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The Abyss R1

Discussion in 'Movie Forum' started by p9ul, Jul 29, 2004.

  1. p9ul

    p9ul
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    Got the Special Edition of The Abyss on R1 and the transfer is a little dissapointing, is there a better quality version that still contains the scene with rat and the oxygenated liquid or whatever it is?
     
  2. CrispyXUK

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    unfortuanatly no :(
     
  3. LV426

    LV426
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    The non-UK R2 and R4 editions are the same edition as R1 US (ie uncut) and are PAL transfers rather than NTSC. All currently available versions are letterboxed into 4x3 transfers (i.e. not "anamorphic").

    Theoretically a PAL transfer will offer greater resolution in the vertical direction (horizontal lines) than NTSC. However, based on my own experience of the R4 PAL transfer, it was the second-worst DVD (for PQ) that I have ever seen. I now have the R1 item
     
  4. p9ul

    p9ul
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    I'm actually thinking that I'd rather have the better picture of the R2 version without the rat scene and put the R1 disc up on ebay.

    the lesser of 2 evils...
     
  5. LV426

    LV426
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    Honestly, I doubt you will see much benefit from the change.
     
  6. p9ul

    p9ul
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    so the R2 version isn't much better?
     
  7. LicensedTaximan

    LicensedTaximan
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    A bit of trivia, channel 4 some years ago transmitted in widescreen the version with the rat sequence in it. Apparently this was a mistake and any subsequent showings have been minus the said scene. :(
     
  8. LV426

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    Over at www.dvdcompare.net they evaluate different regional variants of discs based on their features, soundtracks, presence (or otherwise) of anamorphic transfer, but notably NOT on the video standard (PAL or NTSC) - unless there is something extremely wrong with one edition or another. Their summary comparison is:

    OVERALL: Draw
    Between the 2-disc R1 America, R2 Scandinavia and R4 Australia releases for uncut status, extras and English 5.1 sound.

    CUTS:
    R1 (America): No cuts, Includes both Theatrical and SE cuts.
    R1 (America): No cuts, Includes both Theatrical and SE cuts.
    R2 (France): No cuts, Includes both Theatrical and SE cuts.
    R2 (France): No cuts, Includes both Theatrical and SE cuts.
    R2 (Germany): No cuts, Includes both Theatrical and SE cuts.
    R2 (Holland): No cuts, Includes both Theatrical and SE cuts.
    R2 (Italy): No cuts, Includes both Theatrical and SE cuts.
    R2 (Scandinavia) - Scandinavia: No cuts, theatrical version and special edition.
    R2 (Spain): No cuts, Includes both Theatrical and SE cuts.
    R2 (United Kingdom): Includes both Theatrical and SE cuts: 0m 45s - at the request of the British Veterinary Association. The scene where the rat is put into liquid oxygen was reframed and trimmed, as it appears to show an animal in distress.
    R4 (Australia): No cuts, Includes both Theatrical and SE cuts.
     
  9. p9ul

    p9ul
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    I remember seeing the channel 4 showing with the scene in - it was the first time I watched the film.
     
  10. figrin_dan

    figrin_dan
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    More useless trivia:

    The vhs SE was reframed at this scene and switches from 2.35:1 to 1.85:1 for a few moments.
     
  11. BadAss

    BadAss
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    More useless trivia for ya.

    When watching the orignal 1.85:1 VHS release you could see props used to make the FX with!

    When Ed and Micheal are fighting in the moon pool with the lights swinging between them, anyone notice the hand at the side grab one of the lights?
     
  12. dynamic turtle

    dynamic turtle
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    So you're telling me that no genuine widescreen edition of The Abyss exists, and that I'll have to put up with "zooming-in" on my crappy 4:3 R2 SE version forever?

    :suicide: :suicide: :suicide:
     
  13. LV426

    LV426
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    There are widescreen transfers. They just aren't <anamorphic, or 16x9 or enhanced for widescreen TVs or whatever>. All the widescreen versions out there are all non-anamorphic. And yes, on a widescreen TV you "zoom" (depending on what your TV manufacturer calls it) to hide part of the plain black content above and below the image. (Is that what you meant?)

    As to "forever"..... who knows. I haven't seen any concrete plans for a re-master.
     
  14. dynamic turtle

    dynamic turtle
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    thanks Nigel, but the "zooming" process reduces the PQ to VHS levels :(

    Guess we'll have to wait for the "Mega-Special-Edition" to come out!
     
  15. LV426

    LV426
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    If that's really your experience, then there's something either very wrong with your DVD setup, or something incredibly right about your VHS!
     
  16. dynamic turtle

    dynamic turtle
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    Yep, my VCR is a Mitsubishi M1000 :cool:

    S-VHS still looks absolutely stunning on that baby, even though its 12 years old!

    Needs a service actually. Can anyone point me in the direction of a good engineer in central london?

    DT
     
  17. LV426

    LV426
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    But presumably a widescreen (letterboxed) transfer of The Abyss on tape will be in regular VHS (Unless at some point it was broadcast widescreen by someone) , with a horizontal resolution somewhere around 240 (as opposed to DVD, somewhere around 700).
     
  18. dynamic turtle

    dynamic turtle
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    I didn't know dvd had an H-rez of 700?!

    I thought (well, at least on a standard CRT) the max rez was 525 lines - i.e. PAL.

    Are you talking about plasma/HD displays?

    DT
     
  19. LV426

    LV426
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    For the capabilities of THE SIGNAL:

    Resolution is measured in 2 directions.

    A TV signal is always an array of horizontal scanlines.

    Vertical resolution is the number of discrete points in a vertical column that can be resolved and that's always determined by the number of scanlines in the TV signal; it's 576 for PAL and 480 for NTSC, regardless of the source. Including VHS. In other words, the 576 (or 480) scanlines could be alternately (say) black and white, and the system would show them clearly as alternate black and white. So you'd have a column of 576 (or 480) alternate black and white areas.

    Horizontal resolution is the number of discrete points in a single horizontal line that can be resolved. In other words, how many times, across its width, can a scanline change colour or intensity. And this is hugely affected by the source. DVD can theoretically resolve somewhere around 700 changes along a line; Laserdisc about 500, SVHS about 400. VHS can only resolve about 240.

    For the capabilities of THE DISPLAY

    - can never be greater than the source, except by interpolation, which can give a subjective increase in resolution, but not an actual one

    - can be less than the source. For example, many Plasmas and some 22 inch LCDs have a 848x480 pixel count. The 480 is the vertical measure, or the number of horizontal rows. Fitting a 576-line signal into such a screen will by necessity degrade it to 480.
     
  20. Quickbeam

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    Further to nigel's comments, PAL has 625 lines total, but only 576 are used for the display. For NTSC it's 525, but only 480 lines are used in a digital environment (I believe analogue NTSC has a couple of lines extra).

    Also important is the colour resolution. While PAL has a stated resolution of 720 x 576, this only refers to luminance resolution (greyscale). The colour resolution is much less: 360 x 288, so the colour from one pixel is used to determine the colour of the four surrounding luminance pixels. NTSC DVDs have colour resolution of 360 x 240.

    While PAL VHS cassettes have a luminance resolution of around 240 x 576, the colour resolution is only about 100 pixels at best, possibly even less. SVHS increases the luminance resolution to 400 horizontal pixels, but the colour resolution is the same as VHS.
     
  21. buckaroo

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    It's okay to see a guy get crushed to death though. :rolleyes:
    Animal rights...Animal lefts.
     

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