Speaker advice for a dedicated home cinema in progress

Deesnutz

Active Member
Hello fellow forum members,

Having been an avid follower of many of the build threads for years, i am getting closer to joining that exclusive club myself.

With work well underway with our extension, i am looking for some advice on the potential speaker configuration and layout for our cinema room.

I have created an equipment wish list but have not yet set a firm budget, as most of our costs are being absorbed with the build currently. For that reason, we want to ensure that everything is in place in terms of infrastructure: cabling, power etc., as we may need to revisit the installation part next year, if we need to raise more funds.

The space is just off from the soon-to-be extended kitchen and the internal measurements are approx.: 2500 x 6000 x 2400 (W x L x H)

Layout 2.jpg


There are some alterations to the original plan attached. The door into the kitchen will be a pocket door, with the wall slightly inset. The back door into the garden is actually a patio door. We have also incorporated a small riser into the design to enable 2 rows of seating. We are detached and far way enough from our neighbours, that i am not too concerned over sound leakage, other than to my daughter's bedroom above.

Initially, we thought about a discrete 7.1.4 configuration, (marked approx. in red minus sub) so would prefer in-walls/ceilings, a celling mounted projector with an ATS (on the right hand wall opposite the patio door), with LCRs behind it. I also want to run a small bulk head around the perimeter so i can hide the speaker cables.
After a visit to a demo room near us, it was suggested, due to the size of the room, it would be better to go for 5.1 for the base layer.

Following last week's podcast concerning speakers, i had a slight change of thought. From the conversation, I interpreted that, if you can accommodate 7.1 for the base layer, that this would provide a better experience when it comes to immersive audio?

Personally, i am not sure there is enough space on the wall where the pocket door is planned. I'm also concerned about the space available for the ceiling speakers, as the pipework and cabling starts to go in.

Despite this, do you think we could accommodate this 7.1 layout?

I would love to hear everyone's thoughts and suggestions.

Thanks
 

The Dreamer

Distinguished Member
I would absolutely go for 7 base layer speakers.

We have two rows in our room, and I put the side surrounds just behind the first row, as I was concerned that having them directly abeam those seats would be too close to the seats. It does mean they’re a little far forward for the back row, but it’s fine.

It‘s worked well enough for the last couple of years or so - and I’ve just added Front Wides, so the spread is even better. It works really well through DSU, when all speakers are being utilised.

While pipework and stuff is going in, just attach bits of ribbon (material) where you plan to place your overheads and get the contractors to avoid those spots with wires etc. (Other than speaker cables obviously). Or do what I did, and build a false ceiling to house the speakers, and run your own speaker cables etc. within that.

HTH
 

PaulDavidThomas

Active Member
As we all, overtime upgrade our components. If you are studding out your room ( stud work with plasterboard over ), when you position your cables for your IW ( if you go that route ) speakers, try to get them at the mid point between the two studs, rather than close to the left or right one. That way, as you put bigger speakers in you won't be close to the studs, so the mechanism used to hold the IW into the plasterboard won't be hindered by the closeness of the studs.
 

Deesnutz

Active Member
You can accommodate a 7 channel base layer within your room.

In wall/ on wall speakers are the way to go.

I would also provision cabling for a second subwoofer.

[email protected]
Thanks for the reply, Rich. I went back to the same guys, who are suggesting all ceiling speakers for the surrounds, as we would be too close to the side surrounds at the back and we would have be at least a metre away from the rear surrounds.

They also mentioned going for 2 subs and suggested looking at RELs and utilise their High Level inputs to the front left and right speakers. To accommodate this, I have put a piece of guttering with a piece of string, behind the plasterboard in roughly the place below where we eventually want the LCRs to go.
 

Sloppy Bob

Distinguished Member
who are suggesting all ceiling speakers for the surrounds

So your surrounds are in the ceiling and your Atmos speakers are in the ceiling as well.

How do you differentiate the height so it's not all mixed up?

You really need your base 5/7 speakers to be at around ear level so your Atmos heights sound from a different location.
Your room is a bit narrow, but I don't see any reason why you can't have your surrounds at ear level nor why a "professional" installer would recommend what they have.
It's rare for a room to be perfect, that's why AVRs and Processors have room correction.
 

Deesnutz

Active Member
So your surrounds are in the ceiling and your Atmos speakers are in the ceiling as well.

How do you differentiate the height so it's not all mixed up?

You really need your base 5/7 speakers to be at around ear level so your Atmos heights sound from a different location.
Your room is a bit narrow, but I don't see any reason why you can't have your surrounds at ear level nor why a "professional" installer would recommend what they have.
It's rare for a room to be perfect, that's why AVRs and Processors have room correction.
Thanks for the reply.

A lot has happened since i created this post. (Not sure why i didn't see the replies immediately!)

I'm trying to remember if that was the rationale and I had wondered about the heights issue myself.

Part of the issue is there is very little space either side of the patio door to accommodate rears, once you take into account a thick, pair of curtains too.

The same with the side surrounds, in particular, the one where the pocket door is due to be located.

In the meantime, the builder has built a bulkhead around the ceiling now, to house any speakers plus I have cabled up to accommodate for both rear/ side surrounds and Atmos front/rear for now.
 

Yorkshire AV

Active Member
AVForums Sponsor
I thought you were creating wall studs (100mm) that could accommodate surround speakers etc as per a previous discussion we had?

