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Sky Must Be miffed : 24 Related Of Course

PoochJD

Distinguished Member
Hi Bauer,

Don't forget, that Sky will also take into account:
- those who watch it later this week on Sky 1 or Sky Mix, when it gets repeated
- those who watched it on Sky Travel on Sunday night
- those who watched it on Sky Travel +1 on Sunday night
- and those recorded it (video, DVD, or Sky+, et al)

680,000 may not seem like many viewers, but for one two-hour show, on a Sunday night, that's not bad. However, in comparison to a show on ITV that gets some 10 million, then yes, it is appalling.


Pooch
 
T

thirst

Guest
Don't forget the fact that everybody in the UK can receive ITV but not everybody pays for Sky!

Having said that I think you'll find that farscape Peacekeeper wars performed better than 24!
 

Starburst

Distinguished Member
I reckon the ratings SKY1 got for Buffy and Friends forever coloured what could be expected for the PAY channel.
SKY1 benefits hugely from a terrestrial screening of a show they own the first run rights too and those day are all but gone.
The BBC don't have any big shared shows, ITV are useless and CH4 tend to schedule their shared content at very bad times and mostly aimed at younger audiences and they also now buy more FTA/PAY rights for the sole purpose of making sure SKY don#t get their hands on them (makes E4 going free viable). Finally Five picked themselves out some good US stuff which they share with other PAY channels.

I am still waiting for the day when someone at SKY puts forward the proposal to go ad free on SKY1 and set a marketing trend within the PAY channel community:)
Ad revenue is a good bonus but sometimes I think SKY are too concerned about it and put those needs ahead of the viewers who contribute around 90% of their income.
 

Kazuya Mishima

Established Member
Anybody know what viewing figures 24 got when it was on BBC2 for 2 series?

Maybe if SKy wasn't getting high viewing figures they would drop it (and BBC2 could pick it up again next year).
 

PoochJD

Distinguished Member
Kazuya,

BBC2 generally averaged around 2.5 to 3 milion viewers for Seasons 1 and 2 of "24"! As such, it was one of their most popular shows - moreso, for the timeslot it was given (10pm on a Sunday night)!

However, the BBC's chance of buying any future series, is almost nil. They couldn't agree suitable rights between themselves and 20th Century Fox, so Fox said "Goodbye" to the BBC, and went to offer the show to Sky instead - who went straight ahead and bought Seasons 3 and 4, before offering terrestrial rights to Five.


Pooch
 

Kazuya Mishima

Established Member
Thanks Pooch.

I had a rant about this back when the deal was agreed. The basis of my rant was that BBC2 had 'broken' the show and promoted it in the UK, and there should have been some 'loyalty' or 'gratitude' shown. Well I hope they're happy.
 

Starburst

Distinguished Member
Who?

FOX are happy because they got more cash from SKY then they would have got from the BBC. SKY are happy because advertising revenues are a drop in the ocean compared to subscriptions and it seems that had a good three months prior to xmas.
UK distributers of the DVD's are happy because no doubt they sold a few thousand more copies by not having a FTA screening prior to the release.

The only people who are unhappy are those not prepared to have subscription TV (for many genuine and practical reasons) or those who still think that the BBC are actually the power they used to be and have a god given right to rule the TV roost.
 

HMHB

Distinguished Member
I think I'm in the minority here as I've never seen a single episode of 24. My mate is an avid fan and according to him Series 3 was spoilt by Sky sticking adverts in all over the place - probably about 15 minutes of adverts for an hours program. I wonder if a lot of people will just buy it on DVD ?
 

shoemaker666

Distinguished Member
the thing is most of the hour long shows shown on tv when you get them on dvd are actully only 40mins long so you get a good 20mins of adverts in between on tv

me personlly i dont like 24 tried to watch it but after about 5 or 6 episodes i found i was fast forwarding the sky + to get to the end so i thought what was the point in recording it in the first place.
 

Tejstar

Distinguished Member
JohnG said:
I think I'm in the minority here as I've never seen a single episode of 24. My mate is an avid fan and according to him Series 3 was spoilt by Sky sticking adverts in all over the place - probably about 15 minutes of adverts for an hours program. I wonder if a lot of people will just buy it on DVD ?

I'm in the same situation, although currently negotiating with the wife to get the sereis on dvd. :D

From what people have said though, watching it on dvd is a much better experience. You can watch a few episodes on the trot, instead of one a week.
 

lee789

Established Member
I totally agree with the dvd experience.

