop in the corner which my wife uses (in her wheelchair) when eating breakfast, reading the paper, etc - there I have a proximity sensor, so it comes on when her knees go under the counter and off when she moves.
For me, this works fine - no 'smart' functionality or weird devices that need updating or maintaining, no need to tell Alexa to do anything, but lights on as I want them with me only using 1 switch in the morning and again in the evening.
With lighting - personally - I think automation is more useful than control.
 
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Seb Briggs

Distinguished Member
As a installer i believe that any smart lighting (or other function) should be able to be controlled automatically (motion , time or other scene) , via traditional switches, via App and also by voice.

Now that may sound like overkill but nothing should be removed or limiting when looking at making a house smart
 
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netsukekoi

Active Member
As a installer i believe that any smart lighting (or other function) should be able to be controlled automatically (motion , time or other scene) , via traditional switches, via App and also by voice.

Now that may sound like overkill but nothing should be removed or limiting when looking at making a house smart
If I were an installer, I would aim to do the same - you can never tell how a customer may end up using something and most customers have no idea how 'smart' will change their behaviour until they experience it. My comments were based on my design, for my usage, and were developed over a period of months - I started with Shelleys behind the switches before realising that for me, there was no value add.
 
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Seb Briggs

Distinguished Member
If I were an installer, I would aim to do the same - you can never tell how a customer may end up using something and most customers have no idea how 'smart' will change their behaviour until they experience it. My comments were based on my design, for my usage, and were developed over a period of months - I started with Shelleys behind the switches before realising that for me, there was no value add.


We also have to factor in the "Granny factor", as we rather insultingly call it, where a visitor to the house should be able to work out how to switch a light on/off without a 30 minute powerpoint presentation and orientation session :}
 
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netsukekoi

Active Member
Agree completely but having said that, that is why I have motion sensors in all of the areas where people don't sit (hallways, corridors, utility area, larder, kitchen, dressing rooms, etc) as that way. no one even needs to think about turning anything on.
 
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Thursday

Member
Thanks guys. I'll have a think about adding motion sensors.

Seb - by "tunable" all I meant was being able to select the white colour temperature I wanted not just a fixed "white" or "warm white". RGB less important but maybe I'd use it if I had it. That's surprising that you can't dim from the switch with the RGBW2, thought it would be the same as the dimmer 2.

Net - Yes, I will need some automation but a switch will be important for my wife and voice for me. I's a big kitchen so I will create lighting scenes such as cooking, dining etc which will bring into play 10 downlighters and 3 pendants (on different lighting circuits) as well as the over worktop/under cupboard strips.
 
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Seb Briggs

Distinguished Member
Unfortunately you wouldn’t be able to use the Shelly rgbw module with tunable strips as there isn’t a parameter for white temperature

the good news If just using white strips the module can be used to control 4 different white strips from one module
 

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Thursday

Member
Thanks Seb. Seems like I need to rethink my requirements. It doesn't look like I can easilly get the level of control I hoped for. Annoyingly, the one thing I don't need is individual control of the strips and that's one thing I could have. However, I wonder if the rgbw2 will support a long split strip on one channel to cover the under cupboard and gaps and three 24v led bulbs in the ceiling on another? That could be useful. I'd like to be able to control these as one group via a switch.

With regard to dimming at the switch, looking at the wiring diag on the Shelley site for the rgbw2, it shows the switch as "on/off/dimming". Do you think that suggests you can use some form of dimming switch or a retractive switch after all?
 
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Seb Briggs

Distinguished Member
Yea you should be able to use the module for the length you are installing

though a drawing would help me help you in best way of doing it

as regards dimming I will double check but there is no parameter on the module to select “dimming” switch
 
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Seb Briggs

Distinguished Member
Ah, a little more complicated for dimming at switch

you select the switch as detached and then use http/url commands to control the module

this only works with a momentary switch
 
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Seb Briggs

Distinguished Member
See below
 

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Thursday

Member
Sorry Seb. Does this help? Drawing not to scale but representative.

The switch controls 3 mains feeds which currently have mini fluorescents attached.

I need a 3 section strip to go under the cupboards. Gaps will be across the sink and across the hob.

I'm having 3 new downlighters installed above the sink which need to be part of the group with the strip and controllable from the switch. The electrician will have to fish for the switched feed in the ceiling. The downlighters don't need to be dimmed separately from the strip though that may be nice to have.
 

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