I'd strongly recommend moving away from your 7 channel "in ceiling" - sound won't relate to the visuals. If you're spending the money on converting the room - do try and get your builder/designer to come up with other options. There's always a way!
 

Deesnutz

Active Member
How are you reducing sound transmission to the room upstairs?

Pocket door will be very difficult to soundproof I'd imagine?
Hi Harkon,

Soundproofing is a whole other rabbit hole I have found!

I've have not been able to go all out with proper treatments as such. There were many suggestions i mulled over, but, to keep things simple, due to time and budget constraints, I've tried to mitigate as much as i can.

In the ceiling, the builder has put additional acoustic rockwool in (i think it was at nearly 300mm??) sealed all gaps around the edges with expanding foam then boarded with acoustic plasterboard. I have then sealed all the joints further with AC50; we were meant to use this to attach the plasterboard to the stud but couldn't in the end.

As for upstairs, I am talking to the carpet fitter about what to do about, maybe add more mass before fitting any carpet.

As for the pocket door, I'm really not sure, if I'm honest, although their is time to consider this, as the full stud frame is not built yet, as its waiting the build out of the kitchen, which it will connect to eventually.

Side note: I have been following your own build thread with keen interest.
 

Seriously Ltd

Distinguished Member
AVForums Sponsor
Inwiuld
Thanks for the reply, Rich. I went back to the same guys, who are suggesting all ceiling speakers for the surrounds, as we would be too close to the side surrounds at the back and we would have be at least a metre away from the rear surrounds.

They also mentioned going for 2 subs and suggested looking at RELs and utilise their High Level inputs to the front left and right speakers. To accommodate this, I have put a piece of guttering with a piece of string, behind the plasterboard in roughly the place below where we eventually want the LCRs to go.
I would consider using a company that know what they are doing to be perfectly honest. Sorry to sound blunt.

You are investing your hard earned money into this project. We see this time and time again.

Please feel free to get in touch for some advice. Not chasing work under any circumstances as we are fully booked into next year but can advise.

[email protected]
 
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Jester1066

Well-known Member
would consider using a company that know what they are doing to be perfectly honest. Sorry to sound blunt.

You are investing your hard earned money into this project. We see this time and time again.
100% Agree here.

I've not got the space for a dedicated cinema room, but I do have a Very understanding partner - who (I think!) shares my passion for AV. As a result I've managed to achieve my 5.2.4 setup in our living room.

As part of this process I'm currently working closely with a local carpenter. We have designed and built a custom cabinet. Throughout this (ongoing) process, the carpenter has accomodated most of my requests.

If you're investing your hard earned cash, I'd be wanting to get the basics right. Especially in a dedicated room. 😊
 

Deesnutz

Active Member
100% Agree here.

I've not got the space for a dedicated cinema room, but I do have a Very understanding partner - who (I think!) shares my passion for AV. As a result I've managed to achieve my 5.2.4 setup in our living room.

As part of this process I'm currently working closely with a local carpenter. We have designed and built a custom cabinet. Throughout this (ongoing) process, the carpenter has accomodated most of my requests.

If you're investing your hard earned cash, I'd be wanting to get the basics right. Especially in a dedicated room. 😊
Thanks. I have a very understanding wife and this has been both of our dreams for a long time.
 

Deesnutz

Active Member
Inwiuld

I would consider using a company that know what they are doing to be perfectly honest. Sorry to sound blunt.

You are investing your hard earned money into this project. We see this time and time again.

Please feel free to get in touch for some advise. Not chasing work under any circumstances as we are fully booked into next year but can advise.

[email protected]
Thanks. I will certainly consider it, Rich.
 

Harkon321

Well-known Member
I'd definitely take some advice from Rich if he's offering. This is his bread and butter.

If you are already boarded downstairs then adding an additional layer of PB, before skim, would be a lot easier than anything the carpet guys can do upstairs.
 

Triggaaar

Distinguished Member
If you are already boarded downstairs then adding an additional layer of PB, before skim, would be a lot easier than anything the carpet guys can do upstairs.
Agreed. Stop the sound leaving the room, don't try and stop it afterwards.

He could also add green glue or tecsound before a layer of pb, if he wants a better result.

Do not cut holes in your new soundproofed layer.

Do not put the surrounds in the ceiling. 3 front speakers and 2 surrounds is enough if space is an issue.
 

Harkon321

Well-known Member
Not sure I'd bother with Green Glue if it's not an isolated ceiling. (We've had that discussion before though :) ) Tecsound maybe, if joists can take the additional weight of both.
 

Triggaaar

Distinguished Member
Not sure I'd bother with Green Glue if it's not an isolated ceiling. (We've had that discussion before though :) )
Have we? Green glue dampens the sound transfer between one layer and the next - what difference does it make whether or not it's isolated (obviously isolation helps independently from the use of gg).
 

Harkon321

Well-known Member
Advice I read was that, although they do entirely different things, that Green Glue wasn’t a cost effective route if you weren’t isolating with clips or independent joists.

I still used it on my ceiling, even though my joists were completely decoupled.

I believe the same can be said for doing triple drywall as opposed to double drywall and green glue. Its quite an expensive thing to add so I think a lot skip it. Decoupled Mass is definitely king though.
 

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