Toshiba XS30

Discussion in 'Blu-ray & DVD Players & Recorders' started by bobbles, Dec 21, 2003.

  1. bobbles

    bobbles
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    If you are thinking of buying a HD DVD recorder I would recommend you think about this one

    I have just upgraded from my Panasonic E30 and I am very impressed. It does take some getting used to after being used to the Panasonic but it is excellent

    I've burnt a few -R now at around the 3hr mark and the pq is far superior to those burnt on the Panasonic.

    Editing is a peice of .... much quicker then when I was editing ram on the panny. One slight gripe is that you can not split recordings into different titles, you can combine so this seems very odd.

    The menu system of burnt -R is nice and the high speed dubbing is superb.

    It has a bigger hard drive than the HS2 and is cheaper :smoke:


    However, the one negative point is that it does not allow RGB in (amazing I know). However, as I say the PQ is better IMO regardless. For XP recordings i would imagine the HS2 produces slightly better results.

    Another problem is if you have not got Sky+ the standard box does not output s-video from the scart, you would need to buy an rgb to s-video converter lead. Not that pricey mind you

    EDIT - following other thread It also allows you to assign the aspect ratio flag to a recording
     
  2. bobbles

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    I think one of the main advantages it has over other HD DVD recorders is that you only need to encode the data once to get it onto the hard drive. The machine then burns a perfect copy of whatever you select from the HDD at high speed. (I've burn't two -R so far with around 3-4hrs of programmes which took around 40min)

    Whereas with the HS2 for example, you encode the data (ok at a very high rate) onto the HD but then have re-encode it at whatever rate you desire to fit it onto -R.

    The Tosh method means that you record onto the HDD at the correct rate to start off with meaning you can obviously fit a lot more programmes onto the HDD.

    The quality of 1.4Mbs bit rate recordings means that you could leave some favourite programmes permanently on the HDD for easy access

    With the right equipment you can record a NTSC (R1 disc) signal


    I am very impressed with the machine.

    I have compared the PQ with the new -R I have burnt with old ones I burnt on my E30, on my DVD player which is connected to my TV via component outputs. The PQ on the new ones is far superior.


    One thing I would say about the recordings on the Panasonic is that they somehow use a variable bit rate. I have no idea how it would do this but I imagine it would use a higher rate when necessary compensating with lower rates on pictures where nothing is happening. The Tosh burns at a constant rate.
     
  3. HMHB

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    Nice to see a comparison between this and the Panasonic. Does this mean that RGB in is not such a big thing to have ?
     
  4. bobones

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    RGB is the better than s-video, but the main problem is that s-video is not available on most set top boxes. The reviews available from the link just below this forum in the main forums page suggest that even the JS RGB-svideo convertor doesn't produce great results, and they're less than impressed that the machine has no i-link and can't record to dvd-r directly. The older HS2 still beats the Tosh on a number of fronts.
     
  5. bobbles

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    I can not agree with you there

    I think if you list the pros and cons side by side the Tosh wins hands down

    I must admit I would think twice without sky+


    The RGB issue is overplayed unless you intend to archive everything at XP

    (excuse me what is the point when sky already compresses the data stream)

    then the Tosh produces better quality recordings regardless. I have produced -R on both machines (remember the E30 is an HS2 without the HDD) I can absolutely guarantee the Tosh produces much better quality recordings.

    With my E30 I had sky+ connected to my TV via S-Video and RGB. I honestly do not think the RGB picture was any better despite how much I tried to convince myself. I could tell the difference as RGB was slightly more colourful but does this quantify a better picture.


    Just to correct an earlier point I made the Tosh also somehow varies the bit rate on recordings.
     
