Toshiba 900e or Denon 3800

Discussion in 'Blu-ray & DVD Players & Recorders' started by chips, Sep 9, 2002.

  1. chips

    chips
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    I have a 900e on order from leconcepts, but since they are out of stock till the end of the week, I am considering asking them to change the order to Denon 3800 now that the new firmware seems to be available.

    I am looking for the best DVD performance (video and audio). As I have an HT300 Projector which has built-in Faroudja de-interlacer the lack of R2 prog scan on the tosh should not be a problem.

    I'm not interested in SACD and use will be exclusively for movies.

    Which machine is the best for me?
     
  2. infomatique

    infomatique
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    I believe that the Denon 3800 (assuming that the fixes have been applied) is the better machine. The 900 is excellent value for money but is a bit dated and it also has the chroma bug ... it has been superceeded by 9500E which is much more expensive.

    Others may offer different advice but I would recommend the 3800.
     
  3. Blu-rayx

    Blu-rayx
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    the tosh maybe dated but it works with no problems grin:,unlike the denons.

    the tosh also can play dvd-r/rw ;),not bad for a dated player, because some new dvd players can't even play dvd-r/rw.

    i've had my tosh for 4 months and i have not seen any croma bug :D



    dvd
     
  4. chips

    chips
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    Yes, I've been reading on the other forum about reliability issues with the US Denons, freezing etc.

    I really don't know what to do. To be honest, I'd even run to a Tosh 9500 if I thought it would be significantly better, but I understand that the main difference is 14 bit Video DACs which give improvements in prog scan, but not so much with interlaced signal, also I think it has a Silicon Image 504 chipset but as my PJ is arguably better with an interlaced signal...........HELP!

    I think as it stands the 900e has the edge but the Denon is likely to get firmware upgrades in the near future.
     
  5. infomatique

    infomatique
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    Be fair I did say "assuming that the fixes have been applied".

    Comments here lead me to give the 3800 a miss and to place an order for the 9500E (for various reasons I cancelled and ordered the A1 instead)

    Having conducted extensive research I have concluded that the complaints relating to the 3800 may have been somewhat exaggerated but the support supplied by the UK distributor leaves a lot to be desired. However I have also found that 900E is not without fault .... here follows one typical quote

    "I currently have a Toshiba 900E (9200) and have experienced the following:

    1. Motorised carriage noise with some DVD media. My original unit was replaced under warranty as this problem was more than occasional. This issue still persists with the replacement, allbeit less often. (Jurassic Park/Lost World Editions - The Ultimate Collector's Pack R4, 1st 3 chapters will reproduce this problem every time, & I have tried several copies of the media!)

    2. Prone to hanging (eg. Star Wars Episode 1 R4)

    3. Had hoped for better resolution/fidelity in 2 ch stereo"


    If you did not see the chroma bug on the 900 can one assume that you would not notice it on the 3800. All indications are that both the 900 and the 9500 have the chroma bug but many people are not too bothered by this problem.

    Many people who have the 3800 and applied the chroma fix claim that it is one of the best DVD players that they have seen on the other hand there is no fix for the 900 or the 9500E.

    I still believe that the 3800 is better than the 900 but that the 9500E is one of the best available. Nevertheless, the 900 is great value for money.
     
  6. infomatique

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    I would be inclined to seek the opinion of UK based 3800 users (not 2800 users) as it is possible that the US problems are batch related.
     
  7. -Spike-

    -Spike-
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    I've owned my HT300 for several months and have been totally happy with the picture. However, recently after reading positive reports about prog scan with the pj I decided to try it.

    The results were far from disappointing, less grain, even better colours and even more of a 3D film like image. For me it improved an already superb picture (IMO)

    All I can say chips is that if at all possible try and demo a player that will give you PS and see for yourself

    I'm using a DV88P

    HTH
    Regards
     
  8. gringottsdirect

    gringottsdirect
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    Not so.
     
  9. Blu-rayx

    Blu-rayx
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    informatiuqe,

    the problems you have with your tosh i have never seen it on this forum.

    have you seen the denon/artifact thread, that's been going on for almost a year and not once has denon said yes we do have a problem with some of our 2800.
    i had 3 2800's and all went back :D,denon's customer service stinks that's why i would never buy another denon dvd player.
    denon should stick to what they know best.....amps!!



    dvd
     
  10. AlfaKhan

    AlfaKhan
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    This has been on for quite a while now: Several people (and reputable reviews) list the SD900 as suffering from the chroma bug problem.

    However, it seems, owners are not reporting such problem themselves. I, for one, own one of this machines and have never come across with what’s generally described here. Not once in the 100+ DVDs seen so far...

    Have any of you, SD900 owners, really seen this chroma bug in action? If yes, exactly where?

    If not true, this is kind of an annoying misrepresentation, since, otherwise, we are talking of a superb piece of electronics.

    HB
     
  11. Blu-rayx

    Blu-rayx
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    alfakhan,

    just tried toy story box set i don't see any croma bug :D


    dvd
     
  12. AlfaKhan

    AlfaKhan
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    Exactly my point...

    My credibility as a father suffered a severe blow the day my kids saw me joggling back and forth, searching for any hint of the famous CB on TS. :clown:

    HB
     
  13. infomatique

    infomatique
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    I can understand why you will never purchase another Denon DVD player but you are not seeing what I write ... I never claimed to have a Toshiba so I have never had any problems with any Toshiba ... what I did say within these forums was that I researched three different machines the 3800, A1 and Toshiba 9500 and that the 3800 was not the only one to have problems reported by users and I quoted from one posting but I did not say that the problem description in question was posted on this particular forum.
     