I find that commiting yourself to be in on a sunday night for 24 weeks is a bit much, and I am useless at remebering to record things.

I would imagine with a program like this the first epsiode is watched by loads of folk and this drops massively towards the end of the show, with a handful of people watching.

It is a great show though, but I think they are probably running out of ideas.
 

hornydragon

Distinguished Member
wasn't 24 part of the fall out when the BBC went FTA instead of FTV on sat? as going unencrytped (saving £millions they had to pay sky to encrypt content) meant they breached the "uk only" part of the rights, ie poeple in france could have watched it of BBC astra hence devaluing the french rights?
 

Kopite4Ever

Established Member
correct horny. apprently for this, fox were willing to give beeb series 3 but at a much much higher price. remember this as i was a member of the beeb 24 forums and there was uprage, and rightly so. beeb wasnt impressed and that when sky swooped in.

edit : jesus your coming to 10,000 posts :thumbsup:
 
T

thirst

Guest
I can't see that E4 will ever go free and I would imagine that Sky One doesn't mind losing shows to E4 because it's shown on digital pay television. With more channels showing more new shows Sky should entice more subscribers and they make more money without having to purchase more expensive US imports themselves. In effect all the other digital channels including E4 , sci fi, living , FX289 help shoulder the financial burden making Sky look more attractive if they have all the new shows first, choking out the competition like the BBC.

I think that Over time pay TV will gradually cut out an even larger audience share from terrestrial. Terrestrial TV is dying a slow death if you ask me and given the service that the BBC now provides, I think the TV licence fee should be reviewed. It doesn't provide value-for-money and should be abolished in favour of advert free subscription by choice or paid through advertising like ITV and Channel 4.
 

Starburst

Distinguished Member
JohnG said:
I think I'm in the minority here as I've never seen a single episode of 24. My mate is an avid fan and according to him Series 3 was spoilt by Sky sticking adverts in all over the place - probably about 15 minutes of adverts for an hours program. I wonder if a lot of people will just buy it on DVD ?




Well that is how it was made:)
Granted SKY's placement of ads were not in the positions that FOX would have broadcast them but it was the BBC who broadcast the show in a format it was not intended to be seen in :)

Having said that who wouldn't want SKY1 to go advert free and get rid of the DOG, it may not bring in any new subscribers but it would be a kick up the a**e for other broadcasters.

I refused to watch ALIAS on Bravo due to the onscreen clutter and 4:3 screening, the adverts were not an issue but it was certainly nice to sit and watch the DVD boxset over a week:)
So I expect many people did just wait and buy the 24 season3 boxset.
 

Starburst

Distinguished Member
thirst said:
I can't see that E4 will ever go free and I would imagine that Sky One doesn't mind losing shows to E4 because it's shown on digital pay television.




I think the Guardian article stating a desire to go FTA by the end of they year kinda makes it inevitable that E4 will be free:)

It will be interesting to see if they continue to spend the big money and purchase both FTA and PAY rights for their US imports to prevent other broadcasters from getting first run rights.
After all I am sure that was the reason E4 was launched as to provide a vehicle for Friends and ER bought at great expense since the SKY1 screenings were culling over a million viewers from the CH4 broadcasts and hitting the advert revenue.
 

Flimber

Distinguished Member
Starburst said:
...

...it was the BBC who broadcast the show in a format it was not intended to be seen in :)

...

Not necessarily true but could be interpreted that way.

For a show which is all about tension, having ads dropped in every few minutes (along with Sky's On Screen Garbage) absolutely kills it dead for me (though the Beeb OSG'd some of their screenings too, IIRC). I watched S1&2 on the Beeb and thought it was ace, I haven't bothered with S3 or 4 for the reason just given. I'd imagine there to be more tension in a programme called "Tommy Walshes Twelve Favourite Ways to Hang a Washing Line" than might be found in 24 on Sky.

Mike.
 

Starburst

Distinguished Member
Flimber said:
Not necessarily true but could be interpreted that way.

For a show which is all about tension, having ads dropped in every few minutes (along with Sky's On Screen Garbage) absolutely kills it dead for me (though the Beeb OSG'd some of their screenings too, IIRC). I watched S1&2 on the Beeb and thought it was ace, I haven't bothered with S3 or 4 for the reason just given. I'd imagine there to be more tension in a programme called "Tommy Walshes Twelve Favourite Ways to Hang a Washing Line" than might be found in 24 on Sky.

