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TAG DAB modules.

Discussion in 'TAG McLaren Audio Owners' Forum' started by rolski, Feb 24, 2005.

  1. rolski

    rolski
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    Some of you may be aware from following some other threads that I've recently received a T32R, but that the DAB module hasn't yet been fitted, and is taking some time to be delivered due to "unavailability".
    Dr. Zucker kindly explained that this is probably regarding to lack of stock of the "interface-board", rather than the Bosch DAB board itself.

    Now my dealer has come back with another suggestion - they've a DAB module that can be fitted into my AV32R-DP now (which apparenty requires some soldering), or I can continue to wait for the necessary additional bits 'n pieces that would enable the DAB to be fitted to the T32R.

    Would it be better to wait & have the T32R "completed" with the DAB module - and therefore to keep all radio functions within one unit, or is the AV32R-DP implementation equally as good ?

    Are there potential implementation issues - e.g. thermal - by adding another board to the AV32R ? I know that the AV32R-DP's have obviously been designed taking this into account, but is this perhaps a reason to keep this additional heat source separate, given the opportunity ?

    Do you gain anything in the AV32R - i.e. other system integration benefits - that you would not have if the DAB was installed in the T32R ?

    What do you think of the possible later effect on resale value (not that I can see myself ever wanting to part with my TAG !) might be depending on which unit the DAB's fitted into ?

    I'm leaning towards waiting at the moment & having all radio functions in one unit, but any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
     
  2. Thunder

    Thunder
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    Im probably being over caucious here but I would rather keep it separate, my reasons are as follows;
    1.) Yes it will probably make the unit run hotter
    2.) It will put more strain on the power supply, and I'd rather have the extra power reserves available for the decoding/processing etc
    3.) If there were any future board additions made available to the AV32R design by IAG then I just have a feeling that its easier to fit them into an AV32 without DAB than one with :)

    This is all of course total conjecture and maybe totally wrong :D
     
  3. rolski

    rolski
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    Thunder,
    Thanks for your reply.

    1) My thoughts as well, although almost certainly not a problem due to design.
    2) Good point - also probably not critical - but potentially slightly safer long term nevertheless.
    3) I'm also hopeful of this although it seems unlikely, but better to have the free space etc than not !
     
  4. Dr Udo Zucker

    Dr Udo Zucker
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    Hi all, whether you select DAB as part of an existing T32R or as part of the AV32R comes mainly down to cost and convenienence.

    The T32R's DAB solution is more expensive as it needs to add an interface board, carrying beside other items the necessary DAC. If you regularly switch between FM and DAB it is in my opinion far more convenient to put the DAB module in the T32R. You can then also make better use of the additional display (->scrolling text, station name) and the T32R's station keys 0- 9 allow far more obvious channel changing. Please don't forget to connect the TAGtronic link as this will also allow station changing with the AV32R's remote control.

    For best audio connect the T32R's analog output to the AV32R and ignore the T32R's digital output. This way, you can keep one analog input for the whole radio (DAB and FM)and you increase a little the sound quality, even of the DAB channels. This has to do with the usual problems of digital cables (adding always jitter) and the fact that the T32R's analog output stage is perfectly tuned for the radio (be it FM or DAB).

    For completeness, some reported slightly better DAB results when the DAB module is inside the AV32R, as now less processing stages are involved. Personally, I consider this of little relevance (if it is indeed correct) as the majority of DAB stations sound "lousy" to my ears.

    Issues of additional heat dissipation, power supply reserves or space for a future extension are solely academical :). I also doubt that there will ever an extension:rolleyes:
    P.S.: There has been discussions lately comparing DAB with those radio channels available through DVB. I use 5 different satellite receivers and I can report that the sound quality heavily depends on the chosen receiver. This is down to their internalk processing and the fact that they are all made for mass market pricing. The result is, that they unfortunately are all sounding rather poor, with their SPDIF output often worse than their analog offering. These receivers are just not made with the audiophile in mind.

    Therefore in the UK, where the choice of DAB stations is exceptional, DAB (with a solution like the T32R or the AV32R's DAB module) seems clearly the winner. In most other countries, DAB hasn't really taken of (Portugal e.g. has 5 stations!) DVB is the only solution (if you don'w want to be limited to those highly compressed FM stations). Unfortunately, I doubt that DAB will ever make it outside the UK as the tendency seems clearly (for the mass market) to have everything in one box (=tv + radio).
     
  5. rolski

    rolski
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    Dr. Zucker,
    Thanks again for your informed reply.

    I think on balance, for both rational & irrational reasons, I've decided to wait for the DAB to be installed into my T32R rather than in the AV32R-DP.

    And I'll also cancel the digital interconnect that I'd requested....!
     
  6. laalves

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    Well, today, and directly from TAG/IAG, I received my DAB module for my T32R. Installation was flawless, no problems at all. And it is a proper T32R module, indeed.

    One littly bitty problem: no internal antenna connector, as well as no back panel BNC connector, came with the unit...... T32R recognises the module, no problems, whatsoever but logically replies: "no dab stations" after the scan......... What a frustration, looking at an ugly hole in the back panel..... Was hoping to hear a bit of DAB this evening.