  6. bobbles

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    I will try to list some of the pros and cons of the Tosh over the HS2


    Pros

    Cheaper
    Bigger HDD 60Gb rather than 40Gb
    Only encode the data once, burnt -R are a perfect digital copy of what is on the HDD
    Produces much better PQ on recordings over 2hrs
    High Speed Dubbing (you can dub over 6hrs in under an hour)
    Better/Easier editing faclilities
    Create far better menus with Thumbnails, different colours etc
    Better looking
    It has a very useful sat mon button which switches from the Tosh to Sky allowing an RGB pass through when you want to watch sky (you can select this even if it recording terrestrial, burning a -R etc, the HS2 requires a second connection to do this)
    You can put different bit rate recordings from the HDD onto -R still at high speed
    You can assign the widescreen flag to burnt -R

    Cons

    No multiregion mod currently availble
    No RGB in
    Recordings of NTSC (R1) signals produce a quirky widescreen feature (the two black horizontal bars on a 2.35:1 image are replace with one horizontal bar at the bottom. The total height of the bars remains unaltered)
    Bigger in physical size?
     
  7. BigRD

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    This post has nearly convinced me to buy the Tosh DR1. I'm waiting for Sky+ to be installed in January (£99:D ). But I still want a (Prog Scan) DVD recorder to go with it.

    I agree with regards skys compression and don't think there'll ever be any film broadcast that's so good I'd want to record it. I'd just go out and rent/buy the DVD. I see the recorders use for me as a way to archive somethings of interest and possibly from DV but then I'd use the fierwire.

    So why am I posting in here?

    Just wondering if you know if the DR1 and the XS30 use the same engine etc? obviously appart from PS. I'm hoping that the PQ will be as good as you described.
     
  8. bobbles

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    no idea, I think it is very likely that the DR1 is the same without the HDD.

    However if you plan to archive TV. I recommend strongly you go for the HDD version, you almost certainly will later.
     
  9. BigRD

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    Thanx for the reply bobbles,

    Surely if I have Sky+ there's less need for a DVD recorder with HD! And I really want Prog Scan and I haven't found any other than the Tosh & the JVC
     
  10. bobbles

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    the problem with sky+ is that it offers no editing facilities

    so the only way you can edit out ads etc is to do it live, messy.

    there is the pc route of course
     
  11. BigRD

    BigRD
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    Forgot to say that I'll be using my PC to edit ads and add menus. Also it's for sale at ££289.94 at www.digitaldirectuk.com
     
  12. bobbles

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    looks a good price to me is that multiregion

    cheapest multiregion I could see was over £300

    do a search for digitaldirect thread some people were having problems with them lately I am not sure if it has been resolved
     
  13. BigRD

    BigRD
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    It's for R2 only I think, didn't see any mention of MR. It's not that important for me. Maybe see what the Jan sales bring :smashin:
     
  14. BigRD

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    Hi bobbles,

    Have ordered my DR1 and was wondering what make of discs you've used in your XS30. I'm assuming that they'll be ok in both machines. I've noticed a few threads regarding problems with the Pannies and various makes of disc but none for the Toshes.

    Merry Christmas
     
  15. bobbles

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    i've tried datawrite yellows and ritek yellows both wok fine

    i think very often it is the luck of the draw

    if you know of on online place near to where you live buy 25 and see how you get on

    I use bigpockets who are based in lye near to where i work
     
  16. phelings

    phelings
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    High speed dubbing is a good advantage but I have stuck with my HS2 because the HS dubbing facility on all makes is pointless at the moment.
    If I transfer 6 episodes of a series from Sky+ to HDD,the recording will be about 214 minutes.Then when edited its about 130 minutes(I allow 5 min overrun on Sky+).So if I record at XP I can transfer to dvd using FR-realtime of course.But to use the HS on other machines,even the E100,I would need to do the Sky+ transfer at 214 minute level-better than vhs-but not as good as 130 minute level.The whole point of these machine over Sky+ is the editing,and if you transfer to HDD for high speed,you need to know the running time of the finished edit to get the data rate correct for the dvdr.
    What I want is a machine that allows XP HDD stuff to be done at high speed using FR
     
  17. Party Animal

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    I agree with bobones... the Lack of RGB input is a bridge too far for me

    example my aging 530 pioneer set top DVD player has S/vid out as well as RGB out. and have both connections hooked upto a 42" plasma

    there is no comparison what so ever. the RGB wins by Knockout in the first round

    with the s/vid connection I get artifacts --- playing the same DVD that the RGB shows in crystal clear clarity

    on small under 32" screens it is not so noticable. the same image on large screens is not even in the same ballpark
     
  18. bobbles

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    you would not record it on xp in the first place, why re-encode?

    you record it from sky+ at the required bit rate (so you calculate a bit rate to fill the disc at 130min) edit the recording and then make a digital copy of the disc at high speed.

