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(Sony HS-10) Text - Light and Bold banding - Help?

Discussion in 'Projectors, Screens & Video Processors' started by Markatlarks, Nov 10, 2003.

  1. Markatlarks

    Markatlarks
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    (I have posted a copy of this thread on the HS-10 site)

    I have just had my HS-10 returned after a bout of the 'bug'. I thought I would try and check all aspects of the machine for later reference.

    I was typing a word document and noticed that the text appeared to be 'bolder' in certain parts of the screen. I was confused as all the formatting was 'normal text'.

    I created a new document full of 'x's. and made the word document a half screen size moveable window. If I move the window left and right across the window I notice that there appears to be 'bold' distortion in bands running vertically at about 10 degrees of vertical.
    I will try and recreate below what I see but I will happily post a jpg of the projected image if that would help.

    Has anybody seen this Phenomena before?
    [​IMG]

    You do see the 'boldening' while the window is static but it is far more obvious if you shake the window from side to side.


    Any help would be appreciated.

    When watching a DVD etc the banding is totally unrecognisable. It is only apparent on text - not photos or the like! It is rather like there is a variable 'band of contrast' - Very Strange?
     
  2. kotlewm

    kotlewm
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    What resolution are you running at? I've seen this sort of thing when the resolution of the PC is not matched to the panel resolution. (1024x768 in 4:3 mode)

    Martin.

    p.s.

    The filter you supplied is still working well for me :)
     
  3. Markatlarks

    Markatlarks
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    kotlewm

    I am projecting 1:1 - Max resolution. 1366x768=1366,65,142,207,768,1,3,21,79046,39

    It is rather like there is a 'layer' where ther is variable contrast. I will take a photo and show this. I would welcome people trying this test - of typing x's in a word document and moving the screen. Maybe they have the same problem but have never noticed it? Who knows!

    Thanks for you help though!

    Marko
     
  4. theritz

    theritz
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    Mark,

    I don't have the HS10, but am puzzled by the "moving the window across the screen"; I would have thought that full 1:1 would fit the desktop on the panel - are you talking about scrolling the desktop on the screen ? It soulds like the banding that comes from not having "proper" 1:1 - no insult to your technical setup intended, of course..............

    Kramer will probbaly be along shortly with a definitive comment.


    Sean G.
     
  5. Kramer

    Kramer
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    I imagine he's using notepad etc. "windowed" & moving the window around the screen.

    Only reason I can imagine is because 1:1 mapping is not being achieved or the projector has not "synced" correctly to the incoming signal.

    I'd suggest downloading the test pattern (link in the FAQ) & giving that a shot - will definitively answer the 1:1 mapping question.

    Also try changing inputs - should get the HS10 to "re-sync" to the signal.

    Certainly doesn't happen on my HS10.

    :smoke:
     
  6. loonatic

    loonatic
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    I too can see this on my HS10 using the same PowerStrip settings you have listed above.

    I then remembered seeing another set of PowerStrip settings

    1368x768=1368,56,144,216,768,1,11,23,80285,3094

    so tried these and seems to have cured the problem.

    The HS10 still picks it up as 1366x768 though so not too sure why that is but it's worth giving it a try.

    Cheers, Lee
     
  7. Markatlarks

    Markatlarks
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    I will do as you sugest and re-look at my powerstrip settings. However I am convinced that this problem has occured since my HS10 has been returned from Sony - The Bug!

    As a point of interest: When my HS-10 was returned I noticed that Sony have upgraded the bios of the projector but this does not seem to have sorted out the 'bug'.

    I have had two failures in ten starts. Any sugestions as to how I should deal with this? I have 145 hrs on the PJ.
    Kramer - you are correct - the analagy of notebook etc is 100% correct. I will have a look at all the settings and report back to the forum. Do you think that changing the 'low level' settings in the factory mode may have caused the problem? I have made 'sugested changes' that have appeared in various posts. I have also done all the 'Dave Boswell' changes for CC40 filter. Hey ho!

    Having said that I am still very happy with the results but just feel realy psd off at having that naging feeling EVERY TIME I swith on the PJ. Will it? Wont it?

