Sony VPL-HW30ES vs. VPL-VW90ES

Discussion in 'Projectors, Screens & Video Processors' started by ukaudiophile, Dec 29, 2011.

  1. ukaudiophile

    ukaudiophile
    Member

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2001
    Messages:
    452
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    31
    Location:
    Lancashire
    Ratings:
    +62
    Hello,

    I was wondering if anyone here has seen these two projectors and would care to pass comments on their comparative performance, especially with respect to their 2D performance?

    I am looking at these two projectors as a replacement for my loyal VPL-VW50 which has served me well over the last 4 1/2 years, but I feel the performance of the latest projectors is now so superior to that of the 50 that the time has come to upgrade.

    I am not that bothered by the 3D performance of these projectors though I know both projectors support active 3D. As someone who has to wear glasses I generally find active 3D shutter glasses uncomfortable, and from what I've seen recently the passive 3D system being promoted by LG (amongst others) currently out performs the active systems I've seen. I've discounted DLP as I am still troubled by rainbow effects, and for me the colours of DLP don't seem as natural as the SXRD system, likewise the DILA system is excellent, but it seems a touch softer than the Sony, hence the two projectors I've narrowed it down to.

    The 90 is an older model, but I can currently get it at the same price as the HW30ES even though it used to sell for nearly £5K, but the HW30ES is the newer design and uses the latest motionflow technology. So this comes down to a straight fight between these two projectors.

    If anyone would like to give me their htoughts and opinions on these two projectors then it would be greatly appreciated.

    Thanks and best wishes,

    Dave
     
  2. Ideal AV

    Ideal AV
    Distinguished Member AVForums Sponsor

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2011
    Messages:
    10,646
    Products Owned:
    2
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Location:
    Normanton
    Ratings:
    +5,967
    Hi Dave

    I have/had both the HW30 & the VW90 here in the demo room and in 2d it really is a close call, maybe the 90 being the better of the 2 machines, but its marginal

    for 3D the HW30 wins it by a country mile.

    we have a client who is wanting to upgrade his 90 to a 95 simply for better 3d performance, if you are interested i could pass his details on to you or put it in the classifieds.

    Allan @ Ideal AV
     
  3. NickEdin

    NickEdin
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2009
    Messages:
    316
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Location:
    Edinburgh
    Ratings:
    +76
    We too have seen both of these in our demonstration room and I disagree with Allan. In my experience the VW90 is greatly superior to the HW30 in 2d and it is the other way round for 3D. We have both of our units ISF Calibrated and run a 110" screen in a dark environment.
    Nick
     
  4. KelvinS1965

    KelvinS1965
    Distinguished Member

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2006
    Messages:
    16,836
    Products Owned:
    1
    Products Wanted:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Ratings:
    +7,499
    So what is the improvement of the '95 over '90? Is it just better 3D or did they do some other work on the 2D side of things?

    I think the only thing that puts me off the '90 or '95 is that you lose the iris step adjustments of the JVCs unless you're happy to lose the dynamic iris function. I haven't seen if there is a 'tweak' that allows the max brightness to be controlled to the same level as the JVCs can, with the dynamic function still working. Some of the run out offers on the '90 do look tempting.
     
  5. Ideal AV

    Ideal AV
    Distinguished Member AVForums Sponsor

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2011
    Messages:
    10,646
    Products Owned:
    2
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Location:
    Normanton
    Ratings:
    +5,967
    we agree Nick on 3d without question

    although I can`t honestly say the 90 "is greatly superior" really, yes its better but I feel not as much as you are suggesting (only my opinion), maybe calibrated in a dedicated room you will see the calibrated differences between the 2 machines but not in 99% of HC rooms which are usually dual purpose living/AV rooms and the pj`s not calibrated.

    Which is why I referred to it being marginally better which it is.

    Anyway Happy New Year to you

    Allan
     
  6. Ideal AV

    Ideal AV
    Distinguished Member AVForums Sponsor

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2011
    Messages:
    10,646
    Products Owned:
    2
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Location:
    Normanton
    Ratings:
    +5,967
    Hi Kelvin

    the 3d side of the 95 is really a great improvement than its outgoing brother the 90.

    The 90 in 2d was excellent and so is the 95, not sure how and what improvements they have made to the 2d side of things as its months since we`ve had a 90 in the demo room tbh.

