Sony Motionflow & Film mode Settings Explained (finally!)

I've read through this thread again and can't seem to see an answer to what clearness 1 does on oleds, and specifically on my 48A9. Is it low level bfi?

Edit: I've just realised that my oled does have X motion clarity, so I assume at level 1 it's doing what has been explained on the non oled units in this thread?
I'd like to think that it does however I've not had my hands on any Sony OLEDs to be able to play around. Prior to X-Motion Clarity released on OLEDs, they still had a 'Clearness' setting but it behaved differently to how Clearness worked with X-motion Clarity enabled TVs.
 
Please can anyone explain to me what clearness do exactly? I mean, from a tech point of view.

I know what it does is to add a black frame between frames, but if there are 3 clearness options how many black frames are added to the video on each option? On a 120hz panel?

Example:

24p source @ 120hz

1 frame is repeated 5 times right? So, without BFI it should be:

1 1 1 1 1

With clearness 1 what it does? Add only one black frame?

1 1 1 B 1 1

With clearness on MAX what it does? Add 5 black frames?

1 B 1 B 1 B 1 B 1

Is that right?

Thanks!
I have as yet been unable to figure this out. In order to fit the 120hz refresh rate of the TV I always thought it might be => Frame 1, Frame 1, Frame 1, Frame 1, Black Frame, Frame 2... however I think that some of the magic of X-motion Clarity was that it could do partial, localised BFI on only certain parts of the image, which was made possible by combining the way it does it with the local dimming algorithm and zones.
 
Thank you @Mallett94 for taking the time to reply and with such an informed reply too.

So, it has occurred to me over the past few days, part of the problem for me is the fact I am running everything through my receiver.

This limits me on the settings I can adjust on a preset without having every input affected. Hooking everything up to the TV isn't an option, unfortunately, as the rear of the TV isn't accessible to me, should I ever need to disconnect or reconnect a component.

So, I thought if I change source, I can change preset.

Just to clarify, I have an Onkyo receiver with a Panasonic UB820, a PS5 and a Sky Q all connected to it.

The PQ via the PS5 and UB820 can be excellent. If i turn off the motion processing, which isn't really required buy either (is my understanding) it has looked superb with certain films. Edge of tomorrow for instance via blu-ray is amazing. Deep black aliens, rich orange fire and explosions and no hint of blur from the action sequences.

It goes without saying my collection of DV 4K UHD discs looks great.

Then switch back to Sky Q and it looks appalling. As I said in my OP, when the TV was first set-up, my instinct was to disengage all of the motion processing, so the custom preset resembled the isf Expert Dark Room preset from my LG C9, which has nothing by way of processing enabled.

There is no detailed description of what settings do, just a brief note next to each setting. And I miss the lack of a manual that explains the settings.

Don't get me wrong about my fellow owners over on the A90J thread, they appear good people and all share their happiness with their new TV. I'm conscious of that and so don't want to bring down the mood. I mentioned once about being unhappy. Once I realised I was alone in feeling like that, I decided to keep my disappointment to myself.

With that in mind, and considering the rave reviews the A90J is getting left, right and centre, there must be a great TV within the settings, I either have to accept that the Sony's are reliant on processing or see if the retailer will consider swapping it.

Could it be it is purely due to my lack of understanding what is and is not of benefit to the PQ? Because of my lack of familiarity, having switched brands.

Based on your initial reply, I have immediately re-engaged Reality Creation, whacked it up to max and then switched it to auto and will monitor the PQ.

Re Motionflow, the default is custom and both sliders for smoothness and clarity are set at minimum. At the bottom under 'calibration settings', this link will give you more of an idea of the options available.

I really crave information.

Thanks again for taking the time to reply:thumbsup:.
@Barney Gumble I think once you manage to get more familiar with the Sony (following your brand switch as you say) and experiment with a few different things you can hopefully find something that satisfies you?

FYI in terms of Motionflow, it works like this...

Smoothness - increasing this increases the amount of new frames which get created by the TV. The higher the number, the more 'new' frames are created and inserted betwen 2 'real' frames which were used to approximate and generate the 'new' frames.

Clearness - inserts black frames in between actual image frames. This can help with perceived motion blur but also results in reduced max brightness of the content. I recommend only trying this with SDR content. For HDR content I don't feel the Brightness hit is worth it.

