Sony KD55XE9005 or Samsung QE55Q7F?

Discussion in 'What Is The Best TV For You?' started by JohnKimble, Dec 24, 2017.

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  1. JohnKimble

    JohnKimble
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    Hi folks,
    For the life of me,I cannot decide between these 2.

    I've read every single forum page and review and know that on paper the Sony is technically better.
    So I decided to buy it but for the final comparison I went to a showroom to try them one more time.

    I demoed them both side by side: UHD demo,HD demo,Game demo with HDR and the Samsung always looked significantly superior.

    The colours definitely look more vibrant and blacks look more black on Samsung.
    the settings were set to similar values.there was no doubt, the picture quality simply looked superior on Samsung.

    So how could a supposedly inferior edge lit TV (Samsung) with worse HDR look instantly superior to Sony?

    I really don't know what to do now.on one hand I read all these glorifying reviews and praises about that Sony and on the other hand in reality and to my own eyes the Samsung looks better.

    Sony is around £1050 and Samsung around £1200

    Help me choose and advice Please..

    (mix use,netflix,other streaming, youtube,sd tv, hd tv, gaming,some HDR,average lit room)
     
  2. Angelo M

    Angelo M
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  3. Dodgexander

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    Did you demo the TVs in a demo room with the correct settings? If you compare side by side in a lit environment the extra 500 nits brightness probably plays a part. You shouldn't really demo a TV in a showroom as it will look nothing like at home.

    The Samsung is better than the Sony when it comes to colour though, there is about another 5% better colour coverage in the HDR colour space and the TV tracks colour better at higher brightness levels.

    However the deal breaker is indeed the local dimming which whilst on the Sony is pretty average, it is at least effective compared to completely ineffective on the Samsung.

    If you like that better colour on the Samsung then go for that model
     
  4. JohnKimble

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    Yes I demoed them in showroom.but the settings were on par.
    I know about harsh lights, shadows etc in showroom vs home..

    But I was thinking if the Samsung has better colours and blacks in this type of environment,then it can only have even better colours in a dimmer environment like a living room? no?

    Are you saying this Samsung has better colours only in HDR mode or in general?
    because colours looks superior in every source not juts HDR..

    I was aware of local dimming capability of Sony,but honestly in reality,when there was a completely dark scene and sudden burst of bright colour/white (I guess that's were local dimming should play it's role?) Samsung came strong,I really didn't see any Sony superiority..

    Is there any other reason that I should buy the Sony over Samsung that I might have missed?
     
  5. Dodgexander

    Dodgexander
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    Have a compare of the TVs here: Samsung Q7F vs Sony X900E Side-by-Side TV Comparison

    The Sony has both better black levels and contrast ratio and that's measured with local dimming off...blacks is certainly not a benefit of the Samsung and will be obvious in dark viewing conditions if you compared.

    Local dimming significantly affects the picture quality, not only in test patterns but in general, even more so with HDR.

    The problem here perhaps is whilst the Sony has local dimming its not fantastic compared to the local dimming of some FALD 2016 models. However its still a lot better than the Samsung in this respect.

    As you will see in the link only with HDR. The Samsung covers more of the rec2020(HDR) colour spectrum. In SDR if there is a noticeable disparity between both its a calibration issue.

    Its been discussed here many times before but you really shouldn't judge based on a showroom environment. Whilst you are doing the right thing demoing both TVs in the flesh I would make sure if you do draw conclusions before buying you do so in a demo room.
     
  6. JohnKimble

    JohnKimble
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    Thanks for the info and the comparison link.
    Will read through them even more, choosing a TV is indeed a real challenge these days.
    My heart is with Samsung,my mind with Sony :facepalm:
     
  7. SLS72

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    Black levels are better on the Sony, no doubt about that.
     
  8. JohnKimble

    JohnKimble
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    have you compared them side by side?
    on paper and in theory yes, but honestly in a lit room the blacks looked identical.
    I'm sure with all lights off Sony will have better blacks..
    colours though...easy win for the Samsung.the Sony simply looked pale and washed out in comparison.
    it was so significant the you could notice better, sharper colours instantly, and no through observation was necessary.
     
