The Blu-Ray ripping guide for Media Streamers

Smurfin

Distinguished Member
*EDIT: SD-DVD Ripping Guide to be added shortly*

Hi all

Now that I seem to have my PCH working - almost - properly, I thought it worth while posting a bit of a "how to" guide for ripping Blu-Rays. This information is already out there, but can take some digging to find out the nitty gritty and all the pitfalls, as there seem to be many.

For the purposes of this guide, I'm focusing on how to rip your Blu-Ray collection with the intention of keeping the video and audio in their original formats, i.e. uncompressed.

Be warned that the average rip takes up anywhere between 17-30GB, depending on the length of the movie, assuming you take the 1080p video and one lossless audio track. Also, the timings I've detailed below are based on a Quad Core processor and lots of RAM, so those with slower machines will need to take into account longer remuxing times.

For obvious reasons there is NO mention in this guide of Blu-Ray encryption or how to bypass this. Please don't ask questions about it in this thread or reference it as you'll be ignored, and the mods will delete your post. Thanks! :)


What programs do I need to back-up my Blu-Ray collection?

You need:

* AnyDVD HD
* BDInfo
* Tsmuxer
* ts4np
* VLC player

A BD-ROM reader (obviously!)

Re: the programs, google is your friend basically! I found ts4np a bit more difficult to find, so if anyone needs help on this drop me a PM.

How do I rip my discs?

Instructions:

* Put the disc in with AnyDVD running in the background

* Open BDInfo and point it to the BluRay drive.

* Once BDInfo has scanned the disc, the whole structure of the disc will appear. In essence you'll see a "playlist" section and then in the box below the relevant streams which form part of the selected playlist.

* In the playlist section look for the biggest file - this is usually the movie. Some discs have SEVERAL playlists which are as long as the movie so there's an element of trial and error (e.g. Rambo has 4 big playlists, what it doesn't tell you initially is that the first playlist isn't just the movie, but includes streams from BDLive with annoying interviews which break up the movie). If there's more than one playlist, go to The Internet Movie Database (IMDb) and check the length of the movie, the correct playlist should correspond to the movie running time. In addition, download something like VLC player (a free media player that plays the formats you'll be working with) to check you have the right streams.

* Once you've identified the right playlist, then click on it e.g. 0001.mpls, and look in the "stream" section. You'll see one or more .m2ts files. The easiest movie to deal with is one where the movie is contained within a single .m2ts file. The most difficult is when there are multiple .m2ts files, but we'll come to that!

Now it gets a bit more complicated. Is the disc TrueHD or DTS-MA? (or even both?). If it's a DTS-MA disc, open Tsmuxer and do the following:

DTS-MA Discs (Tsmuxer)

* Now that you've identified which playlist you want to rip, navigate to the relevant playlist file on the disc .e.g 0001.mpls.

* A list of all the elements in the playlist will appear with check boxes. Go down the list and check the boxes to remove everything but the 1080p video file and the lossless audio file.

* Then select the path you want to rip to, and select .ts as the file format (you can rip to .m2ts as well, but it takes up a little more space, and there's no difference in quality).

* Then press "Remux" and hey presto, 20 mins later it's done.

Dolby True-HD (Tsmuxer AND ts4np OR ts4np - see below for what and why)

If the disc you are ripping has a Dolby TrueHD sountrack, it gets a little more involved. TsMuxer screws up True-HD soundtracks, and ts4np screws up DTS-MA soundtracks, so you need to ensure you're using the right program. The complication comes in because ts4np doesn't allow you to rip a playlist, ONLY an individual stream. So this is what you do:

Dolby True-HD soundtrack and a SINGLE .m2ts stream

From BDInfo you'll be able to see if a movie is contained in a single .m2ts file. Most of them are, but not all. Don't be fooled by the opening screens either (i.e. the Pixar or Disney intro) - these will show as separate .m2ts files, but they'll be 7 seconds or whatever. The important thing is whether the main movie is in one stream.

If it is, do the following:

* Open ts4np and navigate to the right stream. If you try to navigate to the playlist it'll return an error, as it can only read one stream rather than a container full of streams.

