Stuck between a Denon AVRX3300W or Yamaha RXA660

Xionn

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Hi all,

Looking for some advice, as I had my mind set on the Denon AVRX3300W until I was told how good the Yamaha RXA6600 is and some of the really good things about that AVR, RS staff were telling me to go for the Yamaha over the Denon for it's sound quality and reliability (plus a lot more reasons they went in detail with). I will be able to get either of the two I pick at the same price, so just need to think which to go for now.

Bit of a background on the situation, as you might have read my signature and wondered why on Earth i'm after a X3300W if I have a X2200W already...so, the setup in the signature is in the living room, and we have a spare room which I use just for console gaming in. I'm about to upgrade the TV to an LG E6 and because I'm using a Tannoy HTS 5.1 speaker system, I will need to upgrade the AVR so I get 4k/HDR support.

So, the original plan was to buy the X3300W, replace the X2200W with it in the living room and use the X2200W in the gaming room with the E6 and Tannoy HTS. But now I've been thrown a bit of a curve-ball with the Yamaha. One of the RS managers spent quite a long time telling me all about it, and how it compares to the X2200W which we currently have.

Unsure which I should pick now, I'm probably going to purchase tomorrow. Any advice would be much appreciated from those who have the AVRs or have upgraded recently etc. Seems like the Yamaha isn't getting as much love as it should online and Denon seems to be the popular choice.
 
The Denon does *seem* to be the better buy as it is rated as 105W into 8 ohms, 2 channels driven, compared to the Yamaha which is just 80W.

I have a Yamaha RXA810 which is quite slick to set up and use, and feature rich (for the time), but I was disappointed in the sound quality in my main room with my Kef iQ speakers, but is now in a second room, running less demanding speakers, and sounds really good.

Can you not listen to both at RS and see which you prefer? If you can, take your speakers with you!
 
Yup. Denon X3300 has the best Audussey XT32 room correction software, pre-outs for power amp, 2 Hdmi outputs, more power than Yamaha.. Yamaha A660 has the lowest of YPAO, which doesn`t eq the subwoofer under 31hz and may be even weaker than your X2200 MultEQ XT. Main competitor for X3300 is A860 model, but in the UK Yamaha has gone bad with the prices. If you look this review of A850 which is basically same as new A860; "The build quality might not be quite as good as the A850 but the X3200 has slightly more power and it's £150 cheaper - making the Denon a very tough act to follow."
Yamaha RX-A850 7.2 AV Receiver Review

So if in theory A860 can`t follow Denon X3300, how the heck A660 would?o_O

I don`t mean to bash Yamaha, i own one and have owned before. RS guy was right reliability is great even for the lower RX-V line (my old one is over 10y old and still rocking at my friends house). But Denon has 3 year warranty and usually people will change around 5years or so, i would be very suprised if Denon won`t last that long. I think RS is in deep s*it with Yamaha avr`s cause they won`t sell them well (bad pricing). They have Yamahas warehouse full. They need to sell them one way or another. This wasn`t first time i hear RS says Yamaha is better. :rolleyes: I would never ask advice if i would be buying something from these kind of electronic supermarkets.

A660 is more of a budget avr, X3300 offers so much more. This isn`t even a competition.
 
Forgot to mention that if Denon X3300 sits at 600£, there is one open box Marantz SR-6011 which is basically same as X3300, but is 9ch model. So maybe in future if you are intrested in 5.1.4 .. Price is only 635£. :eek: Full warranty etc. 699£ new.
MARANTZ SR6011 SL A/V RCVR (Opened box) - Superfi

And a little off-topic.. To give an idea what they cost in US/Scandinavia; X3300 - 999$ / 900€, SR6011 - 1399$ /1399€ . So you would get new SR6011 at 635£=750€ vs here 1399€. :facepalm: Unbelievable! :mad:
 
Retailers are not left with stockpiles of Yamaha receivers so they tend not to be as heavilly discounted as the other models which is only done to clear stock. Yamaha Adventage models from the RXA8xx models upward tend to hold their prices and you're lucky if you can still find one soon after they;ve been discontinued. You do get the occasional bargain, but such deals are very short lived as stocks dwindle far quicker than other manufacturers models.