    We did calibrate both the 30 and 95 when we had a little gathering here about 6 weeks ago and both machines were stunning, to us anyway, in 2d.

    I`m not 100% sure though the differences between them both will be seen in a typical non light controlled enviroment, but thats the same for any projector as you know.

    I`m adding to this when I say, at its price point, I firmly believe the VW95 is out on its own with nothing to match it.

    Phils review of it is excellent and it deserves the "Highly Recommeded" award its been given
     
    Last edited: Dec 30, 2011
  7. Crustyloafer

    Crustyloafer
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2003
    Messages:
    9,570
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    136
    Location:
    Edinburgh
    Ratings:
    +1,268
    That reads as a statement of fact, which it isn't. It is a statement about your opinion and nothing more.

    Anyone interested in this level of projector really owes it to themselves to get a personal demonstration at a qualified dealer/installer. Ideally if all of the projectors have been properly calibrated to the same standards (ISF ideally) then the potential buyer will be in the best position to make their own mind up and choose the projector that they prefer.

    Just my tuppence.

    Chris.
     
  8. ukaudiophile

    ukaudiophile
    Member

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2001
    Messages:
    452
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    31
    Location:
    Lancashire
    Ratings:
    +62
    Hello,

    First let me take the opportunity to thank everyone who has taken the time over the Holiday period to contribute, it is really helping me to crystallize my thoughts on this upgrade.

    I should have mentioned initially that the projector is being installed in a 100% light controlled, dedicated home theater / listening room, so it really is being put in an optimal environment.

    From what I have read, it would appear that the VPL-VW90ES is going to substantially better the performance of my VPL-VW50ES on regular 2D material, but the VPL-HW30ES is going to better the 90 on 3D material.

    I guess the only issue for me is whether the improvement in 2D performance of the VW90ES against the HW30 is worth sacrificing the 3D performance for, and the fact that I have found I can buy a HW30 for around £400 less than the VW90ES.

    Whilst I agree with Chris that it would be great to see these two projectors side by side, properly setup in a dedicated demo environment, on the Fylde coast and it's surroundings it is almost impossible to get a demonstration of a Sony video projector period, so I really do find I rely heavily on the advice of my fellow enthusiasts on this forum and on the AV Science forums, as I find the quality of the information to be second to none.

    Thanks and best wishes,

    David

    BTW, I'd like to wish everyone here a happy, healthy and peaceful 2012.
     
  9. NickEdin

    NickEdin
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2009
    Messages:
    316
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Location:
    Edinburgh
    Ratings:
    +76
    Hi David, the VW90 is a big step up from the 50 and with the environment you have the improvement will be immediate and distinct. If 3D is a key factor then the HW30 really is the one. The 90 is good but as soon as you see the 30 it makes it look broken. Our 90 sales ( with 3d consideration) stopped the instant we put the HW30 on display.
    If you are investing in a suitable replacement and intend to keep the unit for several years can you stretch to the VW95? It improves on the 90 in 2d, is superior to the 30 in 3D.

    Nick
     
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2011
  10. Ideal AV

    Ideal AV
    Distinguished Member AVForums Sponsor

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2011
    Messages:
    10,646
    Products Owned:
    2
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Location:
    Normanton
    Ratings:
    +5,967
    So does this comment

    This surely is an opinion and nothing more of yours and Nick.

    I am not disagreeing with this comment at all, I`m simply pointing out that once calibrated the 90 is/was marginally better than the 30, at this level or equipment nothing, to me anyway, is "greatly superior".

    Please define what you mean when you say "greatly superior".

    it may have better black levels, although i`m not to sure of that either room dependant, it may have better contrast ratio, it may have this and that, but what exactly has it got thats "greatly superior".

    So in short, its a comment which is your opinion and nothing more.

    Reading the spec of both machines they are quite similar, both use the same 200UHP lamp, both use the same lens, contrast ratio is 70,000 or 150,000 using DI, which is known to be not as effective as native.

    More important is ansi lumens, the HW30 having 1300lms compared to the VW90 having a lower 1000lms :lesson:

    Anyway this isn`t helping the OP is it

    he should get a demo of them both ideally in the same room at the time and he should make a decision based on his findings.

    just my two penneth

    Happy New Year

    Allan
     
  11. NickEdin

    NickEdin
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2009
    Messages:
    316
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Location:
    Edinburgh
    Ratings:
    +76
    Let's not go round and round on this Allan - many of your threads descend like this. Our sell through figures from demonstration give me a good indication of what projectors cut it and those that dont. Something is not "the best" because it sells a lot but it does say that the product is right for a majority.