* Then use the check box to select the elements you want to keep - i.e. 1080p video and lossless audio.

* Select the destination path, put in the file name (when you name it, always suffix it with .ts, for some reason ts4np doesn't do this automatically).

* Press Remux and you're done.

Dolby True-HD sountrack and MULTIPLE .m2ts streams

As you can only remux one stream at a time in ts4np, it's useless for movies which have multiple streams, and you can't use Tsmuxer as it screws the audio. The solution is simple, but takes a little longer:

* Open Tsmuxer and follow the instructions above for DTS-MA discs.

* Once completed, close this and open ts4np.

* Navigate to the newly remuxed .ts file, then simply mux it again in ts4np.

* The True-HD soundtrack should now work fine.

Uncompressed LPCM - (Tsmuxer)

There is a reported bug with Uncompressed Multi-Channel PCM soundtracks which means (I think) that both Tsmuxer and ts4np screw up LPCM audio. In general this will only affect older discs as they mostly come with TrueHD or DTS-MA now, but certainly many early Blu-Rays come with Uncompressed PCM.

The route around this is simple. When selecting elements of streams/playlists that you want to keep, when selecting the LPCM soundtrack, you must ALSO select an AC-3 sountrack. Don't ask me why, but apparently this is the only way to get LPCM to work.

-----------------------

I hope this helps people who are just getting to media streaming, and if anyone knows any different (or if anything above is inaccurate) please let me know.

If there is enough interest, I'll happily post guides for SD DVDs and compressing blu-rays if people want it too :)

Cheers
Matt
 
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zAndy1

Distinguished Member
If your media player won't stream HD audio presumably you just choose AC3 or the core DTS track instead of TrueHD or DTS-MA in tsmuxer?
 

Smurfin

Distinguished Member
If your media player won't stream HD audio presumably you just choose AC3 or the core DTS track instead of TrueHD or DTS-MA in tsmuxer?

That's right :)

Usually the correct AC-3 soundtrack will show a bitrate of 640kbps (there's often lots @ 192kbps which should be avoided for obvious reaons!)
 

Rob.Screene

Active Member
Hi Matt,

Is is minimal handling of the authored disk you are going for, or a single container file like mkv?

I guess mkv is currently more apropriate for HTPC playback. I'm not sure how many media streamers support mkv at his time. The PS3 certainly needs it re-muxed in to a .m2ts or .ts file using tsMuxeR or mkv2vob, and won't play DS audio when streaming yet.

eac3to handles BD and HD DVD formats an can demux titles and optionally remux to a .mkv container. I believe it can keep the original soundtracks as well as decode to flac lossless, which I understand is usefull to those playing with 7.1 analog soundcards. It might simplify and speed things for the dolby releases.

Hmm, actually reading the help text, perhaps it too only handles TrueHD, but only the core from DTS HD??

Here's the top of the command-line utlity's help:
eac3to v2.60, freeware by madshi.net

- can show information about audio, video and VOB/EVO/(M2)TS files
- can decode and encode various audio formats
- can remove dialog normalization from AC3, E-AC3, DTS and TrueHD tracks
- can extract AC3 stream from Blu-Ray TrueHD/AC3 tracks
- can extract TrueHD stream from Blu-Ray TrueHD/AC3 tracks
- can extract DTS core from DTS-HD tracks
- can remove DTS zero padding and repair outdated DTS-ES headers
- can apply positive or negative audio delays
- can reduce bitdepth of decoded audio data by using TPDF dithering
- can resample decoded audio data (using "r8brain")
- can apply/reverse PAL speedup on decoded audio data (using "r8brain")
- can demux all video and audio tracks of an EVO/VOB/(M2)TS source file
- can list available titles of Blu-Ray and HD DVD discs
- can extract Blu-Ray and HD DVD chapter information and subtitles
- can mux MPEG2, VC-1 and h264 video tracks to Matroska
- can remove pulldown flags from MPEG2, VC-1 and h264 video tracks

eac3to sourcefile[+sourcefile2] [trackno:] [destfile|stdout] [-options]

Examples:
eac3to source.pcm destination.flac
eac3to source.thd destination.flac destination.ac3
eac3to source.evo 1: chapters.txt 2: video.mkv 3: audio.flac 5: subtitle.sup
eac3to feature_1.evo+feature_2.evo movie.mkv
eac3to blurayMovieFolder movie.mkv


regards,
Rob.
 