  9. askara

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    Its not on paper though.on paper mean just the technical specification but review is carried out in real world and tested with professional equipment which is way more accurate than human eye. the 5% wider colour gamut is unlikely to be noticeable by human eye, the different you see probably is due to different PC setting and calibration. Most will recommend the 9005 especially at £150+ a different, but it seems you already made the decision. so just get the Samsung.
     
  10. SLS72

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    No but my Mum has an XE90 and I've had a demo of the Q8 in RS, the Q8 and Q7 are almost identical. Contrast is the number one element of PQ and the local dimming works on the Sony and produces a much better contrast performance. The Samsung is a joke in this respect, its local dimming produces columns of light that span the entire height of the screen with letterbox bars always being illuminated. You can't immerse yourself in a movie when faced with such ugly backlight flaws. The local dimming on the XE90 is no ZD9 but its still in a different league to the Samsung.

    If you intend on watching in a well lit room then you're essentially making HDR pointless anyway but yes it will help to hide the Samsungs inferior PQ vs the Sony.

    In my experience of watching the XE90 is certainly doesn't look pale and washed out to me and as has already been pointed out any comparison on the shop floor in worthless.

    The bottom line is that in terms of PQ the Sony is the superior TV, that it's also cheaper makes it a no brainer. The Samsung certainly has its strengths and areas where it is better than the Sony but PQ wise the Sony has it comfortably beat.
     
  11. JohnKimble

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    I really haven't yet made the decision (can't) , hence why I'm still debating it here.
    you say the better colour is unlikely to be noticeable yet the colours on this TV is significantly more punchy and vibrant than any LCD TV,again on paper it's just 5% wider gamut, but there must be something else involved,I don't know processing? maybe some of that "quantum dot" marketing stuff is actually legit? I mean I was blaming them for the whole QLED all the time still do because they tried to con people into thinking it's a new different tech like OLED etc etc but really there is something special about the colours of these QLED TVs that instantly separates them from other LEDs.
    I have no doubt the tests with professional equipments are corrects and all but then when you say those equipments are more accurate than human eye, makes me think you are going to watch that TV with human eyes not through professional calibration devices..
     
  12. JohnKimble

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    Did you demo it in a proper demo room / in dark room?
    because I really didn't notice ANY of that clouding with black bars there and I REALLY looked for it.(again I agree it was just the shop showroom but still there should have been some noticeable like other cheaper edge lit sets).

    When I said pale colours on Sony I meant when compared to the Samsung.the Sony on its own or vs most other Tvs had great colour but next to the Samsung it was simply night and day difference in colour quality.no doubt about this part.

    I've watched many reviews now and it seems only in complete dark room Sony beats Samsung nd even with a small desk lamp on you cannot notice any light cloud etc.

    the comparison & reviews on rting only marginally scored Sony better than Samsung so I don't think the way you describe the Samsung as being "joke" etc is accurate..
    (rating samsung 7.9 vs Sony 8.1)

    I don't know,I might get the Sony after all to be safer but I will always say this Samsung Q7 beats that Sony on colour department EASILY.
     
    Last edited: Dec 25, 2017
  13. SLS72

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    Not a dark room but dim I would say. The Q8 was unwatchable with HDR for me, if I owned one (or a Q7) I would avoid HDR content. I refer to the local dimming as a joke and stand by that based on my experience with Samsung edge lit LCDs, rtings seem to agree as the Q7 scores 1.8/10 in this category. Yes the Q7 has a wider colour gamut but this is only true with HDR. Colour gamut is nowhere near as important as contrast to overall PQ though and Sony easily beats the Samsung in this respect. Clearly the concensus on AVF is buy the Sony and rightly so as it's the better TV for less money but at the end of the day its your money and you should spend it how you wish.
     
  14. JohnKimble

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    I'm leaning back towards the Sony..seems to be the safer option (and cheaper),now only if I come across a deal that beats the current best price of £1050 I will feel much better..I have to say I'm generally not fan of Sony LCD TVs at all.my first LCD TV was a Sony years ago and I absolutely hated it.that soft,warm signature Sony colour that I still notice in many lower range Sony Bravias..yuck..vs sharper more natural and elegant colour of Panasonic or even Samsung..so it scares me if this one also has some of that DNA inherited.. (despite being a great TV)..always preferred Panasonic..and certain models of Samsung to Sony..but this year Panasonic failed to deliver and so did Samsung..
     