    My advice to the OP is to get a fair demonstration and choose from there.

    Nick
     
  12. Ideal AV

    Ideal AV
    Distinguished Member AVForums Sponsor

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2011
    Messages:
    10,646
    Products Owned:
    2
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Location:
    Normanton
    Ratings:
    +5,967
    you are welcome David

    you will see the differences between the 2 machines in this sort of enviroment but I honestly feel David they won`t be too far apart once you have a proper calibration carried out by a professional ISF certified calibrator such as Piers Clerk who I can highly recommend.

    100% agree on this, certainly the latter

    Only you can decide this David, if it helps you I can show the HW30 and the VW95, both calibrated in a side by side shootout.

    If it was between the HW30 and a VW90, my money without question would be on the HW30, for me its 2d and 3d performance are very good and the fact that its a new model rather than a discontinued one would swing it its way.

    you have to see them side by side if that is possible, sorry only the 30 & 95 here as we tend to clear out old stock asap.

    being just across the yorks/lancs border we are probably your nearest Sony Accredited dealer so if we can be of help to you we will.

    cheers and a very happy new year to you as well

    Allan
     
  13. Ideal AV

    Ideal AV
    Distinguished Member AVForums Sponsor

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2011
    Messages:
    10,646
    Products Owned:
    2
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Location:
    Normanton
    Ratings:
    +5,967
    Nick

    its comments like "greatly superior" that provoke responces, and it was a comment of yours and not mine.

    My threads or posts are born from honest and truthfull advice all of which is backed up hopefully by providing a good and honest service to everyone who come here for a demo.

    I have to say, and this is the honest truth, my sales of the VW90 in total were 1, I didn`t feel that the machine was worthy of its price tag, especially for its 3d performance so removed it from my list of stocked items.

    If sales through figures after demonstration here at Ideal AV give a truer identification of the projectors performance then the HW30 and especially the VW95 must be excellent machines.

    Anyway we can agree not to go round and round on this as its pointless, but please don`t expect me to sit back and take it on the chin when you make a comment about a product which as yet you have not explained why you have made it.

    Allan
     
  14. ukaudiophile

    ukaudiophile
    Member

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2001
    Messages:
    452
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    31
    Location:
    Lancashire
    Ratings:
    +62
    Hello All,

    I first want to thank everyone who has contributed to this thread. Your thoughts and comments have been greatly appreciated.

    I have finally seen the VPL-HW30ES (though not calibrated) and, frankly, it looked sufficiently superior on 2D to more than justify it's purchase, then seeing it in 3D and finding it watchable (thought I only saw around 10 minutes of 3D, I don't know if I could view a 2 hr film with the active glasses), I finally decided that this was the projector to go with, and the price I've been offered the projector at was sufficiently good to push me to pull the trigger on the purchase of one of these projectors.

    I'm expecting delivery in the next 10 - 14 days, and have also splashed out on an Onkyo TX-NR809 AV receiver which is HDMI V1.4A compatible, and the price that Richer Sounds are doing these at makes it a really easy decision for me.

    Now all that remains is to upgrade the graphics card in my HTPC to a HDMI 1.4a, and I already have 3D BD playback software on my machine so hopefully I should be able to achieve 3D playback with the rest of my system.

    So once again thank you all for your input, I will report back once I have installed the new hardware and let you know how I'm finding it once it's all bedded in and I've got it setup.

    Best wishes,

    Dave
     
  15. Canary_Jules

    Canary_Jules
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2003
    Messages:
    3,417
    Products Owned:
    2
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    136
    Location:
    Leicester, UK
    Ratings:
    +1,006
    I'm actually considering upgrading from my JVC HD750 to the VW95ES at some point. I had the pleasure of professionally calibrating a VW30 recently and was mightily impressed by what I saw. I managed to get excellent calibration results and the client was extremely pleased with his new purchase. I could even have lived happily with the VW30 in my own home cinema - which is saying a lot for a £3K pj against my JVC HD750. I haven't seen the VW95 yet but from what I have read it offers still better 2D and at least comparable 3D performance to the VW30. Just need to sell my Sencore VP403c signal generator and I should have the money for the upgrade :)
     
  16. Ideal AV

    Ideal AV
    Distinguished Member AVForums Sponsor

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2011
    Messages:
    10,646
    Products Owned:
    2
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Location:
    Normanton
    Ratings:
    +5,967
    Hi Dave

    congratulations on your purchase, I`m sure you will be very pleased with both items

    Jules

    I echo what you are saying with regards to the HW30 and I know if you ever get chance to see the VW95 you certainly won`t be disappointed either.