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Smurfin

Distinguished Member
Hi Matt,

I tink eac3to now handes tream demux/remux to a .mkv container. I believe it can keep th original sondtracks as well as decode to flac lossless, which I understand is usefull to those playing with 7.1 analog soundcards.

Hmm, actually reading the help text, pehaps it currently handles TrueHD, but not onlt core from DTS HD??

It might simplify and speed things for the dolby releases.

Here's the top of the command-line utlity's help:
eac3to v2.60, freeware by madshi.net

- can show information about audio, video and VOB/EVO/(M2)TS files
- can decode and encode various audio formats
- can remove dialog normalization from AC3, E-AC3, DTS and TrueHD tracks
- can extract AC3 stream from Blu-Ray TrueHD/AC3 tracks
- can extract TrueHD stream from Blu-Ray TrueHD/AC3 tracks
- can extract DTS core from DTS-HD tracks
- can remove DTS zero padding and repair outdated DTS-ES headers
- can apply positive or negative audio delays
- can reduce bitdepth of decoded audio data by using TPDF dithering
- can resample decoded audio data (using "r8brain")
- can apply/reverse PAL speedup on decoded audio data (using "r8brain")
- can demux all video and audio tracks of an EVO/VOB/(M2)TS source file
- can list available titles of Blu-Ray and HD DVD discs
- can extract Blu-Ray and HD DVD chapter information and subtitles
- can mux MPEG2, VC-1 and h264 video tracks to Matroska
- can remove pulldown flags from MPEG2, VC-1 and h264 video tracks

eac3to sourcefile[+sourcefile2] [trackno:] [destfile|stdout] [-options]

Examples:
eac3to source.pcm destination.flac
eac3to source.thd destination.flac destination.ac3
eac3to source.evo 1: chapters.txt 2: video.mkv 3: audio.flac 5: subtitle.sup
eac3to feature_1.evo+feature_2.evo movie.mkv
eac3to blurayMovieFolder movie.mkv


regards,
Rob.

Thanks Rob. Must admit I've not used eac3to at all, so can't really post a guide. Will have a play around with it over the weekend though :) Must admit, I'm not entirely clear of the purpose of the program...
 

Rob

Active Member
Great guide Matt. I've generally used ToNMT which incorporates eac3to and it works well 90% of the time for me. I have a couple of discs that didn't for some reason so I used Tsmuxer. I don't have an amp that decodes the HD soundtracks so where necessary it converts to AC3/ DTS. Always play fine on my A100. The BDinfo program looks usefull. I've not seen that before so will definately check that out.
 

Smurfin

Distinguished Member
Great guide Matt. I've generally used ToNMT which incorporates eac3to and it works well 90% of the time for me.

Can you explain exactly what this does? Does it help with multi-stream discs as this seems like the only remaining issue for me (and several other people).

The BDinfo program looks usefull. I've not seen that before so will definately check that out.

It's excellent, and takes much of the guesswork out of it :)
 

Messiah

Well-known Member
Unfortunately TS4NP does not work for me. Keep getting this message.



This is on a Quad core Q6600 with 4GB RAM and loads of HDD space. Very odd.
 
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Smurfin

Distinguished Member
Unfortunately TS4NP does not work for me. Keep getting this message.



This is on a Quad core Q6600 with 4GB RAM and loads of HDD space. Very odd.

At what point in the process do you get this error? Sounds like we've got almost exactly the same PC (Quad Core Q6600 with 8GB RAM). I remember I had an issue when I first used ts4np, can't quite remember how I got round it though....
 

Messiah

Well-known Member
At what point in the process do you get this error? Sounds like we've got almost exactly the same PC (Quad Core Q6600 with 8GB RAM). I remember I had an issue when I first used ts4np, can't quite remember how I got round it though....

