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The Hunt For Britian's Paedophiles

Discussion in 'TV Show Forum' started by PoochJD, Jun 6, 2002.

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  1. PoochJD

    PoochJD
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    Hi,

    I don't know if any of you caught tonights airing of the first of three parts of this BBC documentary, but I just felt like I had to come online, and express my thoughts on it.

    Firstly, congratulations to the BBC for having the courage to air a programme that dealt properly with the whole issues surrounding paedophiles and paedophilia! (Unlike C4's awful "BrassEye Special"!)

    Secondly, congratulations to everyone involved, both infront of and behind the cameras, for exposiung this horrendous crime, with an unreleting eye to the British public, for the first time, without resorting to tabloid-style commentary.

    I know the BBC will receive many thousands of complaints about airing this show, and airing it so early in the evening, and I also expect the ITC and Broadcasting Standards Commission to receive similar complaints, but I was extremely impressed by this brutally uncompromising and thought-provoking documentary.

    Unlike "BrassEye", this show really got under the skin of what paedophilia is really all about:- men getting sexual pleasure from the abuse and torture of young children! Unlike "BE", it didn't trivialise the issue, or try to make it "comfortable viewing". Instead, we got real insight into the men and women who have to deal with these sordid individuals on a daily basis.

    I look forward to seeing the rest of this harrowing series, even though I know it will be an incredibly uncomfortable experience to view. Seeing some of the material in the show, really brought home to me, just how shocking it must be, to be involved with the London's Anti-Paedophile Unit.

    What do the rest of you think?

    Pooch
     
  2. Squirrel God

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    I didn't catch this, but I wish I had. Having been a regular user of chat rooms a year or so ago, I was shocked at how many young children were on line talking to adults both in the main room and on pm. I do wonder about their parents who are obviously oblivious to what is going on.

    I think you're deeply wrong in comparing a serious documentary with Brasseye however. Brasseye is satire - it's not supposed to deal "properly" with the issues. The point that Brasseye wanted to get across was effectively proven by the reaction of the press and those who sought to jump on the bandwagon (without having even seen the programme). Padeophilia is a real issue, let's not forget that. But let's also not forget how the press seek to sensationalise it for their own profits.

    Incidentally, I heard on the radio this morning that R Kelly has been arrested for some child related sex crime ?? .... :rolleyes:
     
  3. Samir

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    Hi PoochJD
    Gutted that I missed it, What time was it on?
    I work in the field of Substance Misuse and a very high number of clients present with issues of sexual/physical abuse. When client's disclose these type of issues it can be easier to understand why they intern went onto hardcore drug use because it seems like a better option than remembering.
    It's horrific how prevalent this is in today's society and I feel that it is societies job to protect these people, young and old alike.
    Also I'm glad that BBC felt the need to address this in a professional manor because recently the media have been doing more harm than good.

    Samir
     
  4. chris thomas

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    Here, f****n ,here pooch, well said m8, they should castrate the bastards, ;)
     
  5. Rambo John J

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    I thought THFBP was/is an excellent documentary/series and The Brass Eye Special was an excellent satire. Comparing the two though? It's like chalk and cheese - you won't find people comparing The Two Ronnies with Crimewatch, and rightly so. I don't see the point.
     
  6. Stuart Wright

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    Pooch - I can only think that you have completely missed the point of Brass Eye - which was to take the mickey out of the press over their coverage of the subject (I guess because it is so sensationalised itself).
    Brass Eye is a comedy - and a really good one.
    Comparing it with a genuine documentary on the subject is like comparing the original Boris Carlof Frankenstein with Young Frankenstein.
     
  7. PoochJD

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    Hi,

    The show went out on BBC2 between 9-10:30pm. As far as I know, there are no weekly repeats on any of the BBC's terrestrial or satellite stations, but keep your eyes peeled, just in case.

    As for those of you who think I didn't get "BrassEye", I did understand it fully.

    The problem was that a) you shouldn't be trivialising an issue like paedophilia, no matter what your intentions may be; b) Chris Morris is NOT funny or clever, even though he thinks he is the bee's knees to British Comedy, and c), the fact that it took some 5 scriptwriters to write one of the worst, most innane and totally unhumorous 25 minutes of so-called "comedy" is a testament to just how truly dire it was.

