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Superbit DVDS??

Discussion in 'Movie Forum' started by ArcticFox77, Aug 30, 2005.

  1. ArcticFox77

    ArcticFox77
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    I'm just wondering if these superbit dvds mean HD dvds??
    Are they the same quality as HDTV??
    If your not sure there is a few dvds at www.play.com
    Please tell me as i want to see HD dvds/ tv NOW!!
     
  2. Razor

    Razor
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  3. Thunder

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    Sometimes they do, sometimes they don't :)
     
  4. LV426

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    Indeed. I gather that Spiderman 2 Superbit is substantially better that its "standard" alternatives. I know its one of the best DVDs I have for PQ and SQ, but I can't offer any personal comparitive judgement on the other versions.
     
  5. Razor

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    Sometimes they do, yes. Superbit in its day was good, if you pick up a dvd which is 5 years old the quality is no where near as good as todays releases. I have a few superbit dvd's in my collection and to be honest I wasnt that impressed. Vampires (superbit) is particularly grainy and not very good at all. Compare a dvd such as i-robot to a superbit dvd and you will say 'what is all the fuss about'. Superbit 5 years ago was great but now days its nothing special at all. Not a patch on HD. Superbit dvd's do however have DTS sound which is always good. :D

    LV426 :hiya:

    The original spiderman 2 dvd was queit disapointing which was a surprise. :( I havent seen the superbit version. :rolleyes:

    I have a 1080i version of spiderman 2 and it is amazing for pic quality. :thumbsup:
     
  6. BAN5HEE

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    I am in the process of buying all the superbit DVD's I can get my hands on. Desperado Superbit is much better the the stndard version and so is teras of the sun. Black hawk down and Fast and Furios is very good too. The dvd's you mention Razor all new dvd's with CGI in them and just got good quality pics like most of the newer dvd's. I still think Superbits DVD's are much better then standard. Getting them for the DTS sound is reason enough alone.
     
  7. the_pauley

    the_pauley
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    There's no doubt that most Superbit versions of movies (such as Spiderman) are better than the vanilla versions. But the only reason for this is that Sony/Columbia deliberately hold back on the quality of their non-Superbit releases, precisely because they want to sell a Superbit version a few months later in the hope that we will double dip.

    Superbit is a brand name - not a technical standard. It falls within all normal technical DVD Forum parameters for a normal DVD and is inherently of no better quality than any standard release from other DVD companies.

    Indeed in a technical test of 20 Superbit titles, DVD Review concluded that 19 of the 20 had inferior or at best equal picture quality when compared to standard releases from other companies. Indeed the much vaunted strength of Superbit, namely utilizing the disc space in order to maximize the bit-rate for picture and sound quality by leaving off extras, commentaries, etc, was shown to be totally bogus by this test.

    The technical analysis showed that titles from other companies showed objectively superior picture quality and a higher bit-rate than the Superbit titles and yet still managed to include extras, audio commentaries, etc. This was exposed several years ago, yet people have continued to buy into the scam.

    Superbit is a cynical marketing ploy by Sony. They simply hold back the picture and sound quality on their initial releases that all other companies give us as standard. Then they charge us a premium for the best quality. The rationale is that if you're a fan of the movie, you'll want the version with all the extras, but if you want the best picture and sound quality you have to buy a Superbit copy as well.

    Cynical and exploitative even by the standards of the major distributors.

    All that it takes is for people to stop buying Superbit titles and let Sony know why. Then perhaps they'll start giving us the picture and sound quality (along with the extras) that other distributors give us as a matter of course.
     
  8. Razor

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  9. the_pauley

    the_pauley
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    I can (reluctantly) live with the fact that companies will bring out director's cuts and expanded multiple disc sets to try and tempt us to double-dip.

    What I find beyond the pale is Sony/Columbia deliberately holding back on the sound and picture quality in order to market a Superbit version of the disc a few months later.