  14. Blu-rayx

    Blu-rayx
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    hi,informatique

    sorry,i did not read your thread correctly.


    it's late :eek:



    dvd :)
     
  15. MartinCo

    MartinCo
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    dvd, denon or rather hayden have now acknowledged the problems with the 2800, but only internally or on repairs, just not to the general public (or dealers?).

    to be honest, I find this even worse (scared of recalls maybe?)

    according to the details, they have also read the thread but described us a "small percentage" of users.

    I'd post the details, but then I'd have to kill you so...;)

    I'm considering other alternatives if my swapped out mkII doesn't solve all the previous model's problems.

    one thing you can't fault the toshs on is reliability and consistent build quality... not something I've heard said about Denon DVD players recently.
     
  16. Blu-rayx

    Blu-rayx
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    martinCO,

    thanks for the update about denon.

    nudge nudge wink wink say no more ;)


    dvd :D
     
  17. gringottsdirect

    gringottsdirect
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    If anyone saw BBC1 Watchdog tonight where BBC reporters rang Peugeot about the 406 " boot opening " problem it was amazingly similar to ringing Hayden regarding 2800.
    Despite Peugeot and their dealers having full knowledge of the situation, and Peugeot in France actually doing a full recall, when customers rang Customer Services they were met with.....
    406.....what......the boot......erm.....no, we haven't had any complaints..........it does what exactly......oh, that's unusual........well we can have a look if you return it to your dealer........
    Exactly the same :eek:
    Major difference being Peugeot are actually solving their customer's problem, if you ring Hayden Labs and enquire what the situation is with 2800, they'll say........what 2800 ? We have a 2800 amplifier ......do you mean that ?
    They haven't had a 2800 receiver for at least four years now so it's all subterfuge.......they know exactly what " the 2800 problem is " :rolleyes:
     
  18. Annatar

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    I totally agree with you. When i contacted them they knew nothing regarding the problems of artifacting, and other problems with my 2800. When they received the unit for testing though, they sent me an email two days after receiving the player admitting these were known faults and they could not be fixed. They then offered to try to fix something ' they knew they could not fix????' or upgrade to the 3800.

    I upgraded!
     
  19. chips

    chips
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    This raises an interesting question. The Arcam DV88P has, I believe, the Silicon Image chipset. If prog scan in engaged, you will bypass the on-board Faroudja. Does this mean that you prefer the de-interlacing performed by the SI chipset, or that performing the de-interlacing at source is preferable?

    The Tosh 900e does have prog scan on NTSC (Zoron?).
     
  20. -Spike-

    -Spike-
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    Hi chips,

    In a word yes - I do prefer the prog scan over the Faroudja, personal opinion you understand ;)

    I have to admit that when I first heard people were bypassing the Faroudja I thought... why?
    Then after discussing the HT300 with another member of this Forum and discovering that they also used PS I felt I had to give it a go.

    With constantly falling prices it may be worth cosidering a player PS capable

    I bet I've not helped at all :rolleyes:

    Let me know how you get on
    There's not many of us HT300 owners around;)

    Regards
     
  21. chips

    chips
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    ARGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH........
     
  22. -Spike-

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    I'll get my coat.......:blush:
     
  23. chips

    chips
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    Hi Steve,

    Seriously though I think this is starting to make sense. One of the guys on the other forum prefers to feed his 300 with a Panasonic DVD with Faroudja Chipset, thereby bypassing the 300s internal Faroudja in favour of external Faroudja but the same chipset.

    You prefer to feed yours with prog scan from your Arcam with Silicon Image Chipset.

    The common denominator is external prog scan bypassing the 300s internal Faroudja.

    Since the Tosh 900e has NTSC prog scan and 90% of my DVDs are R1, I should get the same benefit from that.

    My head hurts.

    Best regards,
     
  24. MartinCo

    MartinCo
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    spikey, did you always have a dv88 with the projector or some other player connected via standard component/ lower?

    I always though the quality would slightly lower but not that much worse (faroudja and component out player against a progressive scan player).

    interesting though.
     
  25. -Spike-

    -Spike-
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    Hi guys,

    chips - is there any way that you could demo before you commit?
    Apart from the other 10% ;) I think this is possibly the way to go though anyway with the Tosh, at least you can try both

    MartinCo - I think I'd just like to say I preferred the prog scan...I did have problem a while back and one process of elimination was to try a Tosh 210 (component), picture difference was very noticeable. Then again so is the price!

    Back on track a little though, just to add I did briefly experience the Denon 2800 mk1. Well I experienced audio dropouts, artifacting and I did see what I now think was the "CB".
    Shame....I do miss not seeing the layer change

    All the best
     
  26. chips

    chips
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    Well, I decided in the end to go for the Tosh 9500.

    Got it up and running last night. First impressions are very favourable. Image is pin sharp and the detail, particularly in dark scenes, is a revelation. Blacks also seem much blacker.

    It plays all types of disk, R1, R2 & R1 RCE. Disc swap is not necessary it plays R1 RCE after R2 with no problems.

    Have tried both interlaced and progressive into the HT300 and after setting up both inputs to the same levels I can't see any difference between the two! Mind you I only spent an hour or two playing. Perhaps I will develop a preference in due course.

    Many thanks to all for your helpful comments.
     
  27. nobby

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    Hi mate

    got my tosh sd-900ee dvd player from leconcepts.

    Fantastic machine at a fantastic price

    i have seen no evidence of this bug, and cause its a tosh build quality is exceptional. hell the bloody thing weighs over 11kgs!!

    save a bit of yer dosh and buy the tosh mate

    you won't get much better than it!

    :cool:
     
  28. Blu-rayx

    Blu-rayx
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    nobby,

    are you talking about the croma bug?


    dvd
     

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