Within first 5 minutes of film time. Generally about 30 seconds into the the ripping actual time. Trying it with tsmuxer as I type.

Like you would really love to get my HD stuff streaming correctly. Mind you, reckon this is only half my problem as spent all weekend trying to get 2 PCs (Dell Studio Hybrid and HP Slimline) to display correctly on my Pio 506XDE (so I could use XBMC) and gave up in utter frustration.
 

Messiah

Well-known Member
Completed ripping the Cars movie using tsmuxer and only able to keep the AC3 track as do not have a HD capable amp. Anyways, result is that apart from complete sound drop out during the opening Disney castle sequence it is perfect. Fast forward to the beginning of the movie and it is perfect (only watched first 10 minutes but probably the most difficlut of the whole movie) and it is perfect.

Gonna try with Independence Day now as well and see if that works. If so I'm a happy bunny until I upgrade my amp (would love to do it now but unsure how much better an Onkyo HD capable amp will be compared to my Yamaha 2700 - that's for a different thread though :D).

Typical isn't it. I bought myself a HD-XE1 for HDDVDs, then a BDP-S550 for BDs, both cos my amp is not capable of decoding HD audio now I get a streamer and have to think of an amp upgrade after all anyway :rolleyes:

Thanks Smurfin for all your advice and guide. I'll let you know how I get on with ID4.
 

Smurfin

Distinguished Member
Completed ripping the Cars movie using tsmuxer and only able to keep the AC3 track as do not have a HD capable amp. Anyways, result is that apart from complete sound drop out during the opening Disney castle sequence it is perfect. Fast forward to the beginning of the movie and it is perfect (only watched first 10 minutes but probably the most difficlut of the whole movie) and it is perfect.

Gonna try with Independence Day now as well and see if that works. If so I'm a happy bunny until I upgrade my amp (would love to do it now but unsure how much better an Onkyo HD capable amp will be compared to my Yamaha 2700 - that's for a different thread though :D).

Typical isn't it. I bought myself a HD-XE1 for HDDVDs, then a BDP-S550 for BDs, both cos my amp is not capable of decoding HD audio now I get a streamer and have to think of an amp upgrade after all anyway :rolleyes:

Thanks Smurfin for all your advice and guide. I'll let you know how I get on with ID4.

Glad it's working :thumbsup:

One thing I'd advise though - unless you have restrictions on storage, I'd rip everything with the lossless audio as when you do upgrade your amp you'll regret having spent all that time ripping discs without! :)

FYI - I went from the Yamaha 2700 to the Onkyo 875. The Onkyo is more flexible, obviously outputs bitstream HD audio and finally you have on-screen GUI via HDMI (that really wound me up with the Yammy!). Sound-wise, I like both. The 875 is a little more in your face, but not overly so, but if you like music you'll need to look elsewhere. Lots of amps out there so plenty to choose from :) If you like the 2700, maybe look at the 3800 or 3900?

Back to ripping, I just want to crack how to rip and playback multi-stream .m2ts files....final piece of the puzzle for me I think!
 

Messiah

Well-known Member
Thanks Matt.

I have no restrictions on storage space but felt the file size of the rip with lossles audio may have been a contributory factor to the TViX not playing the film correctly.

Good point though and will try again keeping the lossless audio in as well. Will keep you posted.
 

Rob

Active Member
Can you explain exactly what this does? Does it help with multi-stream discs as this seems like the only remaining issue for me (and several other people).

ToNMT UI - for converting HD DVD and BluRay

I've used this on most of my HD-DVDs & BDs. I'm not sure about multi-stream discs as I'm not sure I have any. I've just picked up Wall-E but not opened it yet. Is that multi-stream? happy to give it a try.

EDIT. latest version available here,

ToNMT_5.0.4.zip
 
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C

chrishallowell

Guest
If you are going to read directly from the BluRay drive and you are using Windows XP, then you need to install the UDF 2.5 driver.
 

Messiah

Well-known Member
Well, I've now ripped about 10 of my BDs since this morning, following Smurfin's excellent guide :smashin:, and while none of them are perfect they are playing way better than any of my previous rips. Still some stuttering and sound drop out but not like before.

