Stuttering on large MKV files Plex

YitEarp

Banned
I run plex from my pc to my tv via the Samsung plex app this is run from 500mb homeplugs

I have recently starting ripping my bluray collection and to keep the DTS track along with a good video bitrate they come to around 20-40gb this is fine as I have the storage space.

However I am now finding plex struggles to playback the audio track as the bitrate is very high (don't have it to hand)

My network card is a gigabit so I don't know if this has any bearing or not

What environment would I need in order to achieve playback as I have ripped avatar 3D and the picture is fine however again the DTS track is choppy and just wont play.

I have read that I should increase the buffer on the TV app so im yet to try this.

But im just wondering what setup should I be going for to ensure I can do this flawlessy

I plan to build a htpc and connect this to the main tv soon so hopefully this will bypass what is happening.

I am wondering if I run through an amp (Yamaha) would this take care of the DTS track?

Bit confused with the world of streaming as I don't know much about network speeds etc but when I check windows task manager im running between 7.7mbps and 27mbps when a movie is playing across the network.

Sorry for the wall of text!
 

mickevh

Distinguished Member
I wouldn't take too much notice of Task Manager's network traffic graphs - some of them are not very good at giving accurate indications of traffic levels (other tools are better.)

The bit rate of DTS is of nothing compared to the bit rate of the video stream - sound is an order of magnitude (or two) less than the video, esp HD video.

The sound and video are wrapped up together for network transmission, so the network infrastructure makes no distinction between them - "the network" simply doesn't distinguish between the "video" and "sound" data as they transit the network in a single homogenous "lumps" of "data" (as far as "the network" is concerned.)

If the pictures aren't stuttering, there's no reason (due to network delivery) that the sound should.

I'd be much more suspicious of either issues in the playback device, or some transcoding/encoding issues in the Plex server.

If you can lay your hands on an additional PC/Mac, you could connect it at the same location as you TV and test network bandwidth either using tools such as iPerf or NetIO or simply copy a media file over the link and time it on a watch. If copying takes less time that the playback duration, (say a 2 hour movie takes less than two hours to copy,) you can be confident the network infrastructure has the umph and the issue is more likely to lie elsewhere. The bigger the ratio between "copy" time and "playback" duration, the more confident you can be that you network is good enough.
 
Last edited:

drummerjohn

Well-known Member
As Mickevh states - not a network issue. By the way your TV is 100mbps but that's neither here or there as BR content is at best 30mbps.

Is Plex set to transcode audio &\or video?

What DTS track have you ripped and\or using? DTS core or DTS MA-HD?

Try your amp.
 

next010

Distinguished Member
Are you using MakeMKV if so thats the raw Blu-ray video stream just swapped into an mkv container, the Samsung media player might not be able to handle that even if the network link was fast enough.

Try playing the files on USB and see if they play okay to rule it out.
 

YitEarp

Banned
Cheers guy im using DTS MA-HD I believe as its just ripped from the master track like for like and just in an MKV container via makeMKV

My pc is set to transcode and its a meaty PC so I don't think the issue lies there perhaps I think the Samsung blu ray player doesn't have enough memory to buffer perhaps?

I don't have a usb lying around big enough for the 34gb file of avatar

I will try to run it through an amp see if that makes a difference with decoding the audio track maybe?
 

next010

Distinguished Member
Samsung media player may not be up to the task, typically the bitrates officially supported are around 30Mbps though the Samsung may be able to handle more than that, Blu-ray can go to 54Mbps.

You also don't want to have the HD audio in the container either, stick with core DTS or AC3 (Dolby), thats what Samsung support.

If you want very high quality playable videos the settings below should do the trick with BDtoAVCHD
* Select open video file and point it at mkv file
* Set target media mkv crf and crf value to 18
* Set target audio AC3 640Kbps for Dolby 5.1 or set to untouched to copy original audio (only keep AC3/DTS audio, no TrueHD/DTS-MA) for maximum compatibility stick with AC3 640kbps encode.
* select add to queue and start job when it asks select full recode

Alternate option with BDtoAVCHD if it's only the audio giving trouble
* Select open video file and point it at mkv file
* Set target media mkv remux
* Set target audio AC3 640Kbps
* select add to queue and start job

That will re-do the audio into standard Dolby 5.1 which Samsung support, if there are no issue with the video then it should play fine if your network is fast enough.
 

YitEarp

Banned
In with you thanks for the advice I just liked the fact it used DTS audio which I thought was better than 5.1

Will hooking up a htpc to my tv resolve this issue as I don't want to decode the audio again

Currently I plan on having all my sources through an amp so that should be able to sort out the audio am I correct?

Learning about this st the moment pretty steep curve!
 

YitEarp

Banned
Next010 thanks for that I remuxed the audio and it works fine with DTS core

Im a bit bugged out by it however as I like it just to play so thinking of bypassing the Samsung player and opting straight for the HTPC.

Question on this as I don't know too much as you might tell: If I connect an amp via hdmi and through my network via a NAS drive, would the amp be able to decode what is happening?
 

next010

Distinguished Member
I would consider it highly unlikely the Samsung media player would pass the HD audio tracks to an amp via HDMI ARC, optical cannot carry HD audio either.