    I'm sorry, but the "BrassEye" show just didn't work - on any level! It wasn't funny enough to warrant being labelled "comedy". It wasn't "entertaining". The cast taking part looked embarrased all the way through! And, whilst the newspaper media may have got their undergarments-in-a-twist over it, I think it demonstrated that their are certain topics you DON'T try and trivialise, just to prove a point to Joe and Jane Public about how smart you think you are!

    Pooch
     
  8. Squirrel God

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    A personal view obviously Pooch.

    My personal view is that I found Brasseye hilarious and Chris Morris is indeed a very funny and talented comic genius.

    As for Brasseye trivialising paedeophilia... I think the tabloids got there first with that one!
     
  9. Rambo John J

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    Never confuse opinion with fact.

    In the (paraphrased) words of Nice Guy Eddie from Reservoir Dogs

    "Just because you think it, it doesn't necessarily make it so"

    It can make a person appear to be ever-so-slightly pompous, and self righteous.
     
  10. PoochJD

    PoochJD
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    Hi Again,

    Squirrel God, you said that Chris Morris was a "talented comic genius".

    Nope! Einstein, was a genius! Roger Bannister was a genius! Mozart was a genius! Chris Morris is certainly none of those! Even if you compare him to other comedians, he's still not a genius, in any sense of the word! Ben Elton was a genius. Harry Enfield was a genius. The Goons were geniuses. Monty Python was genus. As for Mr Morris, he doesn't even deserve to call himself a talented half-wit, let alone a comedy genius. But, hey, what do I know?! ;)

    Rambo, John J. You said: "Never confuse opinion with fact. It can make a person appear to be ever-so-slightly pompous, and self righteous."

    No offence, but was this directed at me personally, or just a general observation? I am presuming the latter.

    Pooch
     
  11. Squirrel God

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    Yes, they were geniuses too. But not comic geniuses.

    Chris Morris doesn't make you laugh. I have no problem with that. But he makes me and many others howl with laughter. The Day Today and Brasseye have proven to be the most hilarious satire I have ever seen. And you can rant and rave about that all you like Pooch - but we're not going to stop laughing at it mate. It's time you accepted that other people have different opinions to you. The world would be a very boring place if we all liked the same thing wouldn't it? :)

    No offence to you Pooch, but your replies so far really are coming across as pompous and intolerant. I think you need to use "in my opinion" a little more in any future replies. :)
     
  12. dUnKle

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    Missed the program due to work but have heard some very encouraging things and lots of praise from others who I know have seen it.

    I pride myself that I can laugh and joke about everything, its probably my defence mechanism, but I can not see how anyone could have laughed at something like the Brass Eye episode.

    Having watched the series and finding it brilliant I was more than slightly miffed to see the jokes regarding paedophiles.

    Pooch is correct, if ever there was a subject which should not me joked about it is this, I have ( through work ) met some of these people, and I can tell you that some of them would not have got the fact that it was the mickey take it was supposed to be.
     
  13. Squirrel God

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    Fair enough, except that Brasseye wasn't taking the mickey out of paedophilia. It was taking the mickey out of the way that paedophilia is sensationalised in the media. It was also an opportunity to show how stupid and gullible many of our celebrities can be.

    It's similar to The Life of Brian - that film didn't mock Jesus, it had a laugh about the circumstances going on at the time of Jesus. Lots of people confused the two, and I believe they do the same thing with Brasseye.
     
  14. dUnKle

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    I except that Squirrel and understand what you are saying - but my worry is like I said - some of these people would have maybe seen that episode and due to there warped mind have seen it as making what they do exceptable - that is VERY dangerous.

    The majority of those I have met honestly believe they have done nothing wrong and show little if no remourse for there actions.
     
  15. Stuart Wright

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    Well it seems that Pooch can't appreciate that some people like Chris Morris. I count myself amongst them.
    Lets agree to differ on that particular issue, shall we as it seems none of us are going to change the mind of the other.
     
  16. dUnKle

    dUnKle
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    So I guess ill just sit on the fence then - think that Chris and his programmes are normally very funny - but the episode in question was of bad taste
     
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    I won't bother to tell you what we do with Paedophiles in Turkey. What we don't do is put them in comfortable prisions with colour tv's and pool tables.