Film mode/Cinemotion - This setting does two things (or at least used to on the older X1 Extreme and Ultimate chips). Firstly, when it is set to High or Auto in combination with Smoothness greater than Min, you get quite a strong Soap Opera Effect from the method that is used to generate the new frames (frame interpolation). If Film mode is Off then when Smoothness is above Min you can still get some extra smoothness but it is much more subtle and doesn't really give you visible SOE (the method for generating new frames is clearly different between Film mode Off and High). Secondly, when Motionflow is set to a preset called True Cinema, or the Custom preset with Smoothness Min, Clearness Min, in combination with Film mode High/Auto, this is the correct combo to perform reverse 3:2 pulldown on 24p content within a 60hz refresh rate so that you correctly end up with 5:5 pulldown for 24p content. If Film mode is Off then you can never get rid of the 3:2 pulldown (telecine) judder.

FYI, X1 Extreme chip had Film mode options Off, Low, Medium & High. X1 Ultimate had only Off or Auto and now the XR chip has Off, Low and High I think? Hence when I keep saying High/Auto in the earlier descriptions.

Reality creation and Smooth Gradation have nothing to do with the motion handling of the TV, it's all in the Motionflow settings where that stuff is controlled (or is supposed to be anyway).

Hope this helps.
 
I'd like to think that it does however I've not had my hands on any Sony OLEDs to be able to play around. Prior to X-Motion Clarity released on OLEDs, they still had a 'Clearness' setting but it behaved differently to how Clearness worked with X-motion Clarity enabled TVs.
Thanks Mallett. I've found that unless the TV us showing close up panning then I prefer clearness on minimum. It does something to the picture to my eyes. Not darker exactly, but everything looks a touch more muted.
 
I'd like to think that it does however I've not had my hands on any Sony OLEDs to be able to play around. Prior to X-Motion Clarity released on OLEDs, they still had a 'Clearness' setting but it behaved differently to how Clearness worked with X-motion Clarity enabled TVs.

Sony OLEDs as all OLEDs with BFI have 4 different settings and has nothing to do with X-Motion Clarity on LCD.
Low/Mid/High/Auto
Low/Mid = Simulated Backlight scanning at 96hz for 2020 models , 120hz for 2021 models with stronger intensity for Mid - doesn't reset my eyes and doesn't work like X-Motion Clarity on the LCD models.
High = 60 with massive flicker on OLED
Auto - switches between Low/Mid depending on source hz
 
Fantastic post. Enjoyed reading it. Does anyone have any details on specific settings for the KD48 A9 OLED? I can see similarities with settings on my TV vs what people are mentioning on their LCD but there seem also to be some differences. I'd be interested in hearing from fellow users of this TV.....
 
Fantastic post. Enjoyed reading it. Does anyone have any details on specific settings for the KD48 A9 OLED? I can see similarities with settings on my TV vs what people are mentioning on their LCD but there seem also to be some differences. I'd be interested in hearing from fellow users of this TV.....
See my posts in this thread. They all relate to my 48 A9.
 
Let me know if you have any specific questions that aren't covered above and I'll try to help.
Thanks that's really kind of you. I'm sure there'll be some :)
 
Hi I have a 65 inch Sony Ag9. Whats the best setting for motion and clear vibrant picture? I mainly watch sky q. My sky q box is set to 1080p and picture is set to custom mode with warm colour temp. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
 
I’ve just got a Sony tv, first time so unfamiliar with the settings. I got the X89j and the picture is phenomenal. Which of the motion settings should I turn on? I am noticing judder on some scenes using iTunes movies through Apple 4K box.
 
I’ve just got a Sony tv, first time so unfamiliar with the settings. I got the X89j and the picture is phenomenal. Which of the motion settings should I turn on? I am noticing judder on some scenes using iTunes movies through Apple 4K box.
Just ordered the 75”x89j being delivered Monday, how are you finding it? bought an A8 but can’t get on with oled as it gives me eye strain so reverting back to allegedly the best led non full array from them this year. Coming from a 2016 xd85 so hopefully some improvement for the 5 years of tech.
 
Yeah I love everything about it. The colours are excellent, black levels are very good and I can now see what HDR is supposed to look like. I know it doesn't get up to 1000 nits but it's not far off 600 and highlights really do stand out.

Rtings have a review of the x85j which is the same tv FYI.
 
Yeah I love everything about it. The colours are excellent, black levels are very good and I can now see what HDR is supposed to look like. I know it doesn't get up to 1000 nits but it's not far off 600 and highlights really do stand out.

Rtings have a review of the x85j which is the same tv FYI.
Yes been installed a day now and image quality is excellent. Shame about iPlayer etc missing but that will come soon hopefully. Most impressed with the sound, was expecting to need a soundbar and was considering the Sonos beam but the tv sound is exceptional and as far as I am concerned on par with the A8’s acoustic screen sound I sent back last week. Paid more for this 75” than the 65” A8 but happy with this for the bigger screen and the fact I can’t get on with Oled. The X89J has Motionflow 1000 compared to 800 on the x85J but doubt this would make any visible difference. It was only £50 more lol.
 
