Thunderflies and LCD screens

LittleTyke

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I bought a new LG W2234S on Monday. On Tuesday and Wednesday we had unbearably hot and humid weather and the thunderflies came out. A number of them crawled INside the LCD layer! I told the supplier that I never expected THIS to happen, whereupon an immediate collection and full refund was organised. The LG was collected this morning. That was my first and last LCD monitor :(

Now that I know thunderflies can be a problem - I was told today separately by several computer salesmen and/or repairers that it can occur with ANY make and ANY model, including LCD TVs - I am going to hang fire before contemplating another one.

I was told that the flies are considered an "Act of God" and thus no warranty claim would be entertained. I was lucky in choosing Misco, which I have used extensively in the past.

I simply cannot work with flies crawling inside the monitor. Plus, as I have now found through Googling, sometimes the flies die and it's like having five dead pixels. Two flies = ten dead pixels.

BTW, I looked at a working (Vista) HP widescreen (20") in Comet this afternoon and its display was streets ahead of the LG. Pretty darned good, the HP. Of course, the price was considerably higher.

My question: What are users' experiences? You folks out there who have owned and/or used LCDs probably in all price ranges for several years already. Did anyone find that certain brands are sealed better? Why, in fact, are the screens not sealed 100%?

Can anything be done to eliminate the ingress of such insects, e.g. by enclosing the monitor in some kind of cabinet with a hepa filter to maintain airflow? (I don't think even thunderflies would make it through a hepa filter.)

What about environments where NO contamination from creepy-crawlies could be tolerated? I'm thinking here of laboratories, research establishments. Are there "ruggedised" monitors for such usage? Maybe I shall have to spend a lot more money to get what I want (namely 0% bugs inside the LCD layer). The LG was very inexpensive - maybe TOO inexpensive.

Anyway, any suggestions are most welcome. So far I have been recommended HP, ASUS, Eizo, or BenQ. The Eizo range, however, is out of the question, as they cost a fortune. I am terribly disappointed with my purchase, since I was completely unaware of the problem beforehand.

Meanwhile I shall just carry on using my trusty Philips 19" 107E6. Not as wide, but absolutely NO flies inside!

Thanks.
 
Hi LittleTyke, & welcome :)

Many thanks for your response!

Related post here: http://www.avforums.com/forums/lcd-televisions/237148-thunder-bugs-lcd-tv.html, with a few pointers to lessen the problem.

That was a very interesting read. See my summary below.

Member MM wouldn't be you now, would it :p?

Guilty as charged! I believe in finding as much information as I can from as many sources as I can when a new problem strikes.

And now to the summary. This refers in general to that thread above and to my enquiries:

1. I would suggest this is less of a problem with a fax machine, a watch, or even a flatscreen TV. The first two are only looked at fleetingly and the TV is watched from a far greater distance than when working at a PC. Irritating, nevertheless, if one has an expensive wrist-watch, say. Suffice to say, I was only ever made aware of the problem after I had been using my first LCD monitor for about six hours.

(How strange that the manufacturers do not place a Warning on the outside of the packaging: "Ensure your work area is free of thunderflies or thrips in humid weather as these may become trapped inside the monitor and void the replacement warranty.")

2. I am definitely going to get one of the electronic blue-light fly killers like the one referred to in the other thread, i.e. the "Flyshield 1 Glue Board Flykiller". I would get one anyway, since these flies amass in their hundreds and they crawl through one's hair, on clothes, everywhere. However, the problem with LCD screens is for me much more significant and I shall do my utmost to prevent any dying inside the next screen I purchase (Misco have kindly accepted the LG back for a full refund).

3. Today I discussed the problem with staff at PC World and once again they only confirm that it is a general problem; they had all seen it; there is nothing to be done. (Huh, we'll see about that!)

4. Better sealing, possible reasons why not: (a) The designers of these devices are only vaguely aware of thunderfly infestation in isolated areas in some countries and just ignore the relatively few customers who complain. (b) The sealing cannot be 100% because there has to be air circulating through/around the LCD membrane. (c) Better sealing would be technically/electronically feasible, but it would increase the price by 20%

5. My suggestions to the manufacturers: Place the panel inside a hepa filter "bag" such that air can still circulate but bugs can't get in. (I doubt whether even thunderflies would be able to permeate a thick hepa filter, especially if this was factory-treated with insecticide. If this increases the price, I would pay it. Non-hepa models could still be sold to those who are unaffected by thunderflies. The products could be designed so that the same panel can be fitted in the same body, except that a hepa filter could be additionally fitted in the more expensive version, so the makers wouldn't need separate production lines.

