SVS PB12? 12/Plus or Monolith ?

Discussion in 'Subwoofers' started by Spy, Sep 7, 2007.

  1. Spy

    Spy
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    I don't seem to be able to make up mind and would appreciate some expert advice.

    I have a set of 6 Anthony Gallos and need a sub to complete the system.

    Sub size is not a problem.

    The room is large approx. 5m x 8.5m.

    How do the SVS PB12/Plus Vs PB12/Plus 2 Vs Monolith compare ?

    I would guess the PB12/Plus 2 will fill the room more but I have heard that the Monolith is loud and low as well.
     
  2. sdb123

    sdb123
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    Which Anthony Gallo's are you running?
     
  3. Knyght_byte

    Knyght_byte
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    from what i understand, the PB12+ outdepths the monolith and goes louder but not by a massive degree, some would say two monoliths would do just as well for a similar price.....however iirc convos on here correctly the PB12+/2 is another matter entirely.....of course there is the fact the Ultra 13 is due out here soon too......heh...

    for movie purporses im more than happy with my PB12+......my room isnt as big as yours but its not small either.......for music, tbh i dont find it performs any better than my REL Strata 5 quality wise, it goes deeper and louder yes, but it doesnt quite match the REL's speed......not sure how it measures up against the new REL's though, i havnt heard them......
     
  4. Andori

    Andori
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    There is a post around here where Russ.Will played with a pair of monoliths and compared them to the old PB-Ultra, and I think he reckoned the ultra was the better option.

    I think the PB12 Plus and PB12 Plus/2 are currently unavailable as they need to be re-cerified for CE marking.
     
  5. Mr Incredible

    Mr Incredible
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    I was under the impression that the CE certification had been got for the PB12 Plus and Plus/2 and that's why they show as available on AV-Sales website. :confused:
     
  6. paulst10

    paulst10
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    i was told that both models have recently had an inner component changed, therefore needing CE certification again.

    paul
     
  7. Member 96948

    Member 96948
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    As with all of these things, it's not quite straight forward.

    The reason I tried two Monoliths was to see if a smoother in room response could be achieved. The answer was yes, but you wouldn't pay £400 for the difference and all of the main room modes still predominated. However, the OP has a much larger room and the extra space may make this method of interest, but.....

    Two Monoliths will probably match a PB12/Plus for output as long as you co-locate them. They don't come close if you spread them around.

    I haven't the foggiest how you would go about integrating two non-colocated subs unless you are using an EQ device like the SMS-1 with it's independent phase control. This adds £575 to the bill. Don't even think of doing it by ear.

    The big SVSs offer the opportunity to run lower tunes by plugging ports. This does sacrifice a touch of headroom (2-3dB @ 38Hz), but in my room there was no chance of ever finding that out and the 16Hz tune flattened eyeballs, whilst threatening the structure of the house. A bigger room may tax this further, but you'd have to be a real headbanger and it still outpowered two colocated Monoliths.

    The PB12/Plus2 is the total SPL hooligan, but as it's not twice the size of the Plus, it doesn't go as deep so you have to sacrifice alot of it's volume potential to get the depth back through port plugging. For me, depth rules so I don't find the Plus2 very interesting.

    I'd wait for the Ulta13.

    Russell
     
  8. Spy

    Spy
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    I am running Micro Tis at the back and Divas at the front
     
  9. Spy

    Spy
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    Thank you all for your interesting replies.

    I am not planning on going for two Monoliths, it has to be just the one subwoofer.

    I am still not sure.

    If I am reading the replies correctly, it seems that the Plus 2 may not go as deep as the Plus unless you turn the volume down, which may mean it doesn't fill the room ?

    Ultimately I want the best sub for movies.

    The Monolith is appealing due to the price Vs what sounds to be PB12 Plus equivalent performance.:smashin:

    The Plus 2 was interesting because I thought it would be significantly better than the Plus but it sounds like it may not be :thumbsdow

    Should I save the £400 odd punds and go for the monolith or is the extra money worth investing in a PB12 Plus ?

    Is the PB12 Plus 2 worth the extra money over the PB12 Plus ?

    Confusing decisions :confused:
     
  10. Spy

    Spy
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    For a different reason, how long does it take to get CE certification ?
     
  11. Morb

    Morb
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    For the best depth when tuned the PB12+ is the one you want, for outright spl (volume) the PB12+/2 would be what your after. While the Monolith is a great sub you must remember the price difference with it against the SVS offerings which are still amazing for their price.

    If you want decent bass and some money to spend down the pub and buy some dvd's get the Monolith.

    If you want gut wrenching, deep powerful bass get the PB12+.

    If you have a large room or really like to crank it up loud, and i mean really loud, get the PB12+/2

    I can vouch for the PB12+ and think you'd have to play at silly high levels to push it or have a huge room to fill, which is where the PB12+/2 comes in, but until that point it will be clean powerful and very deep. If the SVS range is the top end of your budget you might think about getting a Monolith and some EQ, usually a BFD or a SMS-1 on this forum, which would allow you to make the most of your sub. Whatever sub you pick you will most likely need an EQ device so it is worth thinking about cost wise.
     