Yeah I love everything about it. The colours are excellent, black levels are very good and I can now see what HDR is supposed to look like. I know it doesn't get up to 1000 nits but it's not far off 600 and highlights really do stand out.

Rtings have a review of the x85j which is the same tv FYI.
How can you watch HDR without local dimming?
 
How can you watch HDR without local dimming?

Local dimming is not a requirement, it just improves the picture further. This set has a high native contrast ratio of about 6300:1, it's actually higher than the x90j with local dimming although rtings say the x90j does look a little better.

I can only really compare this tv to my old Samsung ku6100 which didn't meet any HDR requirements and actually looked better in SDR. I can see a massive difference with the Sony, it has wide colour gamut, nearly 600 nits, and high contrast ratio. Bright things like fire, sparks etc can make you squint due to the brightness, combined with the excellent black levels it has makes it look really good. A good scene to test this is with is Transformers 4 chapter 3.
 
Yes been installed a day now and image quality is excellent. Shame about iPlayer etc missing but that will come soon hopefully. Most impressed with the sound, was expecting to need a soundbar and was considering the Sonos beam but the tv sound is exceptional and as far as I am concerned on par with the A8’s acoustic screen sound I sent back last week. Paid more for this 75” than the 65” A8 but happy with this for the bigger screen and the fact I can’t get on with Oled. The X89J has Motionflow 1000 compared to 800 on the x85J but doubt this would make any visible difference. It was only £50 more lol.

Yeah it's annoying we have to wait but I have my Apple TV box so I don't mind. I find the motion very good. As for the sound yeah it's not bad, you can also calibrate it using the remote, as I run my tv through my avr I doubt I will use the tv speakers, ever.
 
Is it true that you have to disable cinemotion when the apple TV is set to automatic picture and frequency mode?
And for a versatile Apple TV use, what do you recommend for a smooth image without SOAP effect ?
 
Is it true that you have to disable cinemotion when the apple TV is set to automatic picture and frequency mode?
And for a versatile Apple TV use, what do you recommend for a smooth image without SOAP effect ?
When the ATV has frame rate matching on, leave Film Mode on but disable MotionFlow.

I have tried all possible settings. When the frame rate matches the motion flow it becomes useless and indeed, adds frames which makes the film unnatural. If the frames correspond to the film, it is seen in a fluid and perfect way. At least for HDR / DV content I turn MotionFlow off.
For SDR I activate it at minimum or maximum at 1
 
There's a scene in Squid Game Ep.4 when the camera pans around the members of a team against a white background and it was a horrible flickering, juddery mess on my A8. I was happy with my TV up until that point! :(
 
There's a scene in Squid Game Ep.4 when the camera pans around the members of a team against a white background and it was a horrible flickering, juddery mess on my A8. I was happy with my TV up until that point! :(
Using the built in app? Push Motionflow smoothness to 1...it will really help on stutter and you will only occasionally notice any slight soap operat effect...mostly with people shown from waist up talking and turning their heads.

Paul
 
Using the built in app? Push Motionflow smoothness to 1...it will really help on stutter and you will only occasionally notice any slight soap operat effect...mostly with people shown from waist up talking and turning their heads.

Paul
Yes using the in built app. I've stuck with the default Custom settings which looks fine for the most part, I don't want to introduce any SOE whatsoever. Are you aware of the scene I'm talking about, it's the worst example of judder/flicker I've seen.
 
Yes using the in built app. I've stuck with the default Custom settings which looks fine for the most part, I don't want to introduce any SOE whatsoever. Are you aware of the scene I'm talking about, it's the worst example of judder/flicker I've seen.

By slight SOE I mean it will at certain times look like 30p instead of 24p. Pretty much Smoothness 1 seems to try and match 30p, Smoothness 2 tries to look like 60p, and Smoothness Max tries to look like 120p. Give Smoothness 1 a try for a few shows. The very slight SOE is just sometimes noticable on peoples faces...you know how full on max SOE people just stading still can even look weird...well it's ever so slightly that but no more than 30p looking and just infrequently and it really helsp all those damn pan stutters you get on 24p content ALL THE TIME.

Paul
 
By slight SOE I mean it will at certain times look like 30p instead of 24p. Pretty much Smoothness 1 seems to try and match 30p, Smoothness 2 tries to look like 60p, and Smoothness Max tries to look like 120p. Give Smoothness 1 a try for a few shows. The very slight SOE is just sometimes noticable on peoples faces...you know how full on max SOE people just stading still can even look weird...well it's ever so slightly that but no more than 30p looking and just infrequently and it really helsp all those damn pan stutters you get on 24p content ALL THE TIME.

Paul
Panning against a bright background seems to be the worst, I think you'd have to crank smoothness to the max to improve that scene.
 

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