So, next thing I reckon I will try is to use NFS instead of SMB from my WHS in the garage. Anyone any idea which is the best to use (Allegro?) and also where I can find the required files to install it on my WHS (guess I need an msi installer file)

Thanks
 
Has anyone taken just The Movie File and the Lossless audio track and wrote them back to a blank 25gb BD-R? I am just wondering if this works without problems?
 

Smurfin

Distinguished Member
Well, I've now ripped about 10 of my BDs since this morning, following Smurfin's excellent guide :smashin:, and while none of them are perfect they are playing way better than any of my previous rips. Still some stuttering and sound drop out but not like before.

So, next thing I reckon I will try is to use NFS instead of SMB from my WHS in the garage. Anyone any idea which is the best to use (Allegro?) and also where I can find the required files to install it on my WHS (guess I need an msi installer file)

Thanks

I'm wondering why you're still getting problems, but to be honest I'm not sure of the hardware inside the TVIX and how it differs from the PCH. Do you have the option with TVIX to stream via HTTP?
 
L

Luggage

Guest
I apologise for asking what will no doubt be a very basic question, but I am completely confused about blu-ray in terms of video/audio codec.

Specifcally in relation to your brilliant explanation at the top of this thread, why do you need to attend to the audio and convert it? Is this something that is required for all non blu-ray drive playback, or something specific to the PCH device?

Please feel free to point me towards an idiot thread, I won't take any offence.
 

Smurfin

Distinguished Member
I apologise for asking what will no doubt be a very basic question, but I am completely confused about blu-ray in terms of video/audio codec.

Specifcally in relation to your brilliant explanation at the top of this thread, why do you need to attend to the audio and convert it? Is this something that is required for all non blu-ray drive playback, or something specific to the PCH device?

Please feel free to point me towards an idiot thread, I won't take any offence.

No problem Luggage, it does get a bit confusing! In general, because Blu-Rays take up so much space in their native form - generally between 40-50GB - it's not practical to rip any quantity of BluRay discs to any kind of storage, you'll just run out of space too quickly. Tsmuxer/ts4np come into play as these are the tools needed to strip out the unecessary audio and video streams. The only problem is that neither of these problems are perfect, and for some unknown reason, tsmuxer screws up one type of soundtrack whilst ts4np screws up the other!

In essence you're not converting it from or to anything; but if you run a Dolby TrueHD disc through Tsmuxer, you need to then run it through ts4np in order to correct what tsmuxer did. Does that make sense?
 
L

Luggage

Guest
No problem Luggage, it does get a bit confusing! In general, because Blu-Rays take up so much space in their native form - generally between 40-50GB - it's not practical to rip any quantity of BluRay discs to any kind of storage, you'll just run out of space too quickly. Tsmuxer/ts4np come into play as these are the tools needed to strip out the unecessary audio and video streams. The only problem is that neither of these problems are perfect, and for some unknown reason, tsmuxer screws up one type of soundtrack whilst ts4np screws up the other!

In essence you're not converting it from or to anything; but if you run a Dolby TrueHD disc through Tsmuxer, you need to then run it through ts4np in order to correct what tsmuxer did. Does that make sense?

Thanks for the answer.

ok....let's see whether the braincell is working. You are choosing which compression video/audio program to use, depending on which sound source the disk has? I had missed that the program was doing both rather than just the audio.

If the above is correct, what sort of compression ratio of are you using, and how apparent is the compression effect?

Oh, and can I sneak in a cheeky last question? I have been reading the wikipedia entry about Blu Ray trying to understand the codecs so I can fathom which streamers can support it natively, but what you are doing here is leaving it at the same codec and just compressing?

Again sorry if this is completely basic
 
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Messiah

Well-known Member
tsmuxer and ts4np are not doing any compressing. They are just extracting the selected video and audio tracks as they are and simply muxing them back together to give you a combined audio and video stream. This audio and video stream is in its original uncompressed format. The purpose of these programs is to simply remove the unwanted tracks (stereo 2.0, foreign language, subtitle streams etc) thereby saving sapce.
 

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