The media players in TV's are not video/audiophile grade they are very basic. But why do you want HD audio if your only playing the media on TV's internal speakers, HD audio wont make a jot of difference compared to regular Dolby/DTS, it's all downmixed to stereo no matter what - well Dolby/DTS should get passed to an amp for 5.1 decoding I think Samsung support that over optical.
 

YitEarp

Banned
I'm using a set of Logitech speakers with the decoder built in the control thing. Not ideal but suits me for now

It's just a base until I get the all clear to buy myself the speakers I want when they wifey allows as I have to make the connections in the room etc anyways first.

Am I right in thinking DTS is mainly for 7.1 anyway?

Is the htpc a good idea in general as there will be no network speeds to contend with and plex runs these files fine from its media centre on my pc right now.
Even knows the sound format such as DTS and logiteh control sorts it out
 

next010

Distinguished Member
Honestly if it were me I'd stick with the TV and Plex then hook up the TV's optical output to whatever future sound system your getting to give yourself Dolby/DTS 5.1 audio and leave it at that or stick with the Logitech speakers that you have.

That's the wife friendly approach at least, HTPC's can be messy, require maintenance, switching inputs whereas everything is built into the TV and controlled from the remote.
 

YitEarp

Banned
Honestly if it were me I'd stick with the TV and Plex then hook up the TV's optical output to whatever future sound system your getting to give yourself Dolby/DTS 5.1 audio and leave it at that or stick with the Logitech speakers that you have.

That's the wife friendly approach at least, HTPC's can be messy, require maintenance, switching inputs whereas everything is built into the TV and controlled from the remote.

Messy in what way? I only intend on hooking it up via hdmi to the tv via windows 8 and operate with iphone remote and use a 5.1 sound card via optical to an amp when I get around to one.

It does indeed work re-muxing the sound however I plan on extending my library quite a lot now blu rays are cheaper and don't want to faff about with the discs all the time so ripping them like for like is important to me as in the future I will convert a room to a cinema

I have already started the htpc build and have another on the way for the bedroom.

Will see how I get on and hopefully wont hit no major pitfalls
 

next010

Distinguished Member
Software updates for one, unexpected prompts, things not going to plan with self builds like driver issues, system instability etc.

HTPC's sound great in theory from a lot of experience over the years it never quite works out that way, there are always gremlins in the works. Most people into HTPC's simply accept that as part of the price, some level of tinkering is always going to happen.

They are particularly not suited to less then tech savy family's as well, when your not around to troubleshoot why it's not working.

I'd go with a Popcornhour A400 as an alternative, set top box handles Blu-ray's and HD audio pass-through, less to go wrong, more of an appliance.
 

YitEarp

Banned
Software updates for one, unexpected prompts, things not going to plan with self builds like driver issues, system instability etc.

HTPC's sound great in theory from a lot of experience over the years it never quite works out that way, there are always gremlins in the works. Most people into HTPC's simply accept that as part of the price, some level of tinkering is always going to happen.

They are particularly not suited to less then tech savy family's as well, when your not around to troubleshoot why it's not working.

I'd go with a Popcornhour A400 as an alternative, set top box handles Blu-ray's and HD audio pass-through, less to go wrong, more of an appliance.
I have seen the popcorn and completely forgotten about them they also have plex migration with them do they not?

will look into it

thanks for the advice most appreciative
 

next010

Distinguished Member
PCH dont have Plex but their own internal jukebox software which runs on the box itself, similar to XBMC in practice.

There arent any Plex set top boxes that will do HD audio, though the GoogleTV set top box (Sony GTV only UK model) is the best Plex client and will handle the output from MakeMKV with 5.1 Dolby audio (no DTS, no HD audio).

The BD players which have Plex clients like Samsungs have Cinavia DRM on them which you do not want.
 

YitEarp

Banned
Well I have opted for the HTPC build in the end. After some tinkering today with my main pc I set it up downstairs to the tv via hdmi and it worked just fine. Audio was even detected as DTS through the Logitech receiver thing via optical.

So for just the main TV I think this is the way I will go as I like the functionality of the software as you may of guessed and also I may use it as a pc now and then.

My biggest gripe is how do I go about connecting all of the other TV's around the house when the time comes? I have looked into perhaps a card that has multiple HDMI outputs and running cable to the TV's

This has pitfalls as I think I will need 90mtrs or more for the job.

And with there being only one source available (HTPC) then everyone has to watch the same thing....

I was also thinking of mini PC's attached to the TV's then a network share from my new synology still operated via plex obviously :)

Im getting there with what I want to achieve I think.

Just sorting out the details of a home network install now so I can get a gigabit network installed and hopefully future proof things for times to come.

Cheers for the advice next010 very insightful
 
For the other TVs you could buy some Roku XS', they are £79 and have Plex. they work over Ethernet (very well) and WiFi (not as well - but that could be my WiFi).

These will be transcoded by your super duper PC so you'll have to always have that on.

Saves on mini PCs tho, and you get a good GUI and remote.

Super Duper PC - Plex Media Server
Roku XS - Plex Client
 

YitEarp

Banned
I have looked at the roku players as It happens since I searched for media devices supporting plex

I like the idea of the them but I wonder if the synology NAS is powerful enough to transcode on the fly im yet to set it up fully as awaiting the WD red drives so I will test it out if its capable enough.

Then I will look into the roku a little more. I've started my Htpc build and will work on it this week if I get time out.

Still have to sort the room out however for a projector - time I don't have :)
 
There are few Nas that have enough beef to transcode to a Roku.
 

mickevh

Distinguished Member
The "point" of a NAS (Network Attached Storage) is that it's seriously a cut down "PC" that has just enough power to serve files out to a LAN, (little RAM, Low spec CPU, limited O/S, etc. etc.)

There's been "function creep" over the years as NAS vendors bundle more and more stuff in them and increasingly it seems that "NAS" means "managed through a web page" (and often headless) and "server" means "has a full fat GUI" and general purpose O/S (I generalise hugely of course.)

But if one bears in mind the heritage of a NAS, one can see why they aren't good at things like real time video transcoding, which is a CPU (etc) intensive task at odds with what NAS's started out as.
 

dUnKle

Distinguished Member
Samsung media player may not be up to the task, typically the bitrates officially supported are around 30Mbps though the Samsung may be able to handle more than that, Blu-ray can go to 54Mbps.

You also don't want to have the HD audio in the container either, stick with core DTS or AC3 (Dolby), thats what Samsung support.

If you want very high quality playable videos the settings below should do the trick with BDtoAVCHD
* Select open video file and point it at mkv file
* Set target media mkv crf and crf value to 18
* Set target audio AC3 640Kbps for Dolby 5.1 or set to untouched to copy original audio (only keep AC3/DTS audio, no TrueHD/DTS-MA) for maximum compatibility stick with AC3 640kbps encode.
* select add to queue and start job when it asks select full recode

Alternate option with BDtoAVCHD if it's only the audio giving trouble
* Select open video file and point it at mkv file
* Set target media mkv remux
* Set target audio AC3 640Kbps
* select add to queue and start job

That will re-do the audio into standard Dolby 5.1 which Samsung support, if there are no issue with the video then it should play fine if your network is fast enough.
I there something as simple as that to rip hd-DVD but keep file size under 10gb keeping 5.1 ?
 

drummerjohn

Well-known Member
The "point" of a NAS (Network Attached Storage) is that it's seriously a cut down "PC" that has just enough power to serve files out to a LAN, (little RAM, Low spec CPU, limited O/S, etc. etc.)

There's been "function creep" over the years as NAS vendors bundle more and more stuff in them and increasingly it seems that "NAS" means "managed through a web page" (and often headless) and "server" means "has a full fat GUI" and general purpose O/S (I generalise hugely of course.)

But if one bears in mind the heritage of a NAS, one can see why they aren't good at things like real time video transcoding, which is a CPU (etc) intensive task at odds with what NAS's started out as.
Couldn't agree more. Let a NAS be a NAS and buy the right tool for the job ie a media player that can play all the formats you want.

The only media player that plays everything without issue is my HTPC running XBMC.
 

Terminatahx

Novice Member
I hope my Plex setup may give you some ideas:

Homemade server running ESXi5.5 with 10 vms.

  • I don't use the smart apps because they are too slow and buggy.
  • 1 vm as my Plex server running 4vcpus and 4gb RAM.
  • Plex vm has an NFS datastore on my Synology DS412+
  • 1 VM performing movie search and grab (CouchPotato and SABnzbd)
  • Roku device connected to 60" TV via HDMI. Roku has built in Plex client app.
  • Plex configred for 8mb/s 1080p throughput. Tested on wifi and wired 1gb. Anything higher stutters.
This setup works flawlessly. Movies are liquid smooth and systems are stable. Can run 4 simultaneous movie streams with no stuttering or disconnections.
 

HugoFJH

Active Member
The "point" of a NAS (Network Attached Storage) is that it's seriously a cut down "PC" that has just enough power to serve files out to a LAN, (little RAM, Low spec CPU, limited O/S, etc. etc.)

There's been "function creep" over the years as NAS vendors bundle more and more stuff in them and increasingly it seems that "NAS" means "managed through a web page" (and often headless) and "server" means "has a full fat GUI" and general purpose O/S (I generalise hugely of course.)

But if one bears in mind the heritage of a NAS, one can see why they aren't good at things like real time video transcoding, which is a CPU (etc) intensive task at odds with what NAS's started out as.
totally agree with this, but before the OP buys anything (storage wise) given that he is interested in BR rips (which will use storage up rapidly) - try and work out what storage you want for the next 3 or 4 years straight away.

The reason I say this is that NAS's start pretty cheap, but as soon as you start looking at ones with larger storage capacity / more hdd's the cost ramps up very quickly.

Instead of a NAS (because of BR usage) , why not go for a proper server which gives alot more chance for expanding storage in the future.
 

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