As you mentioned, Yamaha models are considerably better built and use premium grade components. My Denon AV receiver was the only model I've ever come across that bucked its entire chassis whilst in transit. The thing looked like it had been twisted in the middle. Even if I wanted to do this then I'd be hard pushed to achieve it if purposefully trying to with a Yamaha receiver. Even the flagship Denon model uses the same cheap plastic volume dial used on their cheapest model.

I suppose it also has to be said that you don't see anywhere near as many issues reported concerning the Yamaha models as the issues now appearing relating to models made by D&M.

DEnon's pricing in the USA has always been higher and I think it merely reflects the way DEnon portray their products there. You're not getting a bargain here, the Americans are simply being overcharged in the USA.
 
I have a Yamaha RXA810 which is quite slick to set up and use, and feature rich (for the time), but I was disappointed in the sound quality in my main room with my Kef iQ speakers, but is now in a second room, running less demanding speakers, and sounds really good.

Can you not listen to both at RS and see which you prefer? If you can, take your speakers with you!

So if in theory A860 can`t follow Denon X3300, how the heck A660 would?o_O

I thank you both very much for your replies, and have made me stick with my gut instinct of going with the Denon over the Yamaha, there are also a few things I prefer in the Denon over the Yamaha anyway. I don't think I'd want the hassle of disconnecting my speaker setup and taking them in, but they do have the Monitor Audio Bronze range there, could listen to what they are like, but not sure if I want to waste too much time with that.

Yeah, I only mentioned the Denon X3300W (which is at £599) and straight away got pointed to the Yamaha, and why don't I go for that instead, and said I can have it for the same price of £599 (instead of £699 which it is currently at). I found a lack of rave reviews for the Yamaha compared to the Denon to make my mind up properly. The Audussey XT32 in the Denon is what made me want to use that one for the living room setup, and have the X2200W move into the smaller room which is just for gaming (and I'll have my 4k/HDR support).

I'm glad I didn't make my mind up on the spot today then and went away with the quotes to have a think, as I prefer to have a good read around / ask on avforums before I go ahead with something like this.
 
As you mentioned, Yamaha models are considerably better built and use premium grade components. My Denon AV receiver was the only model I've ever come across that bucked its entire chassis whilst in transit. The thing looked like it had been twisted in the middle. Even if I wanted to do this then I'd be hard pushed to achieve it if purposefully trying to with a Yamaha receiver. Even the flagship Denon model uses the same cheap plastic volume dial used on their cheapest model.

I suppose it also has to be said that you don't see anywhere near as many issues reported concerning the Yamaha models as the issues now appearing relating to models made by D&M.

Thanks for your reply dante01, have always enjoyed reading your input around these boards :). It was mentioned how the Yamaha models have seen less issues. My Denon AVRX2200W is running without any problems now, but when I first got it home, I wired everything up, went to do a firmware update, heard a click and the whole unit shutdown. I couldn't start it back up again at all, wasn't a good start for my first Denon AVR. RS replaced it the same day and now this one is fine. I looked at the Yamaha in store and was impressed with it's simplicity, built quality, "5th foot" and size. The Denon has lured me in mainly for its Audssey XT32 though.

In the living room we mainly use SkyQ to watch many TV shows in the evenings, films, Netflix and only the odd Blu-ray on the Xbox One S but not often. So wanted an AVR which really made good use of the Monitor Audio Bronze range for what we use them for. I've never had a Yamaha AVR though, it's only been Sony STR-DH820 and now the Denon AVRX2200W so far.
 
I should say that I had to return 2 Yamaha RXA1050 AV receivers in quick succession, but the retailer couldn't work out why they wouldn't function for me. The third one was fine and is my current receiver. I've a Denon AVR3313 in another room.
 
I should say that I had to return 2 Yamaha RXA1050 AV receivers in quick succession, but the retailer couldn't work out why they wouldn't function for me. The third one was fine and is my current receiver. I've a Denon AVR3313 in another room.

