Question Sound proofing problematic party wall

CR79

Novice Member
Hi all, looking for some advice as to whether people reckon there's anything can be done that would improve the noise transmission between a party wall in my flat.

If my neighbours are talking loudly or playing music, the noise carries through the wall (particularly low frequencies). Even if they're not been overly loud, the transmitted noise is still irritating, to the point I usually give up on watching TV and go through to my bedroom. I'm sure it's the same for them if I'm ever playing music or a movie with loud explosions etc.

The trouble is space to do anything...as you can see from the pictures. I only have a gap of about 18mm between the wall and the door from that leads into my living room. I also have a couple of electrical outlets, radiator and a phone point on this wall.

I have read a bit about green glue, and reckon there might just be enough of a gap between the frame and the wall to get an extra sheet of drywall with green glue on it applied to the wall..although the skirting could be an issue?

Anyone have experience of green glue to know if it would make any noticeable difference? And would I need to lose the electric/phone outlets on the wall?

Any thoughts appreciated. Thanks.
 

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Peter Parker

Distinguished Member
Another layer of PB with GG will help, but to what degree I couldn't say unfortunately. This link may help a little:

How to Soundproof a Wall - Soundproofing Materials for Walls

The outlets and phone line can remain - they will have to be disconnected and holes cut in the PB where the sockets are. All you will need is longer screws to re-attach them.

If you measure where the sockets are on the wall and note it down, remove the circuit fuse or trip the breaker first, and use a meter to make sure it's dead (or plug something in and see it working, then see it doesn't work after making the cct dead) then remove the sockets. Make sure all the wires are insulated and placed into the sockets. Fit the PB onto the wall, and then using the measurements, you can carefully cut into the PB (avoiding the wiring in the box) and use the box itself as a guide to cut the PB to the same shape. Then reconnect the wires and refit the sockets. You'll need a special tool for the telephone wiring unless you're adept with using a small screwdriver. The tool makes it easier and less likely to damage the terminals or wiring.

Gary
 

CR79

Novice Member
Another layer of PB with GG will help, but to what degree I couldn't say unfortunately. This link may help a little:

How to Soundproof a Wall - Soundproofing Materials for Walls

The outlets and phone line can remain - they will have to be disconnected and holes cut in the PB where the sockets are. All you will need is longer screws to re-attach them.

If you measure where the sockets are on the wall and note it down, remove the circuit fuse or trip the breaker first, and use a meter to make sure it's dead (or plug something in and see it working, then see it doesn't work after making the cct dead) then remove the sockets. Make sure all the wires are insulated and placed into the sockets. Fit the PB onto the wall, and then using the measurements, you can carefully cut into the PB (avoiding the wiring in the box) and use the box itself as a guide to cut the PB to the same shape. Then reconnect the wires and refit the sockets. You'll need a special tool for the telephone wiring unless you're adept with using a small screwdriver. The tool makes it easier and less likely to damage the terminals or wiring.

Gary

Thanks for your reply, very helpful. With the skirting at the bottom of the wall, do you think this needs to be hauled off so that the new layer of drywall with GG goes right to the bottom of the wall?
 

Peter Parker

Distinguished Member
Oops yes, I meant to mention that - if you want to re-use it, carefully take it off before fitting the PB, but if it gets damaged or looks rough, you can replace it with new quite cheaply. Do the same with the coving if you have any fitted.

Seal the edges under the pb with silicon rubber before fitting the skirting board, and maybe even seal that where it meets the floorboards.

Gary
 

CR79

Novice Member
No coving thankfully.

So the plasterboard should have silicon rubber at any edges where it meets the ceiling, side walls, and floor, plus rubber seal on the bottom of the skirting board where it touches the floor...is this correct?
 

CR79

Novice Member
Would the gaps caused by the electrical fittings and radiator fitting not create a sound leak?
 

Peter Parker

Distinguished Member
Yes they do, but I don't think there's much you can do about those unless you want to remove them and their wiring, and fill in the holes they leave behind - I assumed you wanted to keep them but I see now you were asking more from a soundproofing perspective rather than from usage. Having connections under the floor that aren't easily accessible isn't always a good idea (but often happens), so you could always surface mount them afterwards if you decided to remove them from the wall and keep them.