    A classic case in point is the standard release of Spiderman. Less than half the space of a DVD9 has been used to accommodate the movie. If proof were needed that they are deliberately holding back on the quality of standard releases, this is it.

    As far as this company is concerned I vote with my £. With any other company I will buy unknown titles and try out unfamiliar material. With Sony/Columbia I only ever buy what I absolutely know that I want to own. I e-mailed them and told them this and explained that the reason was because of the Superbit scam and how that impacted on the quality of standard releases.

    In reply I received the standard company promo along the lines of "Superbit is a high quality... maximizes bit-rate... etc" and none of my other points re. the quality of their standard releases was addressed.

    I fired back an e-mail asking, if Superbit is so good, why did you withdraw the Gladiator Superbit from sale?

    No reply to that one - I wonder why? :D

    (In case anyone doesn't know, the standard R1 release of Gladiator, complete with extras, etc, turned out to be superior in quality to the extras-free Superbit edition. Red faces all round methinks! :rotfl: )
     
  10. davidjohnson

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    I am a bit undecided on this matter :confused:

    I agree that it would appear to be a scam, but as superbits are now the same price as the standard release, I tend to just wait.

    I have a small collection of Superbit titles and when I have been able to compare them with their "standard" counterparts, all have had better PQ. This includes Gladiator superbit (PAL) which does look better than the original region 1 release, although it does not have DTS ES.
    I am not saying it is superior, but it definitely looks better on my system.

    It is also true that many "standard" releases from other studios look nicer than the Superbits.
     
  11. BAN5HEE

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    Same here. I have about ten superbit titles and have compared them with my SD versions and the superbit come out top each time. Like I said its not just the PQ its the DTS sound too. With the Superbit dvd's going for £7 from play I would much rather own the superbit title then the SD version stuffed with useless extras that I never look at anyway.
     
  12. the_pauley

    the_pauley
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    No one is disputing that the Superbit titles are better than the standard versions of the same movie (with the exception of Gladiator). The problem people have with Sony is the reason why Superbit releases are superior to the standard releases. The reason being that Sony/Columbia deliberately hold back on the quality of the standard releases so they can sell the Superbit title too.

    Geddit? They deliberately release a sub-standard product first time around.

    You're living proof that the strategy works in that you admit to owning standard and Superbit releases of the same title. Just stop and think for a moment - aren't you even just slightly annoyed that after forking out £15 or so for the standard release, that you have to fork out another tenner or so for the picture and sound that other companies give you as standard and that you should have had on the initial release?

    Other manufacturers manage equiivalent and quite often superior picture quality to Sony's Superbit on their standard releases, and include lots of extras without feeling the need to dress them up with a new brand name like Superbit and forcing you to buy the same movie twice if you want the best quality and the extras.

    How clearer does it have to be stated people? Superbit is not a technically superior standard. It's a marketing scam, and a scam that results in reduced product quality for those of us that refuse to be ripped off by Sony and swallow the Superbit line. It is a plain, bog standard DVD, inherently no different or superior to non-Superbit titles from other companies - end of story.

    So long as some people continue to support this shoddy marketing exercise, Sony will continue to screw you and the rest of us will have to put up with inferior quality product.

    All corporations will try to shaft us if they can, but when you drop your pants and bend over for them, then you deserve to be taken for that long, hard ride.
     
  13. davidjohnson

    davidjohnson
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    To be honest, I dont feel slightly annoyed at all.

    It is my money and I choose to spend it as I want. I do not get upset at how others spend their money, or lecture them in a patronising tone about it.
     
  14. the_pauley

    the_pauley
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    The reason the Gladiator Superbit was withdrawn was that it transpired that the company had inadvertently used the same video master for both the Superbit and standard release. They are exactly the same. Except of course for a better soundtrack and a disc full of extras on the standard release. :D

    You are comparing a PAL disc to an NTSC disc. If all is equal in the manufacturing / authoring of the discs, such as both discs having used the same master source (which these have) any slight improvement in quality will be down to the slightly better quality offered by the PAL format - nothing to do with Superbit.
     
