Switch Your Web Browser

next010

Distinguished Member
There are some good reasons to not use the known browsers these days (Chrome, Edge, Firefox, Opera), privacy & user tracking data most of all, some of them even embracing de-platforming.

So here are some suggestions.

Brave = created by former lead dev of Firefox, includes built in blocking features, ideal for Google Chrome users as its a fork of Chrome so its works with all the same extensions.

Vivaldi = created by former Opera devs, uses Chrome engine but has a lot of features, good for Firefox or Chrome users, works with Chrome extensions.

Pale Moon = an up to date fork of classic Firefox back when it was a more flexible browser, good for long time Firefox users, works only with older Firefox extensions, not the simple modern ones.

Librewolf - a fairly new addition given the change in mozilla's practices, is linux only at the moment but kept up to date and removes the tracking elements of Firefox.

If your still using the stock web browser considering giving any of the above a try.
 
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next010

Distinguished Member
Elaborate.

De-platforming is used to deny people access to platforms/services, the current boss of Mozilla has not only come out in favour of this but wants to go further which is pretty ominous no matter her claimed justifications.

It's completely against what Mozilla used to stand for with a free and open internet but that is now the past. I used to be a long time Firefox advocate but no more after this.
 

12harry

Distinguished Member
Interesting Thread you started... I've used IE11 since Win7 (32b) was installed and it appears to work OK ( as I'm reading/posting this), but This Site tells me I'm using an Out-of-Date browser and suggests Chrome download.... being somewhat cautious I wonder if it might come with Malware ( As the notebooks the UK Government gave to school children to learn at home. er it is aledged ).
Since the Site revamp last week, I cannot UnderLine text... that Option is now missing. Of course elsewhere it's available... it's not a keyboard fault. Is this a Browser issue coming home?
/
Your Alternative Browsers might be a good start.... but I wonder if others have used the Above you posted and . . . what their experience is over time?

I notice I'm on IE11, v 0 44 with Auto updates.... So I wonder why MS hasn't offered something newer... OR are purchasers of Win7/32b not to be allowed to use their PCs.

[ FWIW sending text is pretty low-tech and receiving it, =nuch the same... Even an old Win98 PC should be capable... except for website blocking... because they want you to "enjoy" moving advertisements, which are a greater bandwidth altogether . . . . my web-connection is Coax Broadband which the ISP regularly Speed-boosts ( so the invoice explains).]

Thoughts pse... others ?

Cheers.H.

+ A browser that removes cookies would be nice, as I don't share the many website preference for them.... funny me.
 

LV426

Administrator
Staff member
Which browser? IE is pretty much dead. Google Chrome is the current market leader by a long way - see Browser Market Share Worldwide | StatCounter Global Stats

For Microsoft - IE is replaced by Edge.

Underlining? It appears to work for me. As long as the BBCode toggle is on

1611646651741.png


Ctrl+U or select the underline icon.
 

AndyC_772

Active Member
De-platforming is used to deny people access to platforms/services, the current boss of Mozilla has not only come out in favour of this but wants to go further which is pretty ominous no matter her claimed justifications.

Do you mean things like deleting Trump's Twitter account, or taking down pages supporting conspiracy theorist nutters QAnon?

Would you not agree there are instances where denying certain people and organisations access to services could, in fact, be a good thing?
 

outoftheknow

Moderator
Would you not agree there are instances where denying certain people and organisations access to services could, in fact, be a good thing?
That is a wider topic that almost certainly has a thread or two here. I think in this thread we can stick with deplatforming by browsers.

I don’t see that as the same as taking people off social media. I always thought the idea of the internet was that nobody “owned” it.
 

ChuckMountain

Distinguished Member
Interesting Thread you started... I've used IE11 since Win7 (32b) was installed and it appears to work OK ( as I'm reading/posting this), but This Site tells me I'm using an Out-of-Date browser and suggests Chrome download.... being somewhat cautious I wonder if it might come with Malware ( As the notebooks the UK Government gave to school children to learn at home. er it is aledged ).

I notice I'm on IE11, v 0 44 with Auto updates.... So I wonder why MS hasn't offered something newer... OR are purchasers of Win7/32b not to be allowed to use their PCs.

You are much more likely to suffer from malware and other attacks on your browser and OS than newer ones. Microsoft stopped support for Windows 7 on 14th January 2020 so you will get very little, if any updates. Have you had any Windows updates recently?

IE was heavily integrated into the OS, therefore since a lack of updates that may be a reason why.

