Subwoofer Upgrade - dual, or better single?

JustinT350

Active Member
Also. Very good point on going one then adding rather than splitting the budget for two lesser subs. Never thought of it that way.
 

Conrad

Moderator
I already have a 2x4 HD for BEQ. What did he do?
I would guess measure each sub, time align them, present them to Audyssey to EQ, then adjust EQ to taste and correct the alignment and integration.

With a single sub there's less you can do but you can still improve on integration and apply better EQ.
 

Mr Wolf

Active Member
@JustinT350 This chart shows the Audioholics' measured output of four of the subs that have been mentioned above so you can see what extra £££ buys you in terms of SPL.

1620134814751.png


1620135676665.png


Don't be put off by the SVS list prices as there are some decent discounts to be had if you shop around - I recently paid £2,400 for a pair of PB-3000s (22.5% off RRP).
 

Jester1066

Well-known Member
Also. Very good point on going one then adding rather than splitting the budget for two lesser subs. Never thought of it that way.
It's the way I've basically built my entire HT system - in stages. Having said that I did buy my 2 subs together. Was a deal too good to refuse! 🙂
 

Jester1066

Well-known Member
This chart shows the Audioholics' measured output of four of the subs that have been mentioned above so you can see what extra £££ buys you in terms of SPL.
Useful chart that! 👍🏼

Just a shame no one's meassured Monoliths on offer from BK in similar fashion As the BK's really do offer fab value for money, but there's no data, showing how they perform against the SVS's et ell.
 

Mr Wolf

Active Member
Useful chart that! 👍🏼

Just a shame no one's meassured Monoliths on offer from BK in similar fashion As the BK's really do offer fab value for money, but there's no data, showing how they perform against the SVS's et ell.
I know, it's a real shame. I can only presume that BK don't want to publish this type of data, hopefully not out of fear of comparison.

I wonder if the test could be done with a UMIK-1 and the tools in REW. If so, maybe a BK owning member could have a go in their garden with a tripod and an extension lead - would be funny for the neighbours to hear it!
 

Conrad

Moderator
PSA don't publish their data either, and I'm pretty sure that's not out of fear.

Tom V's been very clear about the limited usefulness of this data. It's missing a lot of important information like distortion to be truly useful. He's been quite vocal that it's easy to make a sub that excels at these tests but it doesn't really translate to in-room performance.

It's ok as a rough reference and to weed out the very poor performers.
 

Mr Wolf

Active Member
PSA don't publish their data either, and I'm pretty sure that's not out of fear.

Tom V's been very clear about the limited usefulness of this data. It's missing a lot of important information like distortion to be truly useful. He's been quite vocal that it's easy to make a sub that excels at these tests but it doesn't really translate to in-room performance.

It's ok as a rough reference and to weed out the very poor performers.
Well Audioholics seem to think it's valuable and go to a lot of trouble to publish their testing methodology in great detail. Maybe Tom V should set them straight on it.

 

Coulson

Distinguished Member
I would guess measure each sub, time align them, present them to Audyssey to EQ, then adjust EQ to taste and correct the alignment and integration.

With a single sub there's less you can do but you can still improve on integration and apply better EQ.
I'm pretty OK with Audyssey XT32 on my single sub but the poster also "seems" to have a single sub which is why I am interested.
 

mb3195

Distinguished Member
I'm pretty OK with Audyssey XT32 on my single sub but the poster also "seems" to have a single sub which is why I am interested.
Audyssey does an ok job, but can always be improved.
 

Conrad

Moderator
Well Audioholics seem to think it's valuable and go to a lot of trouble to publish their testing methodology in great detail. Maybe Tom V should set them straight on it.

I agree that it's useful as a baseline for comparison, but I wouldn't buy a sub based on those figures alone.
 

kenshingintoki

Distinguished Member
I already have a 2x4 HD for BEQ. What did he do?


Calibrated the sub! I'm sure you've already done the same if you have a mini DSP!

so much smoother!
 

Conrad

Moderator
I'm pretty OK with Audyssey XT32 on my single sub but the poster also "seems" to have a single sub which is why I am interested.
Audyssey time alignment can usually be improved, even with a single sub.
If you don't have the app then the minidsp gives you better control over the target curve as well.
 

Coulson

Distinguished Member
Audyssey time alignment can usually be improved, even with a single sub.
If you don't have the app then the minidsp gives you better control over the target curve as well.
Before Tenet I might have considered getting the app. I'm less inclined to after hearing Tenet. It made my little system sound like a Cineworld, minus the thump in the chest. That's probably the only thing missing and I'm not sure I know enough about how to use the app and certainly not enough about the mindsp to fix that.
 

Conrad

Moderator
Chest slam is in the 50-100Hz region, so right through the crossover (usually). That makes time alignment and integration critical.

If you want to experiment, grab an umik-1 and REW. There's plenty of help in the REW thread and there's an umik in the classifieds. You could at least measure and see what's what. From that I'll be able to tell you if you can improve the integration and chest slam.
 

Coulson

Distinguished Member
Chest slam is in the 50-100Hz region, so right through the crossover (usually). That makes time alignment and integration critical.