Interesting, I guess every bit of hardware has the chance of faults occurring :). So would you advise me to go with the X3300W over the RXA660 then too? Think I'm just going to go ahead with a deal tomorrow, and have my mind set on the LG E6 as my gaming TV upgrade to (but the X3300W if bought will be with the JS9500 and Monitor Audio Bronze setup in the living room).
 
Build quality and parts used don't seem to be as good on Denon models as some other manufacturers, that goes for their blu ray players as well. However value for money and the way they sound Denon is pretty hard to beat.
 
Build quality and parts used don't seem to be as good on Denon models as some other manufacturers, that goes for their blu ray players as well. However value for money and the way they sound Denon is pretty hard to beat.

I think I'm most concerned about setup (really impressed with the Denon UI and Audssey setup) and sound, especially as once the Denon AVR is all hooked up, it stays in the bottom open slot of the cabinet under the mounted TV and just stays there, I never even use any buttons or dials on the front.
 
The current Denons are very easy to set up. Audyssey XT32 did a good job on EQing my room and apart from a little adjustment for my KEF R50 Atmos modules I don't bother tinkering with it. The Denons do get a bit hot unless you use the power saving mode, so they need room to breath.
 
The current Denons are very easy to set up. Audyssey XT32 did a good job on EQing my room and apart from a little adjustment for my KEF R50 Atmos modules I don't bother tinkering with it. The Denons do get a bit hot unless you use the power saving mode, so they need room to breath.

Yeah the store manager in RS did mention the heat in the Denon compared to the Yamaha. To be honest, we only watch stuff in the evenings anyway for 2-3 hours max, and more at weekends. So not really used during the day on weekdays.

So the options are:
1) Have the X3300W in the living room (with MA Bronze) and the X2200W in the gaming room (with Tannoy HTS).
2) Have the RXA660 in the gaming room (with Tannoy HTS) and keep the X2200W in the living room (with MA Bronze).
3) Have the RXA660 in the living room (with MA Bronze) and the X2200W in the gaming room (with Tannoy HTS).
 
Denon offers better performance, more features and power. Yamaha will sound a bit better with MA speakers, however, there might not be enough power depending on the size of the living room.

I always find them, specifications from manufacturers confusing. Just tell us what the power supply in the receiver is rated at, no imaginary numbers @4 ohm 1ch driven....

Sorry got off topic there, just get whichever one is cheaper they both are great amps, and save yourself some money and calibrate your E6 instead :)
 
1) or 35£ more to get 9.2 Marantz SR6011 (open box full warranty) which would be epic for future. Cause you just never know if 5.2.4 Atmos/DTS:X is what you want later on.

AVForums reviewer Phil Hinton mentioned Yamaha RX-A1060 would be X3300 nearest competitor, so A660 is kinda far away.
Denon AVR-X3300W 7.2 Channel AV Receiver Review

And i have a hard time believing Bronzes would sound better with A660. It has been measured and showed at AVSForum that XT32 is quite much better than basic YPAO. If i remember right X3200 had 600w psu, and x2200 500w. X3300 is about 6pounds heavier than Yamaha A660. Denon should get the new smarthphone Audussey app later, you can tweak the XT32 even more with it. Costs ~20€ extra.

The sales should start around may-june(?) when the new models come out (X3400 etc), so keep in mind that prices will drop.
 
Interesting, I guess every bit of hardware has the chance of faults occurring :). So would you advise me to go with the X3300W over the RXA660 then too? Think I'm just going to go ahead with a deal tomorrow, and have my mind set on the LG E6 as my gaming TV upgrade to (but the X3300W if bought will be with the JS9500 and Monitor Audio Bronze setup in the living room).

I think the lower tier Adventage models are a little over priced and don't really differ that much from the RXV models below them. You only really start to benefit from the Adventage models if going with one of the models above the RXA8xx. The AVRX3300 does offer you better value for money, but will not be as well built. I guess you'd have to go audition them to make your own mind up though.