    Already sent an email to Phil@helpdesk, let's see what's their response time.....

    Luis
     
  7. GrahamMG

    GrahamMG
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    Yep, nicely summed up as usual Udo, I'm still determined to try and do something about it though.....

    Oh and for IAG to send out a DAB module without the BNC aerial connection lead shows a certain lack of care surely......
     
  8. Kenny Glasgow

    Kenny Glasgow
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    How easy is it for a dealer to swap the DAB module out of an AV32Rbp192 to an AV32R DP? How much is it likely to cost?
     
  9. rolski

    rolski
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    Hmm, am not amused by IAG's service - I've still not seen or heard anything of my DAB module.
    Roughly a month has passed since the T32R itself arrived....
     
  10. laalves

    laalves
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    Rolski, don't be jealous of me for having already got the DAB module, having ordered it after you did, and getting it just over a week after the order...... The fact is that although I did already receive the missing aerial lead, the T32R still doesn't get any DAB station!

    Still, discussing this with a chap from one of the broadcasting companies (sort of a GrahamMG, I figure) he offered to send someone over my place and take a few measurements; it appears that the transmitter that's supposed to cover this area was burned in a forest fire, so I will try an external antenna I've ordered to try it out properly, pointed towards the second closer transmitter.

    Luis
     
  11. laalves

    laalves
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    Upon inspection of my DAB module DAC section, I found that the DAC chips are AK4395 which are supposed to be 192 kHz. However, the spec sheet says 96 kHz.

    Anybody care to explain???????

    Luis
     
  12. GrahamMG

    GrahamMG
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    They were used in later units as it saved having two sets of chips on the shelf seeing as the AV's were using themm(the 192kHz ones). I suppose the 96kHz chips were also end of life...... To be frank I don't think this improved performance of the module much but..........
     
  13. Kenny Glasgow

    Kenny Glasgow
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    Anyone any ideas re switching DAB module from SP to DP :lease:
     
  14. GrahamMG

    GrahamMG
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    I have the feeling that is quite straightforward as the necessary connections are all in place for this assuming it was a new DP not an upgrade? As always, if the item is still under warrenty I would advise that IAG service undertake this work as giving them a bucket of bits to put right isn't high on their list of things to do for free...... As with any upgrade, if IAG are happy for "in the field" updates to be carried out they will provide the necessary parts and instructions to do so. If they won't you will not be able to do it really......
     
  15. Kenny Glasgow

    Kenny Glasgow
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    Thanks Graham :thumbsup: It's a new DP and the IAG helpdesk said that the dealer "should" be able to do it. It was the use of "should" that gave me slight concern..... :D
     
  16. GrahamMG

    GrahamMG
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    I can see them reaching for the adjustable spanner now....... Dealers do what they do well, they are not always engineers though..... Warrenty issues are the main reason for letting them do it I suppose......(oh and saved time hopefully)..... If the dealer has a service department that should ease your fears..... I have seen one or two dealers actually taking apart kit on the shop counter....not ideal..... I would sincerely hope that IAG have vetted dealers are able to carry out the work and suitably trained them to do it, mind you walls filled with "quik fit fitter" certificates don't impress many.....
     
  17. Plump

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    I saw one german dealer doing DAB transfer from SPbp192 to DP unit in just a few minutes.

    For more details you should ask Steve or other profs. My advice would be to open your both units and check if connections fit. DAB module is recognized automatically on boot, no shortkey needed.
     
  18. GrahamMG

    GrahamMG
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    A month in the UK then....... :devil:
     
  19. Plump

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    Yes, if you let IAG do it for you :D :rotfl:

    No kidding now, I used to live in UK and Germany both, and I must say (apart from building much better cars) german accuracy is nothing but a mythos. I have completely different experiences and IMHO UK business models are much more advanced and efficient. Just my opinion of course before people start to bark......
     
  20. GrahamMG

    GrahamMG
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    Ah yes and of course the German economy is doing so well presently :rotfl:
     
  21. laalves

    laalves
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    Interesting. It means I have a late series module, then. Even if it was made in 2000 and so far not a single dab station the damn thing hasw managed to pick up.... but that's another story.... still waiting for the external antenna.

    On the other hand, if it actually samples the signals at 192 kHz instead of 96kHz, theoretically, it should differ the same way the 96 kHz AV32R does from the 192 kHz........

    Luis
     
  22. GrahamMG

    GrahamMG
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    It might make a small difference to the analogue output......
     
  23. memmerson

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    Does anyone know if any soldering or special tools are required for a dab module swap?
     
  24. GrahamMG

    GrahamMG
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    From what to what unit?
     
  25. memmerson

    memmerson
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    Yeah sorry, that would have been useful :oops:

    From an AV32R bp 192 to a AV32R DP.
     
  26. GrahamMG

    GrahamMG
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    I believe that is a simple swap
     
  27. memmerson

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    excellent! I might give it a crack myself then (not literally).
     

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