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Tosh 52WM48 Honeymoon over

Discussion in 'Televisions' started by orlaborla, Mar 14, 2005.

  1. orlaborla

    orlaborla
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    I am in need of some advice here. I have had the set for about two weeks and I am increasingly concerned about picture problems.

    The picture seems to 'block' and pixelate badly on most channels, I am using Sky through a Grundig box. I can understand it if the source is poor, but on Saturday I watched the Rugby (BBC through Sky) and found that the players were surrounded by a shimmering halo of blocks. If large expanses of grass were shown, then whole rectangular sections of it would appear to change appearance from rough (pixelated?) to smooth.

    Close ups of faces can have a very strange texture, with too much contrast.

    On the plus side, the picture during the 'Super Volcano' mini drama last night was superb, but the documentary later was almost unwatchable due to pixel/blocking.

    DVD via component ise fine. PC feed is fine too.

    My old Tosh 56 rear pro did not exhibit any of these problems.

    Has anyone else experienced these problems, and has anyone found a resolution? I am pondering getting rid of the set, but don't know what alternative there is in my price range. Help please.
     
  2. St_ve

    St_ve
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    hi orlaborla
    sorry to hear about your problems i watched the Rugby Saturday & the Irish match
    had a better picture quality than the English match
    I have an Optoma RD50 & i did'nt have any of the problems you saw close ups of faces were good .I also saw the Super Volcano & the following documentary & they both had good picture quality.
    I can watch TV using my PC freeview digital tuner ,anolougue from a roof ariel or by
    Telewest cable i was playing around with all 3 sources to get the best picture quality
    with the Rugby it was broadcast the rugby via PC was not fluid & was jerky
    for most material the PC tuner is the best source football & rugby is the exception
    Rugby via Telewest was ok no problems just not as good a picture as broadcast TV.

    Super Volcano & the follow up i ended up watching by broadcast TV the PC tuner was
    very slightly jerky this is not normal i reckon i have to do some maintainence in Windows.
    Telewest cable did not show any problems

    I have heard the Sky Pace boxes give a better picture than the Amstrad ones
    i havent heard anything about Grundig boxes
    The Sky signal might have had problems?
    Can local interference , transmisions cause interference on Sky signals?
     
  3. Les

    Les
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    Hi

    I have not had any of the problems you have experienced. I use a Sky Pace box with an unknown but large (so maybe a good) scart from Sky box to TV. I personally do not know whether the scart leads can cause a poor picture such as your report but may be worth considering. I watched a few minutes of the Rugby at weekend and had nothing but a pure and brilliant picture. The Supervolcano program which I watched all of, again had a brilliant picture throughout.

    I have had my 52mw48 set for a couple of weeks now, and only 3 times have seen brief examples of the kind of artifacts reports in this forum - and those only due to carefully watching out for them.

    I am using the following picture settings:

    Contrast: 68
    Brightness: 53
    Colour: 50
    Tint: 0
    Sharpness: 0
    DNR: 0
    Black Stretch Off
    Colour Temp: Normal
    Lamp Mode: Low Power
     
  4. schnipps

    schnipps
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    I think you are just seeing what everyone else is seeing, it all depends if you can live with it or not, we all have the same feed so people with the same televisions must just be used to it. Personally i see it on football and rugby exactly how you described. I myself am not a football fan so dont watch it, if i was i probably wouldnt have bought the set. In truth it doesnt bother me atall, its just as you say on football its the worst.

    The people who genuinely dont see this must have a totally different feed from sky as i cant see how you couldnt
     
  5. orlaborla

    orlaborla
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    Thanks for these replies, I am going to try some of the suggested setting tonight and report back tomorrow. Interestingly, a colleague at work has recently bought a Wide screen Phillips CRT and is experiencing exactly the same problems. His signal is via NTL/cable.
     
  6. khanman

    khanman
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    Orlaborla

    I also have the old Toshiba 56" Rear Projection television you mentioned and I also didn't experience any of the problems that you and I are having with our DLP televisions. I now own a Sagem HDd45 DLP Tv and am also having problems with solarization and artifacts when watching sport and some sky channels. Strange how the old CRT Rear projection TV's never suffered with these problems. My Toshiba 56" Rear Projection still gives a good picture even after 7 years and has not suffered with any screen burn. I don't know about you, but I am quite disappointed with the quality of picture on my new tv.
     
  7. nigel_williams

    nigel_williams
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    It's the nature of digital broadcasts and the large display which emphasizes the problem. I've seen Sky on a friends plasma and it was very disappointing, very blocky on football etc. I think he's considering a Freeview box for terestrial broadcasts as it gives a better picture than Sky!

    I have 2 Freeview boxes and tried switching between them during the rugby. The Nokia Mediamaster was much better than the Hauppauge DEC2000, but I sort of expected that!

    Going to try the Hauppague via my laptop tonight to see if it's any better. The advantage of using PC is that some post-processing can be donw with things like ffdshow, although I haven't tried it with TV broadcasts yet.
     
  8. moedeeb

    moedeeb
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    The problems with digital broadcasts in general and this is my personal view is that despite the hype digital TV as currently broadcast in the uk is not really upto large screen quality viewing. If you try a HD signal (via a pc only current easy option in uk) you will see a tremendous difference in quality. My view is garbage in garbage out - I know there are expensive solutions which involve spending thousands on video scalers etc or even taking the digital data stream out of a sky box direct to a digital interface on the display device but really why bother.