    Allan :smashin:
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2012
  17. Canary_Jules

    Canary_Jules
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2003
    Messages:
    3,417
    Products Owned:
    2
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    136
    Location:
    Leicester, UK
    Ratings:
    +1,006
    Thanks Allan :) I can see why the VW95 would be selling very well at the moment. I've not had the honour to calibrate at VW95 yet but from the extensive reading I've done it puts out an image that competes with the X70 but is significantly cheaper.
     
  18. Ideal AV

    Ideal AV
    Distinguished Member AVForums Sponsor

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2011
    Messages:
    10,646
    Products Owned:
    2
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Location:
    Normanton
    Ratings:
    +5,967
    if you want to come and calibrate ours your welcome :D Jules
     
  19. abs

    abs
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 30, 2002
    Messages:
    4,824
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Ratings:
    +238
    I can concur with Allan regarding the vw95. Firstly Allan, both my wife and I would like to thank you for your hospitality when I visited you last week at your beautiful home. We were overwhelmed by your place and your kindness, you really made us both welcome in your home and frankly couldn't do enough for us. You are a true gentleman and a testament to your trade. I would recommend anyone to go and visit Allan for themselves and be prepared to be blown away. His demo rooms were the best I have ever seen and the equipment he had on offer was suited for all budgets. There was no pressure to buy anything and like myself he had a passion for home cinema. We were talking about Allan and his place for days afterwards to all my friends.

    Right back to the 95. Allan initially showed me the Epson 9000 and the Sony hw30. Both very good in their own right but I think the Sony clinched it for both of us. The Epson was brighter on 3d but the Sony produced a better 3d image with more obvious depth to the picture something we both noticed. The picture looked sharper on the Sony as well. If I had to choose between the 2 it would have been the Sony.

    Allan had a brand new sealed vw95 that he kindly unpacked but warned me that the 95 would be in another league compared to the other 2, I hoped he was lying. How wrong was I. He fired up the 95 and played the same 3d scenes from Avatar. I remember looking over to my wife and her looking back at me. We knew instantly that there was a big difference in PQ compared to the 30 and 9000. The picture was so much sharper and blacks were inky black. The 2d was amazing and and the 3d excellent with no crosstalk that I could see. I had the optoma 33 before and thought that was excellent but it couldn't reproduce the punchy vibrant picture the 95 produced.


    I have short listed the 95 as a future purchase. Thanks again Allan.
     
  20. Canary_Jules

    Canary_Jules
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2003
    Messages:
    3,417
    Products Owned:
    2
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    136
    Location:
    Leicester, UK
    Ratings:
    +1,006
    You know, that's not a bad idea :)
     
  21. Apone

    Apone
    Member

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2002
    Messages:
    1,701
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    86
    Ratings:
    +320
    Dave

    Congrats on your purchase.

    I've seen the Sony 30 and 95 side by side after having performed a quick calibration on both machines.

    I was very surprised as to just how good the Sony 30 was when compared to the 95. The 95 was the better machine out of the two but then at £2000 more than the Sony 30 it should be.

    You have purchased an excellent projector so have fun when you get it:thumbsup:
     
  22. hifix

    hifix
    Distinguished Member AVForums Sponsor

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2006
    Messages:
    12,279
    Products Owned:
    2
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Location:
    Coventry, West Midlands
    Ratings:
    +2,419
    The VW95 is something pretty special at the moment, and I really think that it's THE projector to beat, regardless of price. I've seen some PJ's look much better, but they've been 5/6 times the price of the Sony, so as far as value inform money is concerned, it's top dog at the moment. It's the PJ that I hope to change my Mitsu HC7000 for. But then again, I'm seeing the Sony VW1000 on Monday, so that might change things!!
     