I know you shouldn't be forced to upgrade but we there were fundamental issues with Windows 7 that can't be fixed by a just a patch. MS to be fair did offer free upgrades.

There are also plenty of other OSes that would still work but be up to date on your hardware along with the browsers mentioned above.

Cookies (not tracking ones) are an essential part of a web application and needed to work.
 

12harry

Distinguished Member
LV426 - Thanks, I'd not noticed the "more Options" - I guess it makes for "less clutter"

ChuckMountain Updates to my Win7 PC - - - I think that's "none-recently."..
+++ Although I have a "more powerful PC" with Win10/64b. which I just don't use - it since I'm familiar with ( Win7/32b) that's perfectly OK - But I accept it may be vulnerable - I just try to keep safe. I plan to download a new face - this claims it replaces the Win10 with a legacy Win7 - but then a Book on Win10 might be a Safer route - EXCEPT a PC should be "Obvious to use" - why would anyone paid to code, make it difficult? I understand(?) we are maybe still dragged-down by the remnants of DOS= here and there.

Cookies: I just don't like the permission I'm forced to provide ( _or NOT with some Websites it seems), - as I don't want anything inserted in my PC's HDD that I didn't put there ( On a Day-to-Day basis ), If they can insert pieces of code ( that I don't understand, or see), I reason that "Other Things" could be there - as I'd have no knowledge of that either.
+I fail to understand why Websites need to know what interests me ( since other Folks will have wildly different interests )
.FWIW: I can understand that "This Site" might want to know which Sections are interesting - but that Information is already available if they count the number of Threads / Posts / or complaints.
Many Websites prefer either no-feedback -OR- they present check-boxes, which suggests a somewhat "limited view" of their Users.

BTW(1) - has this Thread ceased to be about "Browser-Choices?" I'd still find that of interest, or I may be forced to use Chrome ---- BTW (2) - whatever happened to Firefox....?
- - - Today, MS is offering EDGE -for Win7.. Thoughts?
PLUS - can I have both Chrome and Edge - just use whichever?

Cheers All

PS
Just installed Edge - I using it right-now, It appears to work slightly better on This and Other sites... ( Than did IE11.).... for now = happy-bunny.
 
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LV426

Administrator
Staff member
Cookies: websites "need to know" your interests because there is no such thing as a free lunch; this site included. If it's free to you then someone else pays for the running costs. That's Adverts, of course, and targetted Ads are more effective and thereby rewarding than random Ads.

You could make your life relatively easy by simply allowing them all and then daily (or otherwise regularly) deleting them all from your system.
 

ChuckMountain

Distinguished Member
ChuckMountain Updates to my Win7 PC - - - I don't think that's none-recently..
+++ Although I have a "more powerful PC" with Win10/64b. which I just don't use - it since I'm familiar with ( Win7/32b) that's perfectly OK - But I accept it may be vulnerable - I just try to keep safe. I plan to download a new face - this claims it replaces the Win10 with a legacy Win7 - but then a Book on Win10 might be a Safer route - EXCEPT a PC should be "Obvious to use" - why would anyone paid to code, make it difficult? I understand(?) we are maybe still dragged-down by the remnants of DOS= here and there.

I get familiarity but by the same token, it's a bit like cars. You get a car manufacturer making a new model because the old one doesn't meet new requirements and at some point, they have to fundamentally change the design. All cars have increased in size (and weight) over time to presumably meet the needs of the users, along the way they might have a couple of in model facelifts to improve that particular car. However, ultimately they start again with a new supposedly improved model. That though, won't be everybody's' cup of tea though and some may well prefer the previous model. Car safety has improved though if you compare to say my first car which weighed well under a tonne, compared to my current which is something over the 2 tonne mark you could not have added any of the safety features to it.

I have used successive versions of Windows often as an earlier adopter and on the whole like the changes. I have also had to use Windows 7 for example as a works device and imho is awful now but we are all different. I personally don't believe it has been made more difficult :)

Cookies: I just don't like the permission I'm forced to provide ( _or NOT with some Websites it seems), - as I don't want anything inserted in my PC's HDD that I didn't put there ( On a Day-to-Day basis ), If they can insert pieces of code ( that I don't understand, or see), I reason that "Other Things" could be there - as I'd have no knowledge of that either.
+I fail to understand why Websites need to know what interests me ( since other Folks will have wildly different interests )
.FWIW: I can understand that "This Site" might want to know which Sections are interesting - but that Information is already available if they count the number of Threads / Posts / or complaints.
Many Websites prefer either no-feedback -OR- they present check-boxes, which suggests a somewhat "limited view" of their Users.