The radiator is just screwed to the wall (I assume it's all brick?) and you should be able to still connect it all up OK despite it being about 15mm further into the room, but if you want to insulate under the floor as well, you can remove the floorboards and stuff some rockwool under there. Siliconing around the pipes as they come up from the floor may be beneficial if you can't.

It's tricky and full of compromises when you're limited in what you can do as you are, so you just have to do the best you can with what you have.

Gary
 

CR79

Novice Member
Ideally would want to keep them yeah, but if it's going to make a noticeable difference to the noise coming through I would consider getting rid of them. Thanks for the advice.
 

Plasma Dan

Well-known Member
The trouble is space to do anything...as you can see from the pictures. I only have a gap of about 18mm between the wall and the door from that leads into my living room.

One layer of 15mm acoustic plasterboard with green glue should make a notable difference, and should just fit behind the architrave on the door-casing. :smashin:

15mm acoustic plasterboard: Knauf Sound Panel Tapered Edge 15mm x 1200mm x 2400mm | Travis Perkins

Green glue (box of 12): Green Glue - Box of 12 - Revolutionary Sound Proofing

So the plasterboard should have silicon rubber at any edges where it meets the ceiling, side walls, and floor, plus rubber seal on the bottom of the skirting board where it touches the floor...is this correct?

Use acoustic sealant rather than silicone, it's probably cheaper anyway since it comes in 900ml jumbo tubes (you will need a jumbo sized gun). Try to keep the plasterboard from touching the floor / ceiling / adjoining walls, leave about 5mm gap all around. Use acoustic sealant to seal those gaps. You should also seal between the plasterboard sheets. :smashin:

Acoustic sealant (900ml): AC50 Trade Acoustic Sealant & Adhesive 900ml - Toolstation

900ml gun: Rotating Sealant Gun 900ml - Toolstation

Would the gaps caused by the electrical fittings and radiator fitting not create a sound leak?

For the sake of one socket, and a phone outlet... As Gary said, just remove them. You could surface-mount them onto the plasterboard to avoid having to cut around the back-boxes (if you don't mind them sticking-out from the wall like that). :suicide:

The radiator shouldn't be a big problem, it's obviously a lot of messing about to move the radiator to another wall, so I would just make-do.

Dan.
 

mojogoes

Remembered (1961-2016)
Can you do a test to determine how big the gap is in the wall , If there is a 50mm plus gap you could use some knauf RS200 which is very dense and would stop a lot of what you have described.

P.S It comes in 1200mm x 600mm x 50mm to a 140mm thicknesses.
 

mojogoes

Remembered (1961-2016)
The gap behind the plasterboards on the party wall or are you thinking of putting up some acoustic boards to your existing plasterboard on the party wall.
 

CR79

Novice Member
Yeah it would be over the existing plasterboard, I'm not up for pulling down what is already there.
 

mojogoes

Remembered (1961-2016)
Is the door you enter the room right in the corner on the party wall or in another location.
 

mojogoes

Remembered (1961-2016)
https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwjX7K_0_7XJAhVJExoKHaGpBjkQFggdMAA&url=http://www.ecophon.com/uk/products/Vertical-applications/Akusto/Akusto--Wall-C/&usg=AFQjCNEBAkgMwEl-odQFxEhEiPfJZuug-g&bvm=bv.108194040,d.ZWU

This is one of the best acoustic panels on the market , but if you click onto the "Acoustic" dropdown and look at the link and the chart(s) below you will see that at 125hz it only absorbs around 0.20 25% and probably much less further down the frequency bandwidth.

This is with a panel of some 43mm thick and i believe that it was the bass region/s that you wanted the most performance at / from.


P.S Which product / board are you thinking of using to lay over the top of your existing plasterboard/s.
 

CR79

Novice Member
Is the door you enter the room right in the corner on the party wall or in another location.

Yes it is in the corner on the party wall. This is it from the otherside of the door, looking through from the hallway.

(sorry pic in next post)
 
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CR79

Novice Member
https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwjX7K_0_7XJAhVJExoKHaGpBjkQFggdMAA&url=http://www.ecophon.com/uk/products/Vertical-applications/Akusto/Akusto--Wall-C/&usg=AFQjCNEBAkgMwEl-odQFxEhEiPfJZuug-g&bvm=bv.108194040,d.ZWU

This is one of the best acoustic panels on the market , but if you click onto the "Acoustic" dropdown and look at the link and the chart(s) below you will see that at 125hz it only absorbs around 0.20 25% and probably much less further down the frequency bandwidth.