Mike.



24 was made for US network television which is as polluted with ads to the same extent as ours is, it was devised as to fit in a one hour timeslot which allowed for adverts. The difference being that the writers/director would have been aware of the needs of FOX and created the story with specific breaks in mind. That is why the SKY scheduling of adverts always seemed at times very wrong because they tend to go in pre-determined times regardless of what is actually happening although it's never mid karate chop, you know what I mean though:)
From what I read the BBC did get hold of some additional footage that wasn't in the US version to pad out each episode, perhaps someone who knows for sure could confirm that?

So yes you could say that the BBC had a version that was more "right" for there style of presentation but no denying that 24 was made to have adverts inserted into each episode (barring the premieres which were ad free and sponsered by FORD).

I understand what you mean but adverts take 10 seconds to FF through and I've lived with them all my TV viewing life so they really don't bother me.
DOGs are a pain in the a**e but like you say even some 24 eps on the BBC digital channels had them, one I can put up with but two or even three are just taking the p**s.

I would love all televison to be advert free but I would settle for all PAY television to be ad free, the BBC can do it and in essence they are PAY tv but without the security (although they can count on baliffs, cops and the courts to enforce their demands).
:)
 
T

thirst

Guest
Starburst said:
I think the Guardian article stating a desire to go FTA by the end of they year kinda makes it inevitable that E4 will be free:)

It will be interesting to see if they continue to spend the big money and purchase both FTA and PAY rights for their US imports to prevent other broadcasters from getting first run rights.
After all I am sure that was the reason E4 was launched as to provide a vehicle for Friends and ER bought at great expense since the SKY1 screenings were culling over a million viewers from the CH4 broadcasts and hitting the advert revenue.

I can't see how they can go free to air and continue to spend huge sums on US imports. Maybe if they go down the BBC three route of making their own cheaper programming but I can't see them affording the same amount of expensive US shows for first runs in the UK.

Flimber said:
Not necessarily true but could be interpreted that way.

For a show which is all about tension, having ads dropped in every few minutes (along with Sky's On Screen Garbage) absolutely kills it dead for me (though the Beeb OSG'd some of their screenings too, IIRC). I watched S1&2 on the Beeb and thought it was ace, I haven't bothered with S3 or 4 for the reason just given. I'd imagine there to be more tension in a programme called "Tommy Walshes Twelve Favourite Ways to Hang a Washing Line" than might be found in 24 on Sky.

Mike.


I know exactly what you mean about adverts Mike but like starburst said it takes very little time to fast-forward through advert breaks, which is exactly what I do all the time. I never really watch live television because of advertising saving me 17 minutes, minus the time it takes to skip the advert breaks, every hour!

Starburst said:
I would love all televison to be advert free but I would settle for all PAY television to be ad free, the BBC can do it and in essence they are PAY tv but without the security (although they can count on baliffs, cops and the courts to enforce their demands).
:)


I'm sure everybody would love to watch advert free television for all PAY television but Sky is never going to do that because of all of the lost revenue it would miss.
 

Starburst

Distinguished Member
thirst said:
I'm sure everybody would love to watch advert free television for all PAY television but Sky is never going to do that because of all of the lost revenue it would miss.





I honestly think it can be done.
SKY as a whole only gets around 10% of it's revenue from advertising and a lot of that will be sports based. SKY1 could still use program sponsership but lose the adverts perhaps leaving MIX to bring in a bit of ad revenue.

I guess it will be all down to revenue but there is status and pride (plus potential marketing advantages) to be had for a company like SKY to prove that the BBC are not the only ones that can go without adverts with a multi-billion pound budget:)
 

Starburst

Distinguished Member
thirst said:
I can't see how they can go free to air and continue to spend huge sums on US imports. Maybe if they go down the BBC three route of making their own cheaper programming but I can't see them affording the same amount of expensive US shows for first runs in the UK.




They may have too.
There is no doubt that Friends and ER on SKY1 was damaging CH4's advertising revenues for those two programs. If they allow PAY broadcasters to get first run rights for any or all of CH4's FTA programming then that will dilute their potential return/profits.
It could be that they buy FTA and PAY rights but sell the PAY rights on to smaller channels but with only second run rights in the manner Five has done with some content.
 

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