Tonearm cables: What is so special about them?

strato

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I am looking for a tonearm cable to replace the stock one on my RB250 arm. Nothing too fancy. A good quality OFC copper or (silver plated OFC copper) cable terminated to a pair of RCA plugs (and ground spade) and 5-pin mini DIN female connector. I would expect this to be a standard and common cable. I have done some research and it seems that any average cable would cost over [SIZE=-1]£[/SIZE]100. I really don't see why when at the same time you can find interconnects (2 x RCA to 2 x RCA) with the same cable specs and characteristics for [SIZE=-1]£10-[/SIZE][SIZE=-1]£[/SIZE][SIZE=-1]20. What is so special about a tonearm cable.

I have been thinking of building my own - not so much for the price issue but in order to find out if there is actually something so "valuable" in this cables that I have not taken into account.

So the idea is to use:
1.2m 2RCA to 2RCA interconnect cable with shielded twisted pair of OFC copper conductors
1.2m hook up wire terminated to a spade (for ground wire)
and a 5-pin mini DIN connector.
It seems that all I have to do is remove the one pair of RCA plugs from the interconnect and solder all 5 ends (1 ground, 2 "hot" and 2 "cold") to the 5 pins of the connector.
Am I missing something here?
I think that this can be done for no more than
[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]£20 [/SIZE]and not only be a major improvement over the stock cable but also compete with unshielded, inferior cables that are priced many times more.

Your views on the topic would be very much appreciated.
[SIZE=-1]

[/SIZE]
 
I think you mean a TURNTABLE cable, not a tonearm cable. The tonearm has very thin fragile wires in it.

The cable you describe sounds proprietary, and as such you would have to go back to the source or build your own.

Standard turntable cables are not Hot, Cold, and Ground, they are signal, ground, and shield, and the ground wire is usually the shield wire. RCA PHONO cables are usually two conductor, not three.

But, yes, you could do as you suggest, as long as you can keep the wires straight (what goes where) and do a decent job of soldering.

Steve/bluewizard
 
You have answerd your own question:
I am looking for a tonearm cable to replace the stock one on my RB250 arm ... major improvement over the stock cable
You believe that the "stock cable" on your current setup can be significantly improved (so why didn't Rega do it?), so you're presumably also prepared to pay for it. Why shouldn't a manufacturer cash in on your gullibility and demand "market prices" to make his living?

No doubt, this will start yet another "cables war" and draw moderator intervention, as always with such topics.
 
Hi Blue Wizard. Thank you for your reply. I think that it is actually called "tonearm cable" (or external tonearm cable) since it is connected to the arm rather than the actual turntable. The internal tonearm cables are cables commonly referred to as "tonearm wires" (although they are cables as well).
Regarding the actual cable structure I will have to disagree. Although the stock cables are usually signal, ground, and shield as you mentioned a good quality tonearm cable will have at least two individually insulated conductors for each channel (right -, right +, left -, left +), a shield or screen or both and a separate external ground cable. In some occasions the shield/screen can be used as ground and terminated to a spade instead of using the separate external cable. The 2 channels can either be divided into 2 parallel cables or exist in a single cable and that splits to 2 ends just before the RCA connectors.
By using this a twisted pair structure or litz braiding the cable can have some "balanced" characteristics. All the conductors are individually insulated and the braiding increases its immunity to outside interference. However, just to make clear, it is not a balanced cable. No RCA terminated cable can be really balanced!
My point here is that such a cable can be made without someone having to spend a fortune.
I appreciate the fact that some cable due the their materials and structure can be really expensive but at the same time I don't understand how come and there is no decent din tonearm cable in the market at a reasonable price for entry level arms.
 
The RB250 is a good entry level arm. The main reason this arm (as well as the Rega Plannar 2 & 3) managed to sell at such low prices and high volume is because the materials used are extremely cheap. Rega could actually spend a lot more money on the RB250 and make it a high-end arm but that would be expensive for us to buy it and would not be considered an entry level arm anymore. A number of improvements can be found on other RB versions so I guess what Rega does is very reasonable.
In some occasions, spending hundreds of pounds on improving an RB250 may make sense (if you believe that it will end up being better than a high-end arm and at the same time it will cost you less). However, for many people with a basic system spending £100 or even £50 on a cable is not justified. Especially when the cable's qualities do not reflect its cost.
I have no problem with the manufacturers demanding "Market prices". My point here is that you can buy an decent "analogue" rca interconnect for £10-£15 (i.e IXOS, Acoustic research, etc) but you cannot find an equivalent mini DIN to 2 x RCA cable for less then 5 times this price.
 
Well, we have to agree to disagree.

The tonearm wires or cable are very tiny wires that connect the cartridge to the point where the wire exits the turntable.

In your case, you are talking about connecting the turntable as a device to an external amp, that makes it a turntable cable independent of the technical realities. If we are going to talk technical realities, the tonearm is not electrically connected to anything, so by your thinking we should call them cartridge wires or cables.

Next, look at your cartridge, does it have 5 or 6 connections, very likely not, it has Left Signal and Left Ground, and Right Signal and Right Ground. The ground in the external wire becomes the shield.

Now you could have five wires in the form of 2xSignal, 2xSignal Ground, and 1xEarth Ground. Most turntables to have a fifth Earth Ground wire that gets grounded to the chassis of the amp. That could be what this turntable maker has done. I can't see the cable so I can't say for sure. But before you go hacking things together, you better get it resolved.

Likely if this turntable needs a better cable, someone has made one for it. If you feel it need a better cable you are free to make one or to have one made, but make sure it gets made right.

What is so special about wires of this type is the shielding. In many cheaper wires, the shield only has 30% to 40% coverage. Especially for a turntable, you would want 90% coverage. The greater the coverage, the greater the ability to shield and block electrical noise.


Steve/bluewizard
 
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Not that it really matters, but in many ways I would rather call them cartridge wires/cables than Turntable Cables. There are no audio signal wires connected on the turntable itself. The arm, cartridge, and cables can actually be placed outside the turntable (off-board). Anyway, the name is not really the point and I would like not to stick to it here. However, I'd be happy to discuss it in another thread :)

In my case, I am talking about a Rega RB250 but this applies to many tonearms (SME, Linn, VPI etc).
It is a very common upgrade and yes lots of manufacturers supply these cables usually for a few hundreds of pounds. This is why I am keen on finding out what is so special about it that noone offers it at a low price just like the rest of the Interconnect cables.

Generally speaking, the cartridge has 4 connections, the tonearm carries 5 thin cables (one is the ground), and the external cable would ideally carry 5 sets (or single core) wires. The photos attached show the structure of the din connector at the base of the arm and a complete external cable. I hope that this gives an idea about what we are talking.

DIN_Connector.jpg


nordost-frey-tonearm-cable-with-rca-connectors-820-p.jpg


I would like to clarify that I do make my own interconnects for years now so I am aware of the basic principles. However, the tonearm/turntable cables are a very particular type of interconnects and require special attention. Even the conductors should have different characteristics from the standard interconnect cables. This does not mean that they have to be expensive...
 
Sorry, the image above shows the female din cable connector. Here is the image for the male connector at the tonearm base:

partdiagram_male.gif
 
Right that helps a lot, The cable is 2x signal, 2x signal-ground, and 1x earth ground.

That shouldn't be that hard a cable to duplicate.

I would suspect the cable shown is two twisted pairs of wires, and you should make sure that you are using the matching twisted pairs, plus the shield which would likely and logically be the earth ground.

I'm not aware of anything extra special about turntable wires, other than they need good shielding because of the extremely low signal level. So, assuming you use good quality cable, I would pay special attention to the type and nature of the shield. Like I said, ideally you want 90% coverage.

Steve/bluewizard
 

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