There are different categories of cookies and they are not code, simply pieces of text that often contain a unique number or string of characters. In the same way your browser caches web pages it writes cookies to your machine.

Tracking cookies do track you and monitor behaviour but that as @LV246 rightly states is so that can build a profile of you and target advertising more effectively. If somebody clicks a targetted advert and then buys Stuart will make more money and be able to maintain and run the website. He is not doing it for the good of his heart.

The other benefit of cookies is to remember the fact you have logged into the website, without session cookies you would not be able to do that.

Having said there are a lot of cookies on AVF :)

Stuart, however, does not want to reinvent the wheel, so by plugging in Google Analytics, he gets that software to count all the requests and do the things you said plus a whole lot more.

BTW(1) - has this Thread ceased to be about "Browser-Choices?" I'd still find that of interest, or I may be forced to use Chrome ---- BTW:(2) - whatever happened to Firefox....?

Firefox is still around, listed in the first sentence :)
 

12harry

Distinguished Member
Firefox - seen it now and . . . . . . I was concentrating on the various "Alternatives" suggested. There were few user-comments, so I went for Microsoft's Edge . . . the only problem with it -it has dumped its Icon on the Taskbar ( quick-launch area?), although my regular programs are a mix of the List that appears after clicking Start button and using All-Programs: to find the precise one.
Oddly most of my "Regulars" have an Icon on the Desktop which takes over the screen when any active programs are minimised ( resting on the Taskbar ).
No doubt some may find this arrangement non-standard.... but I try not to change things... unless they would prevent working.
+ I recall that programs on the Start-List will extend the Boot-time, as they have to be loaded before the PC is ready - so My Start Menu is blank / empty.

I know that many folks love Win 10 - but despite having paid good money for mine, I really don't use it... All those large tiles look like Change for Change sake...I guess to behave like my Win7... I may need to update Win 10 to Edge.... as I don't recall that being present...
My Dealer has put an icon on for Chrome... but I'm not sure it works . . . whereas Edge says it is supported by Chrome (really?) and I guess if Edge work with all fussy websites, that will do nicely. ( This appears to be the case ), I'm kinda getting used to Edge being on the Win7 Taskbar.

Cheers All...

BTW Whats up with Push? - seems they now want to send me stuff I might (/not) want... never seen this before Edge was used...
( I'm using Edge now, to send this..).
Win 10 (64b) . . . this PC was spec'd to allow two Free Video-Editing programs to be used... but I've since found they only accept a few "pro" File formats and my miserable Consumer Camcorder doesn't output these. My video media can be Edited ( some say Good/Bad), using the old Win7 (32b),PC - so I may leave Win 10 awhile.... but guess I need to allow on-line updates, one, or two day a week - just to keep it sweet.
 
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ChuckMountain

Distinguished Member
@12harry Edge is the logical successor for IE, it is just Microsoft's latest browser.

It should be in Windows 10 already but it depends as there lots of Windows 10 version, over time they should upgrade.

Tiles appear on the start menu only for Windows 10.

You can use any browser you want but Microsoft will push Edge heavily.

Push is a feature of many browsers now so you can for example on this site get desktop alerts when somebody replies to a thread you are monitoring.
 

12harry

Distinguished Member
ChuckMountain, thankyou... My Win10/64b came with Internet Explorer... my PC Dealer used my install disc I'd had for some time...presumably before Edge was available. Edge is installed after some issues - but getting around them - is part of the Working Day it seems.
(( + I am writing this via my Win10PC )).
The annoying features I would like to eliminate are 1) Google Chrome and 2) Microsoft Bing . . . even when I type in the correct web-address, Edge wants to include Bing . . . . I know nothing about Bing as a search engine... so I plan to use it for a few days... before ditching it..... which may be difficult... I must say that Win10 appears to have changed everything I knew about computers,,,, so, it's not an "intuitive" OS
FWIW I tend to use ASK (uk) - although I've noticed it searches Google sometimes . . . which make me suspect Google may own it. . . .
My objection to most of these large organisations is their privacy policy - which is:- I give them permission for everything . . . . except I won't willingly.
This was something EU tried to fix... but messed it up, since rejecting cookies appears to shut down the site. That's hardly allowing folk to Opt-Out is it?
Of course many sites still allow you to look at things to buy, so I presume the others don't want my business -OR- have a defective website and web-policy.

Cheers . . . . H.
 

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