  15. ryanvincent

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    Samsung edge lit = garbage
    Sony FALD = Great
    Get the sony.
     
  16. SDMDAM

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    Surely the best judge of a TV is your own eyes. If you thought the Samsung is better and worth £150 more then get that.
     
  17. SLS72

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    Only when set up correctly in the right environment.
     
  18. SLS72

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    In my experience of recent Sony LCDs (W905A, X83C, XD93 and XE90) they have no issues producing sharp and natural pictures if setup correctly. If you've owned one Sony LCD (which may not have been setup correctly) you're in no position to describe anything as 'signature Sony'.
     
  19. spinaltap

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  20. TUT

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  21. spinaltap

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    I wouldn’t touch the Q6 with a barge pole. The Q7 or Q8 would be my choice.
     
  22. Dodgexander

    Dodgexander
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    The reason the QLEDs get slated is more down to Samsungs marketting and pricing strategy than the tech itself.

    Quantum Dot has been on their TVs since 2015 and its only this year where they have really made a decent improvement in HDR colour accuracy/volume, before then the TVs weren't really any better with colour than other sets and currently you could probably argue you won't even notice that difference.

    Since the difference is with a HDR source only too, it kind of brings the value down in my eyes unless you plan on using HDR a lot compared to SDR. SDR colour coverage has been 98%-99% for 1 or 2 years now so any obvious differences there are definitely calibration related. Perhaps because the Samsung was in a brighter environment its colour volume shone compared to the Sony at higher brightness levels.

    Calibrate the TV for SDR then it won't be the same, I bet you anything they would have been running the Samsung in the store at higher brightness levels just to make it look better in a bright environment.

    As for the reports of micro stutter, there is no TV that doesn't have these reports, Samsung TVs have had micro stutter reports for as long as I remember.

    What store did you demo the TVs at? Do they have a demo room where you can see how they perform in darker viewing environments?
     
  23. JohnKimble

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    what I refer to as "signature" Sony / Panasonic pictures is real.there is certain characteristics to the picture these brands produce, certain colour tone etc that cannot be re-produced by reading technical reports / calibration value and fiddling with settings,.it's always been there and many other people will agree too.it's not necessarily about being bad or good.
     
    Last edited: Dec 25, 2017
  24. JohnKimble

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    take a look at this comparison video, in this video clearly the Q7F has a very good performance and I can see very little light halo effect (whatever the correct term is) compared to Sony.
    If the 900E is same as XE900,then Q7 is performing much better.

    (side by side) Q7F vs Q9F vs KS8000 vs X900E...
     
    Last edited: Dec 25, 2017
  25. JohnKimble

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    I know about Quantum dot..that Samsung was using it in some of their TVs last year (great TVs), then they decided to market it as a completely new tech and hike etch prices up and marketed the whole QLED to con clueless buyers and compete with OLED.
    I myself hated what they did since I always been an OLED TV fan ever since I heard about them.

    I think a lot of hate these qled TVs get from people is because of that.

    BUT I'm now considering this TV purely on it's performance and with the current price which is close to that Sony.I couldn't care less if it wasn't called QLED.in fact I prefer it wasn't called QLED so that if someone in the know saw my box they don't think I've been fooled by marketing!

    again from what I saw in shop the colours on these QLED models where noticeably superior to ANY NON OLED TV there.

    there were a Q7 next to XE9005 right under ceiling light and there was another one is a darker corner next to another XE9005.
    It was Currys,again I'm aware shop showroom is not a good place to judge a TV.
    but then this should apply to both.and colour settings where similar.
     
  26. Dodgexander

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    @JohnKimble Slightly concerned with their testing if its showing a Z9D which is the FALD king looking a lot worse than an edge lit QLED.

    Samsung's local dimming isn't any better this year than last years KS series yet in the video the KS series looks awful compared.

    Very strange results. Ah wait I just seen that guys channel on YouTube, now it makes sense. He posts comparison videos of TVs in stores and refers to dirty screen effect as banding.:rolleyes:

    In another video on the same channel he rates the Samsung's light bleed as being 5/10 compared to the Sony and dark room performance poorer than the Sony too.

