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'Sony back in the mainstream of home Cinema PJs with the VPL-Vw12HT'

Discussion in 'Projectors, Screens & Video Processors' started by Russ, Dec 19, 2002.

  1. Russ

    Russ
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    Interesting review in this months HCC (Feb2003). John Archer seems to rate this LDC projector (although he didnt make any comparison to DLPs) he does say it corrects all of the shortcomings of the Sony VPL-VW12HT.
    Time to take a look maybe ?
    Also he didnt mention a 'cinema mode' filter that is often mentioned on the 'other' forum.
     
  2. cine king

    cine king
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    I thought this a VERY poor review.

    He said the 12ht corrected the 11ht shortcomings-then went on to mention all the features that were present in the 11ht-but mentioned none of the new features in the 12ht.

    He did not mention the MLA which reduces the screendoor effect,or the filter which increases the contrast or the gamma s/ware-or the improvement in the optics.

    Now I dispute that there were any shortcomings in the 11ht-the screendoor was not apparent anyway-the blacks were very good-this projector was rated highly by some TOP american reviewers-as has been mentioned in this forum before,Bill Cushman -reviewer for Widescreen Review went out and bought one immediately after he reviewed it!

    What I think this review represents is an about turn by H.C.C. after their lukewarm review of the 11ht when all the yanks were raving about it.

    In short they had egg on their faces-this review seeks to re-establish their credability.

    But the H.C.C.reviews on projectors are notoriously dismal-I mean where are the projector shoot-outs? Where are the tests after calibration?

    Look at their rankings for projectors at the back-its a joke!

    The AE100 does not belong in the top 20 of all the current projectors in the market.

    Where are the reviews of the JVC DILA 150CL? NEC HT1000? JVC SX21? Marantz S2 ? Sharp Z10000,Yamaha DPX1000?

    By the time we get these the hd3 dlp projectors will be on the market.

    ..And we wont have a comparison between them...So how will this aid our buying decision?-What about a shootout between the 12HT and the SIM2 HT300+?

    John Archer hang your head in shame,Steve May-do you read the reviews?
     
  3. cine king

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    My point is that argueably the Sony is the best lcd projector-the Sim the best dlp.

    Who wins the shootout?
     
  4. Russ

    Russ
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    I do agree that the review is superficial and contains many superlatives rather than being objective and factual.
    It is also true that the VW11HT review was bad in that they didnt think it represented enough of a leap for the money and when compared to some of the competition.

    BUT, to be fare, the review printed in July/Aug 2002 issue of 'Stereophile Guide to Home Theatre' (which carrys out very comprehensive objective reviews with measurements) also pointed out some bad points, saying that the VW11HT has
    true high definition resolution, sharper image and no rainbows. They compare it to the Marantz VP12S1 (also reviewed in the same issue) and say that it (VW-11HT) in comparison is poor in contrast, quality of blacks and richness of colour. Yes, they liked it - at the price point (and this is an important point).

    Looking at the HCC review (of the VW11HT) again, I think you maybe dont like someone criticising your choice ?
    John talked about the good points and the bad points and only makes a comparison of Blacks based on the price of other LCDs.

    Whether the VW12HT actually is much better and does address those few shortcomings will be determined by the individual, based on price and what you see in the demo. Is the SIM2 be worth £3k more ? Thats a lot of money.

    As for shoot outs, they are usefull when you are evaluating what to buy only if your choice is in the line up !
     
  5. cine king

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    Russ,
    Im sorry but your wrong.

    You imply I dont like the review because the 11ht was previously slated and that I had one for a year?

    I dont like the review because the 12ht is the 11ht-the only differences really being MLA and the cinema filter.

    Neither of which John Archer mentioned.

    Now what differences do the mla and the cinema filter make?

    They reduce the screendoor minutely(..not so you would notice any difference from the 11ht at 12ft viewing difference-you would have to have your nose to the screen to notice slightly thinner grids!!).....and the cinema filter makes a slight improvement to contrast(at the expense of brightness).

    I owned an 11ht for a year,I have extensively demoed the 12ht-and can assure you from experience there is essentially no difference.

    So it makes no sense for the 11ht to get a poor review and the 12ht to get a stonking review?

    Your comments comparing the Marantz s1 to the 11ht-well,the Marantz until recently was reckoned to be the king of the dlp`s -I saw it-and indeed it bettered the 11ht.

    BUT THERE WAS NOTHING IN IT.

    To reitterate,Widescreen Review-acknowledged as the best of the u.s. mags when it comes to review,raved about the 11ht-and their top reviewer -Bill Cushman-went out and immediately bought one.
    That review was before and after calibration to d65.The 11ht had everything chucked at it -p.c. input,component,High Def-and got a stunning review on all counts.

    Once calibrated,the 11ht is a fantastic projector-via p.c.,better still.

    Having seen practically every projector out there-believe me,it is a great projector-bar DILA(which it equals in widescreen),it still has the best widescreen resolution panel you can buy-and that includes all the current hd2 dlp models now available.

    The trouble is at the moment,all anybody is going by is the specs-more specifically-the contrast specs.

    Most are making a determination based on this-"this projector MUST be better it has a higher contrast ratio"...

    Frankly thats RUBBISH!!!!!! The projectors reckoned to currently give the most film-like picture are the DILA units.
    DILA has the lowest contrast of all ..

    IN CLOSING,I would say this,if YOU had owned an 11ht you would KNOW that review was poor.

    Because I owned the 11ht once does not mean I am biased-it means I know what I am talking about-which you clearly do not,else you would understand that without a point of reference a great review for the 12ht means little-there are many unanswered questions-like;- Is it as good as the current dlp`s-better ?...half as good?...

    To the other poster who states that the Sim2 300+ must be better because its more expensive.

    Dont talk twaddle!!!!!!!

    For a start the Sim2 300+ is overpriced to start with-whilst the Sony is very reasonable for what it is.

    The Sim2 300+ may well be better-because its a great projector-not because its expensive.

    But the question that should be asked is whether or not its four grand better!

    This you could only determine in a shootout between the two-and the shootout would be interesting because as I stated before-the lcd king against the current dlp king.

    Who wins the technology title?

    You may well be surprised-irrelevant of price. ;)
     
  6. Russ

    Russ
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    Cine King,

    At least you didnt swear at me ;)

    So you recommend the Sony projectors then ?
    12HT is on my list because of the price. If the perfomance is good as an updated model, then great.
    I went into my local Sony Centre yesterday to ask where I might see a 12HT and I am not surprised to say that they were not interested at all in helping me 'my boss only stocks what he can sell quickly and these are too expensive - I can order one for you of course' .
    Russ
     

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