If you want to experiment, grab an umik-1 and REW. There's plenty of help in the REW thread and there's an umik in the classifieds. You could at least measure and see what's what. From that I'll be able to tell you if you can improve the integration and chest slam.
Umik is gone but no worries, I might pick up the Audyssey app, remove midrange comp and see how it goes from there.
 

Gasp3621

Distinguished Member
Evening all, I'm hoping for a bit of advice.

As with most home set ups, I seem to have found myself slowly upgrading bits as and when I can afford it. Screen, speakers, amp etc. I'm now at the point where I think I need to upgrade my subwoofer. My current set up is -

Denon X3700H AVR
Dali oberon 5s
Dali Zensor surrounds
Dali Alteco atmos
Cambridge Audio Sx120 Subwoofer. Link below


I've done a lot of reading, probably too much. And seem to have got myself confused. My subwoofer to me seems fairly adequate but I guess I don't know what I'm missing. It was bought as a cheap starter sub.

Would adding another Sx120 be worthwhile? Or should I look to change it to something like an SVS pb-1000 or even 2000? (PB seems better for films?)

Will I notice much of a change in a subwoofer swap? Daft question maybe, but at £700 it is a big outlay.

My room is 7.5m x 4.5x

Thanks for any help

Monoprice Monolith 12THX would be quite ideal considering the size as you want to go duals later. Most people can´t have two refrigerators in living room. And i mean the 15THX model, one member bought it see pictures here:

799£ if you sign up! Compared to new PB2000 Pro which costs 999£ this is great deal!
 

kenshingintoki

Distinguished Member
Monoprice Monolith 12THX would be quite ideal considering the size as you want to go duals later. Most people can´t have two refrigerators in living room. And i mean the 15THX model, one member bought it see pictures here:

799£ if you sign up! Compared to new PB2000 Pro which costs 999£ this is great deal!

I've followed your advice Gap, snapped up 2x 15'' Monos.
Got 2 fridges in my room soon.
 

rccarguy2

Well-known Member
I do prefer sealed over ported but I haven't had a chance to get pb4000 in my larger room. But in the smaller one, I didn't rate my pc ultra 13 for music, sbu13 was better. That's with antimode.

Also with smaller sub they can fit in easier, th sbu13 fits just below my c9. If I had the pb4000 I'd need to raise my TV several inches, the TV screen may be bit too high.

A high end sealed sub should provide enough output and low end, I've had my single sbu13 pretty loud and several dB hit and it copes fine. Maybe at higher than reference and running hot it may distort but that's not really normal use.

Dual PSA ps1512 wil be more than enough, and two sealed will take up less floor and height space than two porters. Ie dual monoprice 15" are massive.

I'm single and my home cinema/living and dining (first two priority) has priority but I wouldn't want two filing cabinet dominating the space...maybe if room was 10m X 5m as bigger sub doesn't look over the top and need bigger sub in a bigger room...my sw-150 looks tiny in my big bedroom 25m2 I've seen that same sub in a box room and it looks much bigger in that room
 

kenshingintoki

Distinguished Member
I do prefer sealed over ported but I haven't had a chance to get pb4000 in my larger room. But in the smaller one, I didn't rate my pc ultra 13 for music, sbu13 was better. That's with antimode.

Also with smaller sub they can fit in easier, th sbu13 fits just below my c9. If I had the pb4000 I'd need to raise my TV several inches, the TV screen may be bit too high.

A high end sealed sub should provide enough output and low end, I've had my single sbu13 pretty loud and several dB hit and it copes fine. Maybe at higher than reference and running hot it may distort but that's not really normal use.

Dual PSA ps1512 wil be more than enough, and two sealed will take up less floor and height space than two porters. Ie dual monoprice 15" are massive.

I'm single and my home cinema/living and dining (first two priority) has priority but I wouldn't want two filing cabinet dominating the space...maybe if room was 10m X 5m as bigger sub doesn't look over the top and need bigger sub in a bigger room...my sw-150 looks tiny in my big bedroom 25m2 I've seen that same sub in a box room and it looks much bigger in that room
how big is ur c9?
 

kenshingintoki

Distinguished Member

kenshingintoki

Distinguished Member
65" bottom of the panel is about 1.5cm from top of the sbu13
Get 77'' man, its a good upgrade. I loved my 77'' OLED.. or 83'' if u can afford it. new sony panels look great.
 

The latest video from AVForums

Sony A90J & A80J OLED and X90J & X95J BRAVIA XR TV Line-up & Features: Sony Interview
Subscribe to our YouTube channel

Latest News

Sony launches larger screen sizes for latest Bravia XR TVs
  • By Andy Bassett
  • Published
Sennheiser Consumer Electronics acquired by Sonova
  • By Andy Bassett
  • Published
Freeview Play viewers get Android TV homescreen update
  • By Andy Bassett
  • Published
Hisense announces US TV and soundbar ranges for 2021
  • By Andy Bassett
  • Published
AVForums Podcast: 5th May 2021
  • By Phil Hinton
  • Published

Full fat HDMI teeshirts

Support AVForums with Patreon

Top Bottom