  12. Ian J

    Ian J
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    A year ago a few of us went down to AV-Sales to hear the SVS speakers when they first arrived in the UK. Most of the demo was conducted using a PB-10 as the subwoofer but they had the PB12-Plus and PB-12Plus/2 also connected via a switcher and switched from one to another mid track. The differences were audible and the Plus/2 definately sounded better but although I knew that it was bigger I was very surprised when I first saw it in the flesh and realised how big it was.[/QUOTE]

    Questions like the above are impossible for anyone but yourself to answer as everyone will have different ideas about "value". In my own case I would go for the PB-12Plus at £740 as the bass it produces is astounding and I don't either need or want that last extra ounce that the significantly larger Plus/2 offers.
     
  13. AngelEyes

    AngelEyes
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    IMHO the PB12+ is significantly better than a Monolith, you can hear and feel effects the Monolith just hints at and this is no disrespect to the Monolith which is an amazing sub. If you never owned anything in this class before you are in for some shocking fun :D

    If you can wait a bit then the PC13 Ultra (tube) is likely to be better than all three you mentioned for about £850 IIRC and the PB13 Ultra will follow soon after for similiar performance in a box.

    With such tempting mega-subs around the corner, personally, I would be patient ;)
     
  14. Spy

    Spy
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    Thanks.

    The Ultras sound great but I don't fancy a cylinder.

    I prefer a traditional box which the wife can also use as a table.

    In the past I have owned a REL Q50 and the KEF PSW2001 so I would expect something like the PB12+ to be significantly better than the REL.

    I think I will go with the PB12+. The only worry is whether the Plus 2 may be better due to the size of the room.

    I don't particularly need loud bass, just tight and accurate.

    The room is 5m x 8.5m but the actual viewing area is approx. 5m x 6m.
     
  15. AngelEyes

    AngelEyes
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  16. suniil

    suniil
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  17. Spy

    Spy
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    Thanks Adam.

    The Ultra sounds great but unfortunately it is a front firing sub and I prefer a down firing sub due to untrustworthy kids !

    It does sound like the PB12 Plus may be the best option.

    Are there other subs that could fill my requirements that I may have missed ?
     
  18. AdrianMills

    AdrianMills
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    I lived with the PB12 plus and plus/2 for a year and have recently sold the plus - the plus/2 is way (WAY) loud enough for the vast majority of Brits (taking into account average UK room sizes) and also better sounding IMO than the plus (yes, even for music if integrated properly). I have mine in the 20hz tune with one port blocked and although it rolls off quite quickly below 20hz most people would find that deep enough.

    Having said all of that, after reading the latest tests and user comments in the US of those that have owned both the Fathom F113 and new Ultra13, I plan on getting an Ultra13 myself and then sell the plus/2. It sounds like SVS have pulled off a world beater with the new ultra - I think it's due in Europe in December after CE certification. And it's available with a metal front grill.

    I'm not sure if the new CE cert has completed for the PB pluses or whether they are selling old stock but lsound, the distributor for the rest of Europe, lists it as being in stock.

    If I were you, I'd wait for the ultra – really, I bought the plus first and almost immediately regretted not getting the plus/2.
     
  19. Morb

    Morb
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    Never regretted getting my PB12+. :devil:
     
  20. AdrianMills

    AdrianMills
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    Yes, it's an excellent sub but for my room the plus/2 is better. And I hope the ultra13 will be much better again.
     
  21. Spy

    Spy
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    Thanks for all the posts.

    Since the last post I have contemplated the 13-Ultra but looking at its dimensions it is large. The fact it is front firing would mean it will need to be positioned si that it is firing towards you.

    I expect there is more leeway with a down firing sub, where I could position it to the side.

    I would basically like to get the sub, in some orientation to fit into a recess that is 47cm deep. Width and height are not a problem.

    The PB12+ on its side sounds fine as it is 45.7cm in width
    The PB12+/2 is a little too big as its width is 48.2cm

    Are my assumptions on orientationm correct ?

    I would love an ultra, but I don't see how I can fit it into the recess with out having it fire at the side wall !
     
  22. AngelEyes

    AngelEyes
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    It doesn't have to face you really, if you think about it a DF is like placing a FF 2 inches from a wall :)

    That sounds almost too simple to be true, best wait for some of the eggheads to come along and confirm/deny :D
     
  23. Nimby

    Nimby
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    I can't sleep at nights worrying about toys being forced into the gap between the driver and the base plate on DFs. :devil:

    Pointing the driver at the wall at a reasonable distance might offer greater safety against small monsters provided the grill is left on. (and ready to make toast) :devil:
     
  24. Spy

    Spy
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    Does that mean that a front firing sub could be faced towards the wall ?

    What does that do to acoustics in terms of sound bouncing off the walls ?
     
  25. Nimby

    Nimby
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    Since wavelength is related to frequency subwoofers produce very long waves indeed. The waves are so long they don't notice if they have to bend round a piece of furniture. Or find their way out of a gap between the sub and the wall. Provided you don't put the sub closer to the wall than (say) 2-3" from the driver it shouldn't effect the sound at all. EXCEPT: Being so near the wall there may be some extra low frequency gain compare with having the driver face the room. That means free extra bass.

    Here's a link to a frequency/wavelength converter website chosen at random from the many.

    http://www.sengpielaudio.com/calculator-wavelength.htm
     
  26. Spy

    Spy
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    Thanks Nimby.

    That is interesting, I remember my first sub, a REL Q50. That was FF and I had that poointing towards the wall.

    What was interesting was that allk the connections and controls were underneath the cone so it encouraged you to face it towards the wall.

    Looking at some of the current models e.g. Ultra, the controls are at the back of teh cone which means that if you face the sub towards the wall, it exposes its connections and controls to the room !
     

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