Unable to finalise DVD-RW

Discussion in 'Blu-ray & DVD Players & Recorders' started by JamesL, Dec 28, 2004.

  1. JamesL

    JamesL
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    Has anyone run into this problem on a Sony machine? I am using the Sony GXD500 and on some recordings (TDK DVD-RW formatted in VR mode) the 'Finalise' option is greyed out. Anyone got any tricks/suggestions/workarounds to get it back as I want to import it on my PC? Failing that can anyone recommend some decent instant write software?

    Having come from the DVD-RAM camp (Panasonic HS2) I do have to say that I am not nearly as impressed with VR mode on DVD-RW. The fact you either need to have Instant Writing software or finalise the disc is a royal pain. Furthermore disc operations (FF, RW, editting, timeslip) seem slow and clunky - although I accept that is dependant upon the machine used. :thumbsdow
     
  2. PhilipL

    PhilipL
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    Hi

    Probably the disc is already finalised, you only need to do it once, even if you continue to record to it. You shouldn't need to finalise DVD-RW anyway to gain access to it on a PC, I never have.

    Software such as DVD MovieFactory 3 Disc Creator edition and others include their own UDF readers and will allow you to import for making a DVD Video disc or edit directly on the disc.

    You need UDF readers because Microsoft didn't include support for UDF2.00 as used on DVD-RW (this is nothing to do with the type of disc used, record to DVD-RAM in UDF2.00 and it isn't recognised either, so complain to Microsoft). For some reason, only UDF2.01 as used on DVD-RAM in set-top recorders was included in the OS (possibly political and/or Panasonic supplied the file system drivers!), even though the UDF specifications should mean backward compatibility from newer versions. Download Nero's InCD reader (free) to gain access to these discs from Windows Explorer. Better still Ulead has an add-in for MoveFactory called Data-Add that fully supports all the UDF formats for writing and reading.

    Make sure you are using 2x DVD-RW media as write operations will be made quicker, however personally I have noticed no real difference between DVD-RAM and DVD-RW (Panasonic/Pioneer decks) in terms of operation speed, so this could be down to the Sony. DVD-RAMs speed isn't very different from any other DVD format despite the marketing implying DVD-RAM is like a hard-drive, and it’s access speeds vary little from any other DVD disc, after all, DVD-RW can do time-slip which was something we were told only DVD-RAM could do because it was like a “hard-disc” (marketing eh!). The reason DVD-RAM could do time-slip before DVD-RW was because (turning of defect management to do it mind you) it could write at 2 speed, once DVD-RW increased from 1 speed to 2 speed, it could do time-slip as well.

    Regards

    Philip
     
  3. JamesL

    JamesL
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    Hi Philip,

    The disk was certainly NOT finalised - for some reason on 3 out of about 17 recordings the Sony has just decided not to allow me to finalise the recordings. Darn :mad::mad::mad: to be honest!

    I assume then you have instant write software installed. I currently do not (never having needed it before) and putting the disc in the machine results in a 'file corrupted' or 'disc unreadable' message from Windows. Likewise none of the TMPG Encoder products can import the unfinalised discs because (as you observe) they require a UDF2.0 reader. Frankly the ability to not be able to "insert and play" is a big drawback for DVD-RW.

    I am - the much vaunted TDK scratchproof media.

    It must be the Sony implementation then. :( I can live with it but it's disappointing after Panasonic - I'll buy the Toshiba RDXS34 when it comes out next year I can return to DVD-RAM.
     
  4. PhilipL

    PhilipL
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    Hi

    I am currently using Data-Add which provides Windows with UDF support and also allows me to write data to the disc.

    I insert and play all the time! Installing software is what people do with computers, it isn't a foreign concept and the majority of devices added to a PC require drivers or software of some sort or other, so why the big fuss over needing to install UDF readers that is a simple task completed in 1 minute (and free) and needs doing just the once? Sounds like you are unhappy with the Sony full stop (i.e. complaining about the slow operation speed, having problems with it finalising discs), otherwise I think you would be much more pragmatic about instaling a little bit of software.