    Turkish
     
  18. philmate

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    As we know this crime gets everyones blood boiling (except those involved). I caught the end half hour and will watch the others with both anger and sadness. I think this programme should have be shown earlier and on every channel so to make people aware what is/can really happen to children so they cant hide from the fact, as alot of expose progs also should be, (my opinion). Brasseye, well I thought it did a good job in showing how the media can be so easily manipulated into a frenzy of shocking headlines that can easily stimulate public reaction, ie (a Sunday newspaper) to the thick people who went to trash the house of a PAEDIATRICIAN who works with children.... but did'nt think that their programme would offend a great number of people who understood their intentions, Brasseye that is. Is that why the media (paparazzi) always show a terrier of some sort baring its fangs even though most assaults are carried out by less publicized dogs because its more appropiate to shock and cause unrest to their readers in their eye. The big thing is that paedophiles do not think/know that what they do is WRONG, to them sex with a child is as natural to adults that have consented sex with each other. Thats why its so hard for prisons to re-educaten them if they had the time and money. I think they should all be burned slowly to death etc.

    Philmate.
     
  19. PoochJD

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    Evening Everyone,

    I had just spent awhile writing a lengthy reply, but bloody AOL crashed again - for the umpteenth time! As such, I'll try to keep this reply short. Sorry. ;)

    Okay, I apologise if I caused anyone undue offence with any of my previous posts. I am happy to accept that some of you like Chris Morris, and some of you loved the "BE" Special.

    Despite this, I still think that Chris Morris can not be legitimately called a comedy genius, under the real definition of that word.

    Lastly, in my opinion, the show may have been attempting to poke fun at the media and celebrities, but in fact, it only showed us that they are just as gullible as any one of us.

    Also, by allowing Mr Morris a chance to use the topic of paedophilia as "entertainment" - which is what "BrassEye" is all about - then we have to ask the question, of where will the buck stop? Abortions, incest, rape? Are they okay to be "satirised" as well?

    "BrassEye" did nothing new. It showed us celebrities are fallable. We knew that already. It showed us that the tabloid press and TV news elaborates on news stories, so it's difficult to tell where the facts end and the fiction starts. Again, we knew that. If you read "The Sun" or "Daily Mail", or even "The Mirror", then you will be of a certain mindset. You don't read these publications for news. You (normally) would buy them, because of their political standpoints; their opinions; and their beliefs. Oh, and all the endless BB3 gossip as well! :D

    Seriously though, at what point do we draw a line, and say: "Look, it's not right to use this topic, regardless of your intentions, for entertaining the public."? Where do we stop real-life being just another movie-of-the-week, to keep us entertained before we go to bed at night?

    In my opinion, paedophilia is a serious topic that was inappropriate for use as "comedy" and "entertainment". There were other ways Chris Morris could and (possibly) should have made his point.

    Pooch
     
  20. Squirrel God

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    There is no logic whatsoever in this statement Pooch.

    Only paedophiles would find paedophilia funny. Therefore, you are inadvertently calling me and everyone else that laughed at the Brasseye special a paedophile.

    Consequently, coming from anyone, but especially coming from a moderator, I am quite frankly disgusted by this statement from you.

    You seem quite unable to grasp the difference between paedophilia and the media reporting paedophilia.

    Well, I personally would never have talked to a camera about the dangers of paedophiles on the Internet who can have actual sex with children via their "new technology" keyboards. I'm not that stupid as to believe that that is possible.

    Have you even seen the Brasseye special? All the way through?

    The media entertain the public by reporting paedophilia in sensational ways. And that's wrong. That's the point Chris Morris was getting across in Brasseye. Sadly, you have missed it.
     
  21. Lex

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    Sorry Pooch, but that is an outrageous thing to say and I think you should withdraw it. You must know that it simply isn't true/accurate.
     