6. The manufacturers could, alternatively, design the monitors to be easily taken apart without voiding the warranty in order to remove dead thunderflies.

7. Disassembly advice for most monitors: The other thread mentions several instances where users have disassembled their monitors to get dead ones out. It would be useful for as many users as poss to compile detailed disassembly information in one place on how to take apart an LG screen, or a Samsung, or a "whatever" brand. Which parts NOT to touch, what NOT to do, etc etc.

-----

Right, that's me done for this afternoon! The best, the VERY BEST screen I've seen today was the 24" Apple Mac at PC World!! Man, that was astounding quality. Some people don't like the glossy, glass surface, but I much prefer it to the soft-to-the-touch ones. But this 24" monster is, of course, only Apple (unless anyone knows of a very close clone for PCs). The PC World guy recommended either HP or Dell for flatscreen monitors.
 
Yes, those Apple screens are very good, but also very, very expensive.

However, if you're willing to spend ~ÂŁ420, here are couple of non-TN* 24" screens that are definitely worthy of consideration & shouldn't disappoint:

HP LP2475w | Reviews @ Prad & TFTCentral | Main AVF discussion here | Possibly cheapest @ eBuyer ÂŁ420 (free delivery option available)

Dell UltraSharp 2408WFP | Reviews @ Prad & TFTCentral | Main AVF discussion here | Possibly cheapest @ Scan ÂŁ420 (free delivery courtesy of AVF-Scan)

*TN Film, MVA, PVA and IPS Panel Technologies - TFTCentral

Btw, glossy/reflective screens are generally nice in small doses, but can get tiresome & frustrating to work with over time. Yeah, I guess it is one of those things you either love or hate :D!
.
 
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Btw, glossy/reflective screens are generally nice in small doses, but can get tiresome & frustrating to work with over time. Yeah, I guess it is one of those things you either love or hate :D!
.

Thanks for the info on those screens. I'll take a look. Re the glossy screens, I just like the hard surface. I don't care much for the soft-touch surface that is more usual in the cheaper models. Maybe it's because I have only ever used glass-fronted CRT monitors since 1978!

Anyway, I have just spent an interesting couple of hours designing a mockup enclosure for a typical LCD monitor:

http://www.littletyke.myzen.co.uk/lcd/index.html

(Dunno how to turn that URL into a clickable one on avforums - if I have 'Automatically parse links in text' checked, I don't see the URL at all when I preview, I just see the word Home that hides the URL.:lease:)


I think I'll make one. I make lots of weird things like this! The walls can be 20mm MDF or plywood, with reinforcement struts wood-glued in as necessary (e.g. 20mm x 50mm construction timber). The hepa filters could be cut from replacement filters for Miele or other up-market vacuum cleaners. These are around ten pounds (or roughly 15 bucks). Dunno how long the filters would last, but I suppose the proof is in the pudding: (1) the monitor must not overheat; (2) no thunder flies inside the box. (If there are none in the box, there cannot be any in the LCD.) I might test it using a secondhand, cheapo flatscreen monitor, the worst quality the better (to 'encourage' the flies to test the gaps!). If none got in with a cheapo brand, then more expensive brands would surely be that much more resilient.

It'd take a weekend to build if all parts had been acquired. Total cost? I reckon about 30 quid (45 bucks) tops.

The monitor could be switched off at the wall socket when not in use. Otherwise, I usually find I never have to adjust the controls on monitors. They are left alone for months, even years. But of course, the glass front would have to be easily removable to gain access to the monitor for adjustment. The seal around the glass could maybe be achieved with draught excluder (rubber or foam) such as fitted to household doors and windows in winter.

If the exterior of the box were finished nicely, either veneered or painted, it could look quite smart! The addition of a few dummy LEDs winking away and guests would think, hey, what a fab machine ole Tykey-boy has! Maybe I could start a small business making 'em for others...
 
I too have had a problem with a Viewsonic VA2226w monitor. 15 of the little b****rs have got in and died. I am just about to do battle with Viewsonic over warranty liability!!! :mad:

I also have a huge Dell LCD monitor in the same room - in fact it is in an even more vulnerable position right next to the window and I look out over open fields. It is regularly crawling with thunderbugs in the summer - but only ever on the outside! After several years daily use it is still perfect on the inside. :D

Having trolled round the internet I have never seen a complaint about the Dell monitors, so I shall stick with them in future. :smashin:

A few years ago I had an early AOC LCD that got 4 or 5 bugs inside when it was outside warranty. I managed to get it apart (NOT easy first time - OK once you know how!) and gently separated the glass from the LCD layer and managed (on the second attempt - the bugs are impossible to see if they are on the LCD layer once apart!) to remove the bugs. The actual screen assembly was only held together by aluminum sticky tape, the whole lot then clamped into the plastic frame. When I put it together again I sealed it more carefully than the manufacturer (who had left gaps at the corners) and have had no trouble since. This is OK for the brave DIY'er but I'm not sure I'd recommend it to most people!

More people should complain about this and some consumer group should take it up with the manufacturers...
 
Ive only ever had one fly and it was on my old 15" work monitor - the little blighter was there for days, running up and down the screen... I grew rather fond of the little blighter.

Had my LCD at home for 3 years or so, and never had a problem with it... touch wood!
 
I don't care much for the soft-touch surface that is more usual in the cheaper models.
LittleTyke, I think you'll find that most LCD monitors, including the glossy/reflective ones - whether cheap or high-end & expensive - come with the non-hard surface. If I recall correctly, Xerox, AG Neovo, Iiyama, LG, AOC & a few others did hard-coated/glass screens in the past with some of their models, but one hardly comes across them these days. That must be a telling stat in itself.

Maybe it's because I have only ever used glass-fronted CRT monitors since 1978!
That's what it is then, & has nothing to do with the inherent quality of a screen.

-----------------------------------------------------

A few years ago I had an early AOC LCD that got 4 or 5 bugs inside when it was outside warranty. I managed to get it apart (NOT easy first time - OK once you know how!) and gently separated the glass from the LCD layer and managed (on the second attempt - the bugs are impossible to see if they are on the LCD layer once apart!) to remove the bugs. The actual screen assembly was only held together by aluminum sticky tape, the whole lot then clamped into the plastic frame. When I put it together again I sealed it more carefully than the manufacturer (who had left gaps at the corners) and have had no trouble since. This is OK for the brave DIY'er but I'm not sure I'd recommend it to most people!
plasmarick, that's very brave & industrious of you :smashin:
 
In the meantime I have temporarily put the acquisition of a flat screen (LCD) monitor on hold and have instead acquired a massive 19" Hansol 920p CRT monitor for free, via gumtree. When I referred in an earlier post to my 19" Philips CRT, I really meant a 17". The "new" 19" Hansol is quite a bit bigger, and HEAVIER!! I had to lug it up the stairs a step at a time, resting the monitor on the next step for a few seconds, it's that heavy. Still works brilliantly, though, and the owner was only too happy to let it go to a new home rather than down the tip. He even still had the original setup CD-ROM.

I still haven't scrapped my idea for a box to put an LCD monitor in, and only this morning while cooking breakfast I suddenly realised that a cooker hood filter would make an ideal material (and cheap) from which to cut several thunderfly-proof filters for my box!
 
In past experiance they usually just leave the monitor after a day or 2.

However, on my current 19" Dabs Value monitor at home (it has been a great monitor for me over the last few years!), I got a really persistant thunderfly a year back or so and at first I did not know what it was.

Anyway, I thought it would be a 'good' idea to try and kill him (or her, I'm not being sexist) with my powerful laser pen. After about 5 minutes of chasing the little git over the top left hand side of my monitor, I finally killed him. Now this was a stupid idea for 2 reasons. Firstly, the dead thunderfly was now STUCK inside my monitor and not moving and secondly, now when my monitor shows a black background, I get a winding trail of green pixels in the top left of my screen.

Fortunately the thunderfly fell to the bottom of the monitor out of view.
 
Fortunately the thunderfly fell to the bottom of the monitor out of view.

I couldn't risk it. My new LG 22" was barely 6 hours in use and I had several inside the screen. Yes, they crawled back out again, but I was so disillusioned that I knew I would never be able to work comfortably again without fear of having one die on me. So the LG went back, I got a full refund (it was within the seven days) and I shall think again before buying another.
 
Ive only ever had one fly and it was on my old 15" work monitor - the little blighter was there for days, running up and down the screen... I grew rather fond of the little blighter.

lol :D work can be a lonely place..
 

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