Do not base your decision upon the room EQ correction. This is only important if needed. If your room doesn't need it then why purchase a receiver based upon what form of room EQ is employed? Room EQ correction doesn't improve a receiver's audio performance, it simply addresses issues with your room's acoustics. I replaced a Yamaha RXA2065 with my Denon AVRX3313 which has the same MultEQ XT room correction you'll get with the AVRX3300. The Yamaha still sound better depite using parametric EQ.
 
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Do not base your decision upon the room EQ correction. This is only important if needed. If your room doesn't need it then why purchase a receiver based upon what form of room EQ is employed? Room EQ correction doesn't improve a receiver's audio performance, it simply addresses issues with your room's acoustics. I replaced a Yamaha RXA2065 with my Denon AVRX3313 which has the same MultEQ XT room correction you'll get with the AVRX3300. The Yamaha still sound better depite using parametric EQ.

Hmm that's interesting. Well the living room is a long rectangular shaped room with the TV and speakers in th middle of the long wall, and seating position not too far away. The long sofas are against the back wall (so can't have rears) and the two side channels are at either end of the room (quite far apart due to the room layout). Sorry I'm at work so don't have any measurements.

I'm concluding from all the replies that if I was to go for a Yamaha I'd at least want on of the higher models, which are a lot more expensive. I know it's quite a small thing but I do like how the Denon has a lot more HDMI ports, the easy access front HDMI port, the labelled HDMI ports and remote (easy for my parents to switch between Sat and Game or Bou-ray etc) and much nicer looking UI.

Gasp3621, I think that Marantz might be a bit overkill too :) and we will never have a second sub due to space and can't have any rear speakers either. Tried an entry level up firing Atmos speakers and wasn't that impressed so sold them (didn't see much benefit in normal listening with what we usually watch on SkyQ / Netflix either and would rarely watch any Atmos Blu-ray discs).
 
Given your requirements then I'd maybe suggest the Denon as being your best option. The Yamaha remote is a pain and the Denon's inputs are better layed out. I'm partially sighted and have to dig out a magnifying glass on occasions to find certain buttons on the Yamaha's remote. I would however suggest you use banana plugs for the speaker connections though because I've read reports that the screw down caps on the Denon's binding posts are both difficult to screw down and prone to coming loose.
 
I think the lower tier Adventage models are a little over priced and don't really differ that much from the RXV models below them. You only really start to benefit from the Adventage models if going with one of the models above the RXA8xx. The AVRX3300 does offer you better value for money, but will not be as well built. I guess you'd have to go audition them to make your own mind up though.

Do not base your decision upon the room EQ correction. This is only important if needed. If your room doesn't need it then why purchase a receiver based upon what form of room EQ is employed? Room EQ correction doesn't improve a receiver's audio performance, it simply addresses issues with your room's acoustics. I replaced a Yamaha RXA2065 with my Denon AVRX3313 which has the same MultEQ XT room correction you'll get with the AVRX3300. The Yamaha still sound better depite using parametric EQ.

Wrong. X3300 has MultEQ XT32 which is in every way superior to XT.

multeq-flavors-edit_400785.jpg


AVR-X3300W | Powerful 7 channel AV receiver with WiFi, Bluetooth and 3D Sound | Denon
 
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XT32 may be very helpful with the subwoofer if one have to put it in corner and it will sound boomy there. It will eq the sub down to 10hz and has much more filters than XT.

This is Q&A with Ed Mullen of SVS ;

S&V: Any other recommendations on subwoofer placement you’d like to share?

EM: Corner placement excites all possible room modes. The more modes you’re exciting, the less potential there is for a gaping hole in the frequency response—i.e., a null. To the extent corner placement creates peaks in the response, they can be fixed by auto setup, if the auto setup EQs the sub channel. If you look at Audyssey MultEQ XT32, it has hundreds of correction points in the subwoofer channel, so you can shoot for corner placement, excite all modes, minimize the potential for nulls and let XT32 kill the peaks.
 
Well thanks a lot once again all for your help, I went with what I had my mind set on initially and got the AVRX3300 today! I'll see if I notice any obvious difference between that and the X2200 too with normal TV viewing. The X2200 will be used in the smaller room ready for when the E6 arrives :D.
 

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