  22. dUnKle

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    I can see why people would find it funny - but I know why I didnt and think I know what pooch is saying - although can not see how anybody could ever find such a heinous crime as this funny

    After a night chatting about this - I still stand by my comment about it being dangerous to sow any seeds in the minds of these people that could lead them to believe that what they are doing is someway moral and allowed
     
  23. Stuart Wright

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    You know, I probably find that statement about as offensive as you found the n word statements a while back.
    I have 2 kids and I think paedophiles should be castrated or labotamised or just plain killed. Yet I can tell the difference between the sick practise of paedophilia itself and a program which ridicules the stupid media reporting of the subject (a la that Mirror rag which has predicatbly 'gone off one one' after the beeb program).
    I'm surprised that after complaining so strongly about people posting without considering the feelings of others that you should then write such an ill considered statement.
     
  24. Bert Coules

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    PoochJD wrote:

    Seriously though, at what point do we draw a line, and say: "Look, it's not right to use this topic, regardless of your intentions, for entertaining the public."?

    I'm not at all clear just who constitutes this "we" whom you appear to believe you are entitled to speak for, but my own feeling, undisguised as a universal opinion, is that there is no place where your line should be drawn with regard to using comedy as comment.

    You muddy the waters more than somewhat, though, with the phrase "entertaining the public". Comedy, satire, call it what you will, has a value and a use far beyond simple entertainment, as witness the huge spate of jokes which quickly started circulating following the death of Princess Diana, the Twin Towers incident and other similar happenings.

    Oh - and your comment

    ...if you did find the "BE" Special funny, then - in turn - you must find paedophilia funny

    betrays a complete lack of understanding.

    Bert
    http://www.bertcoules.co.uk
     
  25. PoochJD

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    Morning,

    I hereby offer an unreserved apology to EVERYONE I offended with my comments. I have edited my own post to remove that comment, as I can see it was unjustified. Please accept my apologies, both as a person writing in this thread, and more so, as a Moderator. :(

    I have seen the "BE" Special all the way through, and I still think it served no purpose, nor did it say anything meaningful.

    As for whether or not celebrities are more or less gullible than the rest of us, well, that's for each of us to decide for ourselves. Despite this, regardless of what the celebrities stated in the show itself - e.g. Dr Fox, Phil Collins, Phillipa Forrester, et al - yes, they probably should have known better, but then we can all say that in hindsight. Having not been a celebrity, I can't state how they got involved, who it was that asked them to say what they did, or how the "proof" was shown to them, before they videod their comments. As such, it isn't right for the rest of us, or fair, to say that we all would have known better. Lies can be very convincing, even to the best and most knowledgeable people.

    Bert - the "we" I was referring to, when I said:

    "Seriously though, at what point do we draw a line, and say: "Look, it's not right to use this topic, regardless of your intentions, for entertaining the public."?"

    was we, as in the entire British public.

    Squirrel God: You said that I: "seem quite unable to grasp the difference between paedophilia and the media reporting paedophilia."

    I do grasp it fully. I just don't think that what Chris Morris and "BE" did was clever, funny... Or original, for that matter. The media report what they want you to hear or read. They don't necessarily report facts. There's nothing new about that. Everyone knows it. Any "story" can be modified, bent, manipulated or adapted to make it sound like "facts", but be entirely fictional.

    Chris Morris's "BE Special" show stated that the media sensationalises the topic of paedophilia. Well, wowee! I never knew that before, Mr Morris! Aren't you a clever man for noting that comment?! :rolleyes:

    It took him, and four other people to write a show telling us something most intelligent people already knew, and it did it in a pointless, facile and and utterly awful way. Plus, it was dressed up as "entertainment" and "comedy". Only when everyone complained about it, did C4 and Chris Morris then try and defend their artistic work, by saying that it was NOT "comedy", but "social commentary" or "irony"! Well, that doesn't wash with me! What they (C4 and Chris Morris) did, was take a controversial subject, trivialise it, try to dress it up into something it wasn't, and then claim that they are somehow satirising the media. No! I don't think so!

    Anyway, I've said enough on this topic, and I should probably end here. I heartily recommend that everyone watches the remaining two parts of the BBC's documentary, which air on Tuesdays at 9-10:30pm.

    Apologies once again, for my previous comments. I accept, that I made a grievous error, and that I should not have written what I did.


    Pooch
     
  26. Guest

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    Paedophilia-an emotive label..but one that doesnt really tell the story.
    To me a paedophile is someone that interferes with children under 14.

    why do I say under 14?...and not under 16?