This is with a panel of some 43mm thick and i believe that it was the bass region/s that you wanted the most performance at / from.

P.S Which product / board are you thinking of using to lay over the top of your existing plasterboard/s.

I was just thinking of standard sheets of plasterboard with green glue on it. Although the acoustic plasterboard mentioned above by Plasma Dan sounds a good option.

Unfortunately I only have 18mm to play with between the door frame and the wall.
 

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mojogoes

Remembered (1961-2016)
Then i very much doubt that it will give you the necessary soundproof performance your after! And imho a waste of time and money.
 

Plasma Dan

Well-known Member
Although the acoustic plasterboard mentioned above by Plasma Dan sounds a good option.

Then i very much doubt that it will give you the necessary soundproof performance your after! And imho a waste of time and money.

I wouldn't call it a waste of time or money. :censored:

I think given the space limitations this is best option, and will yield notable results. In-fact I think using expensive specialist boards would be the best way to waste money here, especially considering only one wall will be boarded. Seems like a waste trying so hard to block specific frequencies of sound, when a lot of the sound is going to flank the wall through the ceiling / floor / adjoining walls anyway. :thumbsdow

Dan.
 

mojogoes

Remembered (1961-2016)
Each to there own but the manufacturers acoustic data that is given with acoustic products is a given and must be taken into consideration , if you have a pretty efficient acoustic panel some 43mm thick which is measured at 0.20% effective at 125hz!! how effective do you really think a normal plasterboard sheet at some 18/20mm will be?
 

mojogoes

Remembered (1961-2016)
Each to there own but the manufacturers acoustic data that is given with acoustic products is a given and must be taken into consideration , if you have a pretty efficient acoustic panel some 43mm thick which is measured at 0.20% effective at 125hz!! how effective do you really think a normal plasterboard sheet at some 18/20mm will be?

At 43mm thick at this stage it would be much better and more cost effective to use a different type of product! which would yield much better acoustic effectiveness.............Apart from building another false wall which i doubt the op wants to do or fill the gap to the existing wall with dense rockwool? Then it aint going to improve much using plasterboard.
 

Plasma Dan

Well-known Member
if you have a pretty efficient acoustic panel some 43mm thick which is measured at 0.20% effective at 125hz!! how effective do you really think a normal plasterboard sheet at some 18/20mm will be?

Of-course more is better, but most people can't afford to lose that much space. You have to compromise somewhere. Besides, acoustic plasterboard is widely used and I can vouch for its effectiveness, especially when combined with green glue. :smashin:

At 43mm thick at this stage it would be much better and more cost effective to use a different type of product! which would yield much better acoustic effectiveness.............Apart from building another false wall which i doubt the op wants to do or fill the gap to the existing wall with dense rockwool? Then it aint going to improve much using plasterboard.

43mm is a lot space to lose. :censored: The op would need to remove the architrave to fit that, and as I've said, given only one wall is being boarded; it's just not practical or necessary.

I'm sure using that stuff would make a nice difference in a new sound studio, where all the walls & ceiling are boarded with it. :rolleyes: Personally, I stick to using resilient bar and two layers of acoustic plasterboard (like most people do). :suicide:


Why not use a bunch of vacuums? ...sound can't travel through a vacuum! :rotfl:

Riccar-Wall-Line-Up-806x393-copy_zps2opsrxo7.jpg~original


Acoustic plasterboard isn't a myth. :laugh:

Dan.
 
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mojogoes

Remembered (1961-2016)
The op not i was concerned with low sub frequencies and although i will agree with you that it is more effective higher up the frequency range! but its much less effective in the lower frequencies that's a given.

Yes and i know most people are not going to or wanting to start putting up rockwool stud walls or similar!! So i guess the best way to gauge weather your 18mm plasterboard has worked , is to play a film track and then to go around to your neighbours side and do a before and after..............But make sure you take around some ear defenders with you if your going to implement someones snake oil.:rolleyes::facepalm:
 

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