    Recording at xp first is pointless and timeconsuming

    You are only encoding the data once which produces superb quality recordings it is not possible to do this on the HS2.

    The rate conversion is only used if you have got your Maths wrong and need to re-encode one episode

    the Tosh allows different bit rates for High Speed Dubbing.

    Unfortunately I do not have a plasma to test this :(

    however, I will make 2 points

    some people have said RGB is much better than s-video on 32" screens, it clearly is not.

    the tosh produces much better quality recordings than the e30 and that was RGB
     
  19. sdc395

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    Even on my little 28-inch set I can see a significant improvement when switching from s-video to RGB. Most noticable is RGB's increased sharpness, followed by its more natural looking colours.
     
  20. bobbles

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    it really depends on the cables and equipment you are using

    on a normal picture screen for a 28" there should be no significant difference between the two.

    I would say the opposite. If anything s-video produces a more natural image as rgb is softer and too colourful

    I honestly think for crts it is the emperor's new clothes syndrome
     
  21. HMHB

    HMHB
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    I must say that when I change to RGB for my Sky box all it does is give me VERY saturated colour - too much in my view.
     
  22. bobbles

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    my mrs prefers composite to rgb on sky it is all very subjective
     
  23. Party Animal

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    Dont like to be rude.... but has your wife been to the Opticians recently
     
  24. bobbles

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    this is through an old tv upstairs mind you

    I know what she means the rgb picture is too soft and saturated

    the composite is sharper.

    what ever floats your boat

    however on the tv downstairs there is a huge difference in quality between rgb and composite.

    However, this thread is supposed to be about the Tosh.

    With regards to the S-Vid vs RGB regardless of RGB the Tosh produces better quality recordings than the panasonic at 2hrs+

    The difference in quality increases significantly as the length of the recording increases. An EP recording on the Panasonic is nothing like the quality of an EP recording on the Tosh.

    If you already own a HS2 then changing it for a Tosh is daft TBH. If you are in the market for a new machine then give this serious consideration.

    If you think that buying this will mean poorer quality recordings because it does not allow rgb in, other than XP recordings you are mistaken.

    I do not work for Tosh. I own both a Tosh and a Panasonic. All I can give you is an unbiased opinion that if you are going to buy a HD DVDR go for the Tosh over the HS2 you will not be disappointed.

    If you have a digital camcorder then the HS2 / Pioneer may be better suited as they allow a firewire input
     
  25. THOWD FELLA

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    Bobbles, you said to go for an HS2 or pioneer if you have a camcorder. Looking in the What Video mag, it states that the tosh has an ilink input for D.V. Is this not true - as I am impressed with your report on the xs30 but would be using it mainly for downloading from my Camcorder (under one hour).
     
  26. bobbles

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    I don't know tbh. I think you would need to use phono inputs if you wanted to transfer from the camcorder.

    I know only the HS2 and Poineer have a firewire input

    I think if you will be using it mainly for you camcorder I would definitely go for the Pioneer
     
  27. bobbles

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    here it is
     
  28. Party Animal

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    the DR1 has firewire input
     
  29. bobbles

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    very true

    I think the first decision anyone has to make before buying a DVDR is to HDD or not to HDD. Personally I think it is essential even with a PC.

    If nothing else sky+ HDD is not big enough to hold full dvds worth of what I want to archive. There is no way I am upgrading the HDD after the DR update problems
     

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