    Because there are many cultures-India for example-where girls are married at 12/13.
    The girls are trained ,taught recipes etc..from very young.

    My personal view is that when the male and female of a species are able to copulate-and understand what they are doing-and consent-there is no harm in it.

    People will say;-But they dont know their own mind at 14...

    No???..We all forget when we were at school then,getting hold of girls...

    When I was 14 I was going out with a girl of 13(going on 30)-we were sexually active-went out for 2 years-were we Paedophiles?...of course not...When we start to become sexually mature we are curious-there is no harm in this...in fact its only in the last 150 years that the age of consent went to 16.

    So-forget about the age of consent for a minute(like that stops anyone anyhow..)...The question is;-When does a girl become a woman?

    The real answer is ,different ages for different girls.
    In my school,most girls from the second year had indulged in some sexual activity-the trouble is now,most of us "grown ups" look at our 12 year old daughters and think butter wouldnt melt in their mouths....we forget what we were like...

    But absolutely under 12 -kids that are conned into doing things they dont really understand?...welol these people should be castrated.
    Doug:mad:
     
  27. Guest

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    Mr Quaid,
    Good afternoon. You will find that things are chaging rapidly in countrys like India and Sri Lanka where I live. Although child brides and grooms are "promised" to each other as a form of engagement from a very young age, couples do not get together until much later.
    I find some of your remarks quite disturbing. If I understand you correctly, age of consent in your opinion should be 14.
    Granted, most would think it normal for a boy of 15 to court a 14 year old girl.

    What happens when, a 40 year old man courts the same 14 year old girl. Is this acceptable to you?

    I think its highly indecent and thats puting it mildy.
     
  28. Bert Coules

    Bert Coules
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    PoochJD wrote:

    Bert - the "we" I was referring to... was we, as in the entire British public.

    My dear Pooch, as these forums so amply demonstrate, not even a tiny section of "the entire British public" can reach an agreement on such trivial matters as what bits to stick inside a computer and whether to paint a screen white or grey. What on earth makes you think that the entire population ever could be capable of making a unanimous decision about absolutely anything, let alone a subject of such ethical and moral complexity?

    Bert
    http://www.bertcoules.co.uk
     
  29. Ian J

    Ian J
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    editorial in The Daily Telegraph today :-

    A new BBC documentary, The Hunt for Britain’s Paedophiles, The first part of which went out on Thursday, showed some shocking scenes involving paedophiles. Almost as shocking was the way in which the BBC decided to present the programme. Under the thin guise of investigative journalism, the documentary was in fact designed to stimulate viewers, not in a sexual way, but with the same excitement at the grotesque that draws in audiences to sensationalist, supposedly serious programmes on serial killers, prostitutes and gangsters.

    The programme was ostensibly about the investigations of Operation Door Knock, an attempt by Scotland Yard’s Paedophile Squad to track down child pornographers. But not many people are going to watch a programme about policemen milling around an office block, staring at computer screens or rummaging through bin liners for incriminating videos – which took up the vast majority of the airtime. More viewers, though, will be gripped if, every now and again, the horrible photographs on those computer screens and the scenes on those videos are also gratuitously shown. It would have been quite enough to describe what crimes the paedophiles had committed without then cutting, every time they were mentioned, to pictures of six-year olds being raped.

    There is one film maker who should be proud of this sordid offering – Chris Morris, the man behind the Brass Eye programme that brilliantly satirised exactly this sort of television. If ever there was a case of life imitating art, this was it. There was the same leaden toned, self important commentary, the same grainy photos with faces and naked bodies blurred, the same attempt to build the programme up to a crescendo with increasingly outrageous revelations. There was a serious point behind Mr Morris’s programme – to highlight the crude tactics behind such programmes as The Hunt for Britain’s Paedophiles, where presenters are supposedly exposing some vice or other, in the full knowledge that the appeal of the programmes depends on the viewers’ salacious interest in that vice. It is easy to explain the thinking behind Brass eye; the making of The Hunt for Britain’s Paedophiles is a lot harder to justify.
     
  30. Squirrel God

    Squirrel God
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    Well, there you have it. I'm now not sorry I missed it and I definitely shall not be tuning in to the further episodes. I expected rather better from the BBC.

    Thank you very much for posting that Ian.
     
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