  23. ShanePJ

    ShanePJ
    Well-known Member AVForums Sponsor

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2006
    Messages:
    2,247
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    116
    Location:
    Unit 5 The Sidings, Bacup, Lancs, OL13 9RW
    Ratings:
    +565
    You'll love the Sony VW1000ES, I viewed yesterday and it's upscaling ability is breath-taking. If you have an old DVD copy of Lord of the Ring (fellow ship of the ring) knocking about, then the two opening chapters are remarkable. Look at the ledge on the battle scene. I've never seen this defined so well on DVD. Also the second chapter with gandalf face, ask someone to come in and view that paused image and tell them it's blu-ray, I bet they agree that it's excellent on FHD. Then give them the shocker that's it's only DVD!

    Believe or not though, the pre-production model will not out perform the black levels of your trusty Mitsubishi HC7000. But that's always the way with pre-production models.

    I bet you love it!

    Nick (The Home Cinema Centre), your going to be a lucky chappy having one of these on demo! Are you taking it home for testing purposes of course? I sure the answer is yes! :smashin:
    Regards, Shane.

    Regards, Shane.
     
  24. NickEdin

    NickEdin
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2009
    Messages:
    316
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Location:
    Edinburgh
    Ratings:
    +76
    @Shane - I may well have to do that. I agree with you about the vw1000 - we had it here today ahead of the stock model and it is remarkable. If anything it is the most engaging image I have seen, you dont get caught up in the detail or the image just the film.

    It is a real step up from the 95 and far more than I was expecting. We watched all the usual clips but Singing in the Rain on DVD was the film that sold it to me.

    Nick
     
  25. abs

    abs
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 30, 2002
    Messages:
    4,824
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Ratings:
    +238
    £10k better than the 95?
     
  26. Apone

    Apone
    Member

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2002
    Messages:
    1,701
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    86
    Ratings:
    +320
    The Sony VW1000 is a very special projector.

    Things will only get better for projector fans when the second generation of 4K projectors come out and i'm guessing that the next 4K model Sony bring out will be smaller and lighter as well.

    The paused image I saw on the 1000 (at the forum event) also looked good. When the movie got going, the difference was less noticeable but it was a vey engaging image - just much was certain:thumbsup:

    For the price, the Sony 95 is a winner in my book.
     
  27. NickEdin

    NickEdin
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2009
    Messages:
    316
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Location:
    Edinburgh
    Ratings:
    +76
    Yes I would think so. It depends on the rest of the cinema as to the merit of that investment but I am confident it represents a big enough jump for the money to have one on display. Is the Lumis 3DS worth another £10k is a better question IMO.
     
  28. hifix

    hifix
    Distinguished Member AVForums Sponsor

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2006
    Messages:
    12,279
    Products Owned:
    2
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Location:
    Coventry, West Midlands
    Ratings:
    +2,419
    If I'm honest about it, I don't really want to see it! I'm almost to the point where my HC7000 needs a new bulb (3,600+ hours) as my black level is almost shot. It's still been the sharpest looking PJ to me, and the VW95 is it's equal in this respect, but with a much brighter image.

    I'll grab a DVD or two on Monday just to see how SD looks - I have to be honest, I'm taking what you say with a pinch of salt, as compression on DVD is pretty bad, and no amount of upscaling can make up for that! It's not so much close ups, its backgrounds and distance shots that are the biggest issue - there's just not enough storage space on DVD to cope with the amount of detail needed for a cityscape, or a vast forest. We'll see :)
     
  29. ShanePJ

    ShanePJ
    Well-known Member AVForums Sponsor

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2006
    Messages:
    2,247
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    116
    Location:
    Unit 5 The Sidings, Bacup, Lancs, OL13 9RW
    Ratings:
    +565
    "no amount of upscaling can make up for that" that was my thoughts before I saw it! the number don't add up when the material is so poor but somehow Sony have done a remarkable job!

    I'm sure it will suprise you just as it did with myself and Nick. Enough said!

    Regards, Shane.
     
  30. Ideal AV

    Ideal AV
    Distinguished Member AVForums Sponsor

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2011
    Messages:
    10,646
    Products Owned:
    2
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Location:
    Normanton
    Ratings:
    +5,967
    £12K :D
     

Share This Page

Loading...
  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice