Toshiba D-R3: No component out!

Discussion in 'Blu-ray & DVD Players & Recorders' started by redaction, Dec 3, 2004.

  1. redaction

    redaction
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    This DVD recorder arrived today after ordering it from Unbeatable.co.uk yesterday. Their website claims it is capable of outputting pal progressive scan, yet there are no component video outputs on the recorder. I was under the impression it had these as some folk on this site were recommending this particular do-it-all budget recorder.

    As it outputs in RGB, is this really going to be a big problem? I'm new to this sort of thing and have component leads and a Toshiba SD-240E for playback with component but no optical out - would you advise I keep the Toshiba D-R3 and get a coax digital out for playback of disks in Toshiba SD-240E machine, or replace the recorder with something else, say Panasonic E55 which does have component video output?

    I initially preferred the Toshiba model over the Panasonic owing to its support of DVD-RW, giving greater compatibility and flexibility than either DVD-RAM or DVD-R. So it's a trade-off decision and one I have to make myself, but the thoughts and recommendations of others would be appreciated.

    Ta
     
  2. Rasczak

    Rasczak
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    If you were expecting component outputs and you want them you should send it back. The European version of the DR3 does not have component outputs - and it seems as if that is what you have been sent - the UK model which (AFAIK) does have components is not yet available.

    DVD-RW doesn't really give you more options by the way. It is just a re-writeable DVD-R only less compatible. Useful if you want to regularly play recordings in an upstairs DVD player.
     
  3. redaction

    redaction
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    Thanks for your reply, Rasczak.

    I have a Pioneer DVD-R/RW computer drive so DVD-RW seems like a useful addition, the disks are cheaper than RAM and as they are supposed to use a metal coating to hold data rather than a dye (AFIAK), they should avoid the problems associated with longer term archival data loss suffered by -r formats. That's if they suffer same problem as CD-Rs, which I'm assuming they do.

    Wasn't aware that there were two different versions of the DR3 for UK and other European markets. I guess my quandry is in being a novice and not knowing what to expect regarding my needs - component would certainly be nice, but I have a component player and have just ordered a digital coaxial audio cable, so maybe that'll do.

    The Panasoic DRME55EBS looks good though. I wonder if there are any reports out on the quality of the Toshiba DR3 model?

    Thanks again Rasczak.
     
  4. Rasczak

    Rasczak
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    That is a gash dit. Any optical media can and does include various metal in it's dye - including CD-R/RW, DVD-R, DVD-RAM and DVD+RW/+R. Dependant on media DVD-R is a better bet for archiving than DVD-RW for a number of reasons.
     
  5. mray

    mray
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    I posted on the same topic a couple of weeks ago.
    Mine was a UK spec machine with a UK specific manual and plug, but no component outputs.
    The machine didn't impress me either.
    I would send it back and get a Panasonic instead.
    They're much better machines imo.
     
  6. redaction

    redaction
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    Why?

    I cannot find the link now, as I've deleted it, but a recentish study suggested the dye used (though different from manufacturer to manufacturer) was susceptible to degrade over time, especially if it was exposed to sunlight. I've had experience of data loss owing to cheap CDRs and thought logically, as was the conclusion offered by those testing the discs, that RW would last longer owing to the difference in constuction/materials used. The assumption that DVDRW/CDRW would suit for better archival purposes was based not so much on testing this media (as they never ran tests on it) but owing to the difference, so it could be a fallacy as you suggest.

    Have you any links that can confirm why DVD-R is a better archival medium than -RW? I'd prefer something that was set out for the layman to understand, if you've got such a reference. Ta.

    The Panasonic can record at VBR and be changed whilst recording? Unlike the Toshiba DR3 which appears to only allow for setting a vbr on timed recordings... Confirmation would be appreciated.
     
  7. Rasczak

    Rasczak
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    As I'm sure you appreciate I have better things to do that hunt around the internet to give you some reassurance. I would say the most significant indicator is the length of the guarantees offered by producers. Whilst I doubt even a quarter of their media will last as long as promised you'll clearly note that the difference between DVD-RW and DVD-R longevity lifespans is quite different. For DVD-R producers generally provide assurances of between 30yrs and a 100yrs. For DVD-RW guarantees are generally 'upto' 30yrs - the maximum I've seen is 50yrs (from Verbatim) and they offer twice that for their DVD-Rs.

    The bottomline is that you should trust no one type of media with your data. After nearly four years of DVDR recording I have multiple DVD-RW, DVD-R, DVD+RW and DVD+R fail on me. I am yet to have a DVD-RAM fail but then I use significant less DVD-RAMs than the other formats so that is hardly representative. Naturally you want to archive to DVD-R for best compatibility but you should also archive on a different type of media: Tape Drive, removeable HDD, DVD-RAM etc etc. DVD-RW structure is close enough to DVD-R as to mean you might as well just archive on multiple DVD-Rs - at least then you have greater reflectivity.

    Some links from my Favourites folder for you to trawl though:
    http://www.keller.com/dan/CDs.html
    http://www.osta.org/technology/dvdqa/dvdqa11.htm
    http://www.it-enquirer.com/storage/optimedia.html
    http://storage.ittoolbox.com/nav/t.asp?t=375&p=375&h1=375
    http://www.mscience.com/defmgmt.pdf
    ...and I'm sure your capable of doing a Yahoo search! You have to remember that there are no definitive answers though - DVD-RAM is the oldest format and has the longest proven track record - but even that is only 7 years old. DVD-RW is 5 and DVD+RW is only 4 - so it's still to early to say for ALL DVDRs.
     
  8. redaction

    redaction
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    Well, I will look at those links. I am familiar with search engines but no expert at searching so I appreciate the links from someone who clearly has greater experience than myself. The link I had was interesting and was the first solid proof that basically said people should watch what they expect CD-Rs/RWs etc to do as far as archival purposes were concerned.

    I believe that most users are novice and expect data recorded to CDs, DVDs to last far longer than they should rightly expect. The available options for professional archival for the average consumer are not within most people's grasp - I know museums etc archive to tape-drive, that's maybe a little more than I need personally. Also, recording to hard drive might have some advantages, yet they are prone to failure with a MTBF rate that with manufacturer's guarantee is actually lower than it once was (3 years standard to 1 now for OEM).

    If I find the link I had, I'll post. Thanks again for the time spent educating me. Not wasted effort - appreciated.

    Just called Unbeatable, they promise to swap the Toshiba DR3 for Panasonic E55. Guess I'll be investing in RAM then.
     

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