    Which brings me to the final question: An HS-10 with the lamp bug - bought in August 2003 with 145 hrs must be worth something. Is it worth selling it and going for an HS20 or is the difference in performance and uplift in price just not worth it?

    Any thoughts welcome.
     
  8. Markatlarks

    Markatlarks
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    Kramer and Lunatic - Thank you for your help.
    I have applied LUNAICS proposed settings:1368x768=1368,56,144,216,768,1,11,23,80285,3094
    and although things have improved they are still not perfect.
    Can someoneverify the 1:1 settings I will be happy to re-try this problem.

    Many thanks

    Marko
     
  9. Kramer

    Kramer
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    Try these timings:

    PowerStrip timing parameters:
    1368x768=1368,80,136,200,768,1,3,21,79905,7

    ;)
     
  10. Markatlarks

    Markatlarks
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    I will apply these this evening - with thanks.

    Is there anywhere a 'definitive' specification on the HS-10 by way of CC40 settings, 1:1 settings etc?

    Would this not be a sensible consolidation of knowledge (in the future) for current PJs?
    It seems that if I analyse my time searching for stuff, while there are serious benefits of reading useful info, there seems to be no 'fountain of knowledge' on a particular machine.

    I know that the HS10.com forum has tried to address this but some of their data is out of date and they even go so far as to say that there is not a 'real' problem with the the HS-10 vix a viz the lamp bug. They put it down to a faulty batch of lamps!

    Just a thought.

    Thanks for your tireless help and support

    Marko
     
  11. Markatlarks

    Markatlarks
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    I tried as suggested and things have improved somewhat but I still see this boldening even on your parameters.

    I am not sure what “GBR 720p” is or why someone should not want to achieve 1:1 mapping. Your thoughts?

    I have tried Mark Rejhorn’s Easy DILA Calibration Test Pattern on you parameters and I can see diagonal interference. So now I am totally confused.

    I should say however that your parameters make the whole experience of surfing the internet or just doing word processing more than acceptable. Many thanks again.

    Below is a response from Brandon Higa on the HS-10.Com website –
    Cheers
    Marko

    _______________________________________________
    Well, I'm running at the "GBR 720p" mode right now so I'm not running 1-to-1 anymore, but I'll check my Powerstrip settings when I get home.

    My test to see if things were 1-to-1 was to display a fullscreen on/off/on/off black/white pattern. and a full-screen on/on/off/off black/white pattern (just using Windows desktop tiling).

    If moire artifacts appear, it's not 1-to-1. In my case, it was 1-to-1. I'll be back with my Powerstrip timings

    I'm back...

    Here are the timings I was using for 1-to-1 1368x768 before I switched over to the 1192x670 "GBR 720p" mode.

    PowerStrip timing parameters:
    1368x768=1368,64,144,208,768,1,3,21,79224,7

    Generic timing details for 1368x768:
    HFP=64 HSW=144 HBP=208 kHz=44 VFP=1 VSW=3 VBP=21 Hz=56

    Linux modeline parameters:
    "1368x768" 79.224 1368 1432 1576 1784 768 769 772 793 -hsync –vsync



    I hope that this helps the situation for anyone else who has been experiencing problems. I have not tried these settings but will report back when I have
    Cheers

    Mark
     
  12. Markatlarks

    Markatlarks
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    Many thanks to all for their help. I have true 1:1 at last.

    The problem was twofold and I would like to share thm with the forum.

    Firstly I had been using the incorrect powerstrip parameters. I know this sounds daft but there are any number of 'correct' parameters' flying round this and other forums. May I sugest that Kramers Parameters (above) are secured somewhere for the benefit of mankind.

    Secondly - Having applied the correct parameters I was still getting a little emboldening from my projected image. With the advice from a member of the avsforum in the USA I realised that I had accidently set up the PJ with a side shot of 10 where this should be zero. Once zeroised the problem dissapeared.

    My sincere thanks to all for their assistance.
     
  13. Kramer

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    Never suggested keystone/sideshot - assumed you weren't using either.

    I've said it before but this highlights the pintlessness of 1:1 pixel perfect mapping while using ANY form of digital correction.

    Glad you got it figured out ;)
     

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