  15. the_pauley

    the_pauley
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    I was aking the question of BAN5HEE, but since you joined in...

    The tone is not patronising - the tone is one of annoyance.

    Amazing - you don't have any objection to a major corporation foisting a scam on you, yet you only feel you are being patronised when someone points it out to you. Go figure... :rolleyes:

    You're right. You have the right to spend your money exactly as you want and carry on buying into the Superbit scam, but I also have the right to be annoyed at the consequences that has for me as a purchaser of the standard releases.
     
  16. LicensedTaximan

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    The only superbit I purchased was Godzilla, and the reasons for that was firstly it was going cheap at HMV in a sale and that DTS was included (as they all have on superbits) plus the standard version has rubbish extras. Having compared the standard version with my superbit version I have to say the picture quality difference was doubtful to say the least, but having the DTS option was the main selling point even though I have a stereo amp and an add on pro-logic processor at the momement. Saving up for an AVCA11xv though. :)
     
  17. Razor

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    A few more airport runs and I am sure you will get there. :thumbsup:
     
  18. the_pauley

    the_pauley
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    That was another thing the DVD Review article mentioned - with a few titles the Superbit showed no obvious improvement over the standard release. I think Dracula was one, can't remember if Godzilla was.
     
  19. Razor

    Razor
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    Vampires is total poo quality.
     
  20. the_pauley

    the_pauley
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    Heard a guy at an AV show giving a Sony/Columbia guy grief over the picture quality of a Superbit of Panic Room. He used terms like "shoddy" and "disgraceful". :D
     
  21. Stuart Wright

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    I've been saying for years that Superbit is a ripoff. The first release of the DVD should be the best picture quality possible, and if there isn't room on the disc for the extras, they should go on a second disc as a matter of course.
    Par for the course, though, as I would say more than 90% of DVDs have obvious edge enhancement which makes the picture quality unacceptable.
    You might want to take a look at our DVD reviews as we run an analysis of the bitrate and include a graph with each review.

    LicensedTaximan, Razor and Lion, will you guys please stop taking threads off topic! Just plain rude. :mad: :nono: Your posts have been deleted.
     
  22. LicensedTaximan

    LicensedTaximan
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    Bit late but............Er soreee I did apologize for going off topic at the time and i've only done it on this one occasion. :blush:
     
  23. AML

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    I dont know what the quality of UK Superbits is like. I do have quite a few US (R1) and Jap (R2) Superbits and I'm pretty happy with them.

    I guess it is a ripp off when they should be giving us the best possible version from day one, but its never that simple is it?

    You can bet Sony will do the same with Blu Ray some time down the road.

    Still, the fact that the picture can be improved upon in a newer version of a DVD is always going to be desirable to the fan of a particular movie.

    An example for me would be "The Fast and The Furious". I got the original when it first came out and really loved this film.
    When it was re-released on Superbit in Japan I bought it and was blown away by how much better it looked and sounded than the original I had watched so many times.
    I now use the superbit version as a refference disk for any new equipment I buy.
    Another good example of a good picture is the R1 version of "Fifth Element".

    A few things I have noticed in deffense of Superbit, is that it offers DTS every time and higher bit rates.

    Also most superbits come out a few months (sometimes longer) after an original release. Having this extra time to make the movie look as good as it can is also a reason why Superbits look better.

    If there was no original relase and only Suprbits, then we would have to wait a very long time to see a movie, and most people who dont care about quality want it NOW!

    Only fans, or quality buffs wait for or buy superbits.
    No one is forcing you to buy superbits after all.

    The truth is that if you want the best possible picture quality in a DVD, you would need to wait a lot longer for a DVD.
    I think this is why they started Superbits to begin with.
     

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