    For the majority of users of either DVD-RAM or DVD-RW in VR mode, just having access to the disc isn't much use anyway, and most people will end up with something like MovieFactory to be able to do something useful with the video content, this includes its own UDF readers and writers. All the latest DVD Playback software includes their own UDF readers also.

    This is ironic considering that the chances of inserting and playing a DVD-RAM in a PC is remote as most DVD readers do not support DVD-RAM full stop, UDF support or not

    DVD-RW in VR mode can be “inserted and played” in the majority of computers and laptops, you may not be able to double click Windows explorer and see the VRO file, but it will play from the software DVD player, while the DVD-RAM disc is spat out unrecognised.

    Regards

    Philip
     
  5. JamesL

    JamesL
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    PhilipL, relax a little! You seem determined to take this as a DVD-RW is c*** thread. All I'm doing is pointing out that IMO the practical end use difference between DVD-RAM on a Panasonic and DVD-RW on the Sony is world's apart.

    Because Instant Write can cause endless problems - refer to the PC GUIDE sticky linked to in the FAQs thread! I just want to insert and play - not have to install software to cater for a disc type that has no recognition.

    Given that when I ordered my current PC (early 2003) I didn't specify DVD-RAM compatibility as a requirement and I still got a compatible DVD-ROM the term 'remote' is hardly one I would use.

    As soon as Panasonic or Toshiba release a DVD-RAM DVB recorder I am going back to that camp with no regrets.
     
  6. PhilipL

    PhilipL
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    Hi

    Quite relaxed thank you :) I think the main difference is the Sony being slower than other decks you have used. Also why not use +RW and then you can transfer to a PC very easily, although you lose time slip.

    You do not have to use InstantWrite. Nero has an InCD reader for free (http://www.nero.com/en/Support_Tools_InCD_4_Reader.html). The problems arise when people install multiple copies of UDF readers. If you buy a DVD-RAM drive retail, you get given another set of UDF readers and writers from Panasonic! It is a mess I agree, having version 2.01 supported and 2.00 not supported, but this is down to Microsoft. Longhorn will have built in support (this may even be back ported now to XP) for reading and writing all UDF file system versions so doing away with third party drivers, which can only be for the better.

    You were very lucky then, as most readers do not support DVD-RAM.

    What is the actual problem you are having with the Sony recorder, apart from slower response times you were expecting? If it is just the case your PC cannot read UDF2.00, then that is easily resolved for no cost and little effort. It is no secret that you need UDF2.00 readers for DVD-RW from set-top recorders, it is documented in the thread you mention.

    Why not just install the InCD reader and just get on using the Sony and DVD-RW?

    Regards

    Philip
     
  7. JamesL

    JamesL
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    Because the Sony when using DVD-RW is rubbish in terms of editting and general use! DVD+RW is not an option as it doesn't offer VR mode. I don't want Instant Write software on my PC as it does cause all sorts of problems.

    The slower response times is the problem: not just creating a 'clunky' feel to the machine but also causing intrusive pauses at edits.

    Thankfully I have discovered a workaround now. Record on my Sony GXD500, finalise the disc (assuming it will let me!:suicide: ) and then high speed dub onto my Panasonic HS2 HDD where I can edit properly and dub back to DVD-RAM which then works in my PC :thumbsup: Long winded but it works!
     
  8. judy

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    are you saying then that you cannot recomend a sony to someone reading these posts before she buys? I will want to be watching films and recording from a NTL digibox things to keep and programs to subsequently record over. are you sugggesting panasonic system is better
     
  9. JamesL

    JamesL
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    I have the Sony GXD500 which is currently the only DVD recorder with a Freeview tuner. As a result there is no other machine you could get that can do 'all digital' recording onto DVD and so I would indeed recommend a Sony. However if Freeview isn't a concern then go for a Panasonic IMHO as there machines seem to be much slicker.

    No doubt about it. Editting is better, navigation is better, response times are better etc. If I had never used a Panasonic then the Sony would be excellent. But having come from a great machine (Panasonic HS2) to a good machine (Sony GXD500) it is a disappointment.
     

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