    I have tried all the tips and tricks and we just have to accept that broadcast tv will not give great detailed big screen moving images. Just look at a shot of a moving audience with lots of clapping waving etc which fills the screen and you always get blocking - the MPEG coding just can't deliver when lots of things are moving fast at the same time.

    My tip is watch movies on DVD and learn to live with digital TV in whatever format until HD comes along.
     
  9. St_ve

    St_ve
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    moedeeb
    while agreeing that digital broadcasting in the Uk has it's problems most of the time
    on my OptomaRd50 it is good quality & at times excellent quality, using my PC TV digital freeview card at it's very best from over 10 feet away it rivals the hidef demos they had on the Sagem 50 in comets.A high def programe i downloaded called Alien insect Praying Mantiss is a huge step up in quality to anything else i've seen so far.
    The worst programe material with digital TV is football/rugby most of the time its crap but sometimes you get a good picture.
    The problem is too many channels & not enough bandwidth.Hopefully as more people move up to larger screens the BBC & other broadcasters will realise there is a problem & respond by improving the quality
     
  10. CTID

    CTID
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    yes, I experience exactly the same as you. I am very disappointed with the pictures off air and sky. I had a 40" RPTV and the quality was much better. It was the size that tempted me TBH
     
  11. orlaborla

    orlaborla
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    Thanks for the replies. In one way it's nice to know it's not just me, on the other hand does this mean I have to put up with it as 'they all do that sir'? I bought a new technology TV expecting even better performance to my 5 year old rear pro.

    I don't see how it can be to do with MPEG artifacts from the broadcast, as the SKY box does the MPEG work and feeds an analogue RGB signal to the TV. I guess it is more to do with the conversion of this signal to a digital signal for the DLP chip within the TV. Maybe the conversion is ineffecient or badly written.

    As stated origionally, my work colleague is having similar problems on his new widescreen Philips CRT, perhaps also related to the software within the set.

    It is possible that a true digital feed from a Freeview PC may be OK, I just have to decide if it is worth the expense. My next step is to contact Toshiba and see what they have to say.
     
  12. St_ve

    St_ve
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    If you have a decent ariel have you tried how good your TV is with BBC1 ect
    can be very good at times.
     
  13. mdekkers

    mdekkers
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    dude, you got the wrong idea - the problem is not between your sky box and the telly, or in the telly, it is simply the signal that is being sent over the air. Capturing and conversion at outside broadcasts (rugby, football, etc) is always going to look the way it looks on large screens - these are encoding artifacts that you will always have. I find Sky movies 1 and 3 have by far the best signal quality, as does the BBC for non-outside broadcasts.

    A good example is to watch "breakfast" - studio stuff is great, outside footage is crap. Big screens just make the issue more visible, so to speak.
     
  14. St_ve

    St_ve
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    BBC wildlife programs have great picture quality & their coverage of Rugby last Saturday the Irish match was better quality than the English match.
    It's all down to the compression they put on some programs
     
  15. orlaborla

    orlaborla
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    The problem for me is that I had a 56" widescreen projection which did not have these problems, the replacement 52" does. OK the 56 was old technology and had its own failings, but the it had a good clear picture on most broadcasts. I took the DLP jump to get even better quality, but, in some ways, it appears to be a step backwards. The only change is the TV, not the feed. Have these sets been optimised for a digital signal without account for the present day situation? I am not aware of a set top box (Sky/Freeview/NTL) which passes a digital signal, they all convert to analogue. Maybe a pure digital feed is the answer (when it becomes available)?
     
  16. 1080 jawbreaker

    1080 jawbreaker
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    a really good tv will show the failings of a poor broadcast picture were as on a lesser tv you wont see them, even though the artifacts are still there.

    a mint picture on a lesser tv will look crap compared to a mint pic on a really good tv
     
  17. St_ve

    St_ve
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    Plenty of digital freeview cards for the PC
     
  18. St_ve

    St_ve
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    I saw the Tosh 46 last night in Comets i was given a demo using a DVD face's were very poor & unatural looking all the time, close ups were the worst & i'm talking of a person talking no fast movement or panning . I presume sky is even worse?
    Is it the same on the 52"
     
  19. pantages

    pantages
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    This what becomes of 'quantity' rather than 'quality', meaning too many channels crammed into the available space rather than having fewer with top quality pictures. We know it can be done and I reckon most people would opt for the best picture possible rather than a load of crappy shopping channels and others that show old programming.
     
  20. albertz

    albertz
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    As mentioned before, a good set will show up a poor source, whether its sky, dvd whatever, as for problems with dvd playback, this also is largely due to source, and connections,

    I had a demo of my tosh 46", with an s97 via hdmi, and there were no problems, everything looked natural, very little to no artifacts etc. You also have to consider how what your watching was shot, thats why corrie, football etc show problems, you can hardly blame the tv for that!

    I watched sky captain and the world of tomorrow (rental) apart from being an awfull film, the image quality was terrible, but this again was not my sets fault, rather its the quality of the source.

    you cannot blame the set, its only doing the best with what its got
    ( crap in = crap out )
     
  21. St_ve

    St_ve
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    For football rugby BBC & ITV channells a good rooftop ariel & analogue is better than Telewest
     

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