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Superimposing?

Discussion in 'Camcorders, Action Cams & Video Editing Forum' started by simon33, Jun 9, 2005.

  1. simon33

    simon33
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    Hi there,

    Occasionally on TV, and rather annoyingly, they have a presenter 'talking to themselves' - almost as if they had an identical twin. One version of the presenter is one the left and another on the right. It's even more annoying when they get them nodding in agreement!

    I love messing around with video effects and would really like to know how this is done. I imagine this is done by filming two clips and 'merging' them together.

    Does this effect have a name, and is there any software that can acheive it?


    Thanks, :)
    Jon.
     
  2. Mr.D

    Mr.D
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    Split screen.

    Only works with a locked camera and and nothing happening in the back ground.

    If the camera is moving its a totally different kettle of fish likely involving motion control passes , rotoscoping , maybe even blue screen.
     
  3. simon33

    simon33
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    Thanks Mr. T.

    Split screening is what I'm looking for - nothing too advanced. :)

    Do you know of any software that can do this?
     
  4. melliott1963

    melliott1963
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    You should be able to do this fairly easily in Sony Vegas. I would guess that Adobe Premier will also have this feature.

    I doubt you'll find any lower end consumer editing programs that can do this, but I may be wrong.
     
  5. Mr.D

    Mr.D
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    If your editing package can handle transitions (most can) then what you need to do is a horizontal wipe between the two clips and leave the wipe in the middle. Try and shoot something that has either a nice obvious vertical transition point in the middle of the shot ( post , building edge etc) or a background with nothing happening in it.
     
  6. thebrummy_one

    thebrummy_one
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    Simon,
    Pinnicle Studio can also handle split screen for around £50. I would pefer to use green/blue screens (Chromakeying) though as it frees up your options of background movement etc.
    This is a simple process where you would shoot the first 'take' normally. Leaving enough space to one side to superimpose the second take. The second take would then be shot with you subject in front of a blue/green screen.
    When you load both takes in your editing suite, use the cromakeying tool (also available in Pinnacle) to drop out the coloured background of your second take, leaving just your subject to be superimposed.
    I actually use Vegas, but I do have a copy of Pinnacle and it does work ok in that.
    Brum
     
  7. Brian110507

    Brian110507
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    Yup - everything that Brum has said can also be done in Ulead VideoStudio 9 for about the same price.
     
  8. Mr.D

    Mr.D
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    This is complete overkill for what he wants , bluescreen use throws up all sorts of problems with regard to matching lighting and thats if you manage to light the bluescreen sufficiently to let you get a decent key without covering the subject in spill. Most low-mid level packages do not have the required tools for tackling this professionally. ( you should only ever use green unless its unavoidable for video anyway) Unless you've got access to ultimatte , primatte or keylight or have the ability to cook up your own colour difference keyer and despill routine leave well alone.

    For a simple doppelganger gag he'll get far better results using a simple locked off split screen.
     
  9. Roy Mallard

    Roy Mallard
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    I just love to outpedant a pedant.

    REMEMBER, read the original post and you shall see that all this overkill, but anyway, hee hee hee. Mr. D, you are wrong wrong wrong.

    Green is actually the best colour to use for chroma keying (to give it it's correct name, bluescreen implies using a, well, blue screen) on digital video.

    Green is the most sampled colour spectrum in DV compression (not just DV all the way up to HD) using green gives the computer far more information to work with when keying in the new background.

    Green is still enough of a colour opposite to caucasian fleshtones to allow adequate seperation.

    Blue works better for film, green works better for digital video.
     
  10. Mr.D

    Mr.D
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    Try rereading my post Roy before you so readily jump to correct someone.

    As for blue working better for film this is not true , generally speaking I'll specify green unless the foreground subject matter dictates this to be problematic. Reason being that similarly to video the green channel in film is higher resolution than blue (dictated by grain size). Green spills more readily than blue by virtue of the fact of its higher luminosity relative to blue for the same amount of light falling on it (this also makes it easier to light). However green spill can be processed out far more aggresively than blue without introducing noise and edge artifacts.

    The only advantage to using blue is that it does not wash out skintones as much as green ( although this can be corrected) and residual blue spill can appear unobjectionable in certain circumstances ( against blue skies for example but top notch practitioners will remove it all regardless).

    Regardless the single biggest challenge in creating seemless bluescreen work is the lighting of the foreground subject relative to the background. Most time is usually spent manually relighting the foreground element rather than actually dealing with the technicalities of keying the intitial element.

    The term "bluescreen" is commonly used to refer to any technique that involves colour difference keying regardless of the actual colour of the backing. The term chromakey is rarely used as it refers to a simplistic technique originated from video technology that bears little resemblance to the colour difference technique commonly used to derive mattes from bluescreen elements which has been in use with little change to the actual maths behind the technique since the 1950s ( invented by what eventually became the Ultimatte Corporation).

    Unfortunately lay people are under the mistaken belief that simply sticking something in front of a coloured backing allows you to do anything you want with it . The technique itself is actually very manually intensive and is still something of a black art.
     
  11. thebrummy_one

    thebrummy_one
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    Being of the lay verity, I think you are trying to kill creativity with science :rolleyes: I don't have kickers or keys, and my blondes only moan at me :D But I just do. :suicide:
     
  12. Mr.D

    Mr.D
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    If you want to be "creative" and do all sorts of whacky stuff with bad bluescreen work fine.

    Bluescreen methodology is not by its nature creative , ingenious yes when you are trying to get good results but intrinsically creative it is not. Its a tool to allow matte generation.

    I'd much rather see creative work that didn't necessarily use bluescreen or really polished bluescreen work in creative work.

    And the best way to get good results for the initial poster is to shoot carefully with a view to doing a split screen not bluescreen which will never look anything other than ugly, unless you've got a fair bit of experience in shooting and compositing it , no matter how creative the rest of the shot is.
     
  13. thebrummy_one

    thebrummy_one
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    Fair comment :smashin:
     

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