    Credit to the guy actually doing videos and giving his opinion on stuff but where has he got these videos from? How is he sure camera settings are even in each take? How are the TVs calibrated before he takes videos? Does he have calibration equipment even?

    I think before he publishes his testing process its safe to assume that its flawed. There is a very good reason reputable sources online are what they are, they are usually experienced calibrators who are experienced in the industry, if you want to make good comparisons between the TVs look at reviews posted on here by Steve or Vincent at HDTVtest or similar.

    Its not just that but they are overpriced, massively. In many respects last years KS series are better TVs and they cost far, far less. Even now the Samsung Q7 is more expensive than the Sony XE9005 and that is after lots of price drops. They market the TV to be close in price to OLED and then drop their prices aggressively to make it seem like people are getting a good deal, what instead they are getting is just a hyped up edge lit LCD that for most people isn't going to be noticeably better than even their MU7000.

    You came here for good honest advice, if you like the colour of the Samsung and believe the YouTube stuff, fine, go get the Samsung. We are trying our best to sway you in the right direction because we feel you would be making a mistake spending more on a lesser TV. If you choose to believe us or not is up to you, but I am guessing you came here because you value advice, not ignore it. The Samsung does some things better than the Sony, it gets brighter, has better colour coverage in the rec2020 colour gamut and a better anti reflection filter.

    Maybe you should read this guys findings with multiple Q7's, whilst I don't often point out individual flaws (every TV people who find faults that others won't notice) its no less believable than that guy on youtube. LG B7V after Samsung Q7F issues
     
  27. JohnKimble

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    I do value good advice and that's why I didn't order the Samsung.
    I tried to find a last years KS8000 but they are all disappeared and no chance of finding one.
    What happens to all unsold stock anyway? how can they all vanish?
    RGB direct has them on their website but as others mentioned when called they don't have any in stock.
    I've watched AVforums reviews as well as Vincent from HDTV (he gave the Q7 thumbs up just mentioned not the best for completely dark room).
    at this point,I think I put the Q7F aside and move on..
    but is there any other alternative to the Sony? I just don't feel good about that Sony,I read 10 pages of XE9005 owners section so far and the general impression you get from owners is very "meh" + many complaints about android tv.I just don't like Sony LCD TVs and am looking for a different brand.I wish Panasonic had some great models but they don't have anything great except OLED this year and their DX800 series just look ridiculous.(probably the worst TV design in history).
     
  28. Dodgexander

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    That is the problem this year, when it comes to LCDs its really only Sony for the higher end models. If you don't want to buy a Sony the best advice I would give is wait for clearance sales in spring and keep an eye on OLED prices to snap up a good deal on one of the LGs. I saw people have been able to get them recently at £1200.

    TVs like the Samsung MU7000/Panasonic EX750 are fine for SDR and for most people even these TVs are probably an overkill but if you want decent HDR the only option really is Sony this year if you go for LCDs.
     
  29. ryanvincent

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    i can't believe people are actually recommending him a edge lit samsung over a FALD Sony, some people have no idea what they are talking about I swear o_O
     
  30. JohnKimble

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    -since I had a good offer for my Panasonic Plasma I sold it, not realising how tough choosing the next TV becomes.now without a TV so I can't wait for spring sales.

    -decided against the Samsung Q7F.

    -on paper, the best option right now is the Sony XE9005 (which I have a bad gut feeling about, since I simply don't like Sony LCD TVs no matter good or bad).

    -second option for me will be forgetting about HDR,and go for the Panasonic E750.(that TV can be bought for £650 refurbished from Panasonic store so a great saving).I noticed Dodgexander rated this one equal to Q7F in his guide and I understand why.

    It also got score of 10 for image quality on avforum review (when calibrated) which is higher than either Sony EX9005 and Q7F.and seems to have very favourable user opinion in owners thread.

    The Sony is still an LCD TV with LCD faults including poor viewing angle..it costs over £1000 which I think anything over £1000 is OLED price range territory.
    and think in 6 months time a good UHD LG OLED will be £1000 or even £950,makes me wonder the value of Sony..at least with the E750 I'm paying just £650.